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Old 12-06-2012, 10:35 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Treats and clicks are not needed forever. Once a dog is trained you can stop using them.


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Old 12-06-2012, 10:36 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manolomom View Post
Yes. That is a prong collar. Itís a training tool; she wonít be using it for the next 15 years, just the next five weeks.
If he was such a good trainer he should be able to train a freaking 3 pound dog WITHOUT a prong or choke collar.

If he was such a good trainer he wouldn't have to use negative correction to get results.

You can train with positive methods WITHOUT treats or clickers.

I'd never do anything to hurt my dogs. It breaks their trust in humans no matter how "well behaved" they are. That is terrible.



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Old 12-06-2012, 10:38 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grace'sMom View Post
If he was such a good trainer he should be able to train a freaking 3 pound dog WITHOUT a prong or choke collar.

If he was such a good trainer he wouldn't have to use negative correction to get results.

You can train with positive methods WITHOUT treats or clickers.

I'd never do anything to hurt my dogs. It breaks their trust in humans no matter how "well behaved" they are. That is terrible.



Very well said Tori. It's very disturbing.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:42 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Even police K-9 units are moving away from prong/slip ring training and going to positive reinforcement. You may want to search for information on Steve White and the results that he and others are now having training police dogs using positive reinforcement. He does not recommend any sort of boarding type training because it is usually based on fear and punishment, not positive reinforcement.

I hope your puppy is safe and healthy at the end of this experience.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:47 PM   #45 (permalink)
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You absolutely do not need to use treats/clickers forever! Sadie and I have been working on her commands for only 3 weeks now and she is already doing them with no treats, just verbal praise. She may not be perfect but I enjoy the time we spend training together. It's so rewarding.

These little fluffs are so eager to please that it seems ridiculous to use negative reinforcement and prong collars.

Even kids/babies respond better to positive reinforcement than negative reinforcement. There is research to back this up.


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Old 12-06-2012, 11:33 PM   #46 (permalink)
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I've been reading this and feeling so sad. I was reluctant to say anything because my Lucy isn't the most well-behaved dog on the face of the earth. But I keep looking at the photo on the original post. What a sweet innocent little unsuspecting thing. 5 weeks will feel like forever to her. And, like others, I wouldn't even use a regular collar on a dog this little. I used a collar on my Gladie, who was about 25 lbs., before I knew better and switched to a harness, and I've always felt that it contributed to her back/neck problems. I would NEVER use any kind of collar for walking a tiny little Malt. But, much like parents who insist that physical punishment is the way to go, I doubt this poster will change her mind.
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Old 12-06-2012, 11:46 PM   #47 (permalink)
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I have never seen a compassionate owner use a prong collar on a Maltese. I read his website where he boasts about not having any formal education in dog training. I also see that he isn't a part of an recognized dog training organization like APDT. His methods scare me, particularly for a small dog. To me, it's analogous to leaving a baby with an abusive adult as a day care provider for five weeks. Yes, a child may do whatever he asked but at what price? I really have no interest in seeing any videos of what is learned this way... it would be painful to me to see it, just like when I saw Cesar Milan kicking a dog into submission. The end doesn't justify the means to me. I wish you well and pray that your little one will be alright for the rest of her life.
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Old 12-07-2012, 12:25 AM   #48 (permalink)
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This is apalling! Bibu doesn't always sit on command, barks at me when he wants something or is hungry and chases rabbits freely without being stopped. Now, would I trade his safety/health in to make him my personal robot...HECK NO! I agree training to an extent is necessary for some people because it makes things easier when traveling etc. I also agree special training is necessary for companion or search and rescue animals. What I disagree with is when people see dogs as robots rather than little living companions/soulmates and would trade their health, safety, mental stability, etc. in for 5 weeks to get a robot in exchange. If you want a robot, go buy one and save your dog from irreparable damage.
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Old 12-07-2012, 12:33 AM   #49 (permalink)
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P.S. - "A client who hires me when a dog is 8 weeks old will have a dog that is fully trained at 6 months of age" (Solid K-9 Training).

No dog should be in a boarding facility at 8 weeks of age. They shouldn't even leave their mother's side until at least 12 weeks of age! It's all questionable if you ask me...

Solid K-9 Training. Retrieved from dog trainers
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:07 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Samantha, I don't think anyone is saying anything to make you feel bad, but are just concerned for your baby. You said you come here to learn and everyone is just trying to help you see how dangerous this method of "teaching" is. Originally, I had seen the picture from my phone. Then, when someone said something about a choke collar, I came to look at the picture bigger on the computer and read all the replies. I think you want to do the best for your baby, but I don't think you have learned what that is yet and are just going with what you know and have done in the past. Please keep an open mind about what everyone is trying to tell you. Please!!! I had a yorkie whose trachea would collapse and it's a scary thing to watch, not knowing if he was going to be able to breathe again or not. He never even wore a collar or had any other kind of injuries that could cause it. But in using the type of collars mentioned in this thread, you are just asking for it to happen...or worse. Like others have said, treats and clickers are just for the initial training period - not forever. Just as the punishment your guy uses is just for the training. There are laws against animal cruelty and I think these same laws should also apply to the type of place you're taking your dogs to. It's just downright animal abuse!! My heart is breaking for what you're about to consciously put that adorable, innocent, unsuspecting, trusting baby through. PLEASE don't do it! Please change your mind! Being away from you for so long is bad enough, but to put him through this torture is just horrible.
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