Does this count as animal abuse?

[CloudClan]

Originally Posted by LJSquishy

He doesn't use food in training -- and it works. Food lures can be great, and I know you wean them away, but if I can get the same results without food that is even better.

Why is it better? I don't get the logic here. What is better about not using food and instead using negative reinforcement?

I have trained most of my dogs through at least basic obedience classes and several on to competitive obedience with titles. Most of those titles can not be completed with food in your pocket, but you can sure bet I rewarded my dogs with food payments along the way during the learning process and I don't see anything wrong with training with reward based training. But I do see a LOT wrong with training based on negative reinforcement when it is unnecessary especially of the variety that this idiot and his kind use.

I see nothing in his methods that make him a good trainer. He does have some of the same tricks decent trainers have been using for decades to get results, but that is just copying others success. There is nothing unique in what he does in that way. Even his negative tool kit is really just a copy of what others have done and what has been discredited by experts who study canine learning. This idiot has no formal training, just a lot of arrogance and ignorance.

The experts favor reward based training. Here is a nice article about rewards that include food, but also play, praise and petting: Food Rewards in Dog Training

[maggieh]

Even police and military dogs are being successfully trained using positive reinforcement and reward rather than prong/choker collars and punishment. If you google "Steve White" and police dog training, you'll see someone who many consider an expert in the field of training those types of dogs. There was an article about him in WDJ a couple of years ago.

[pippersmom]

I would never ever ever send my dog to this man. I want my dog to so what I ask him because he wants to please Mommy and see me smile and praise him and tell him what a good boy he is, and yes maybe he even gets a little treat, but this is so much better than having your dog do what you want because he is afraid of you and afraid he will get hurt if he doesn't do what you want. I would never want my dog to be afraid of me. The fear on that little guys face in the picture is heartbreaking!

[Snowball Pie's Mommi]

Originally Posted by Furbabies mom

I had to back and look at his Facebook. It makes me sad to see that little baby there. All those huge dogs around is frightening! In all his pics you see dogs Everywhere and kids Everywhere!! It looks like a big chaotic mess!

Deborah, I know this is not true ... but, for some reason, you are listed as a friend on this jerk's site ... with a "like" Your picture from SM is there, so I just wanted to alert you to this so that if you wish to do so, you can delete it.

For some time after seeing precious and innocent Emme sent off to this abusive, unsafe, and unhealthy environment, I have wondered what we can do. And, I am stunned to see Manolo was sent back there! If one goes back and reads the OP's thread ... one will see that she praised how well trained Manolo was after living with that monster who calls himself a dog trainer. So, why was this poor fluff baby sent back there??

I know we are not supposed to judge ... but, I have seen pictures of the young lady who is supposed to care for and be the parent of Manolo and Emme. (note all of her pictures are no longer on her threads). She is a beautiful looking young lady ... but, it appears as though she has other interests that might not be putting the welfare of the fluff babies first. God forgive me if I am wrong.

So, what can we do? Victoria Stillwell has already been sent a message by one of our caring members. I can send her one, too.

I like Sue's idea about the news media. Sue, does your son at CBS have any connections ... or, perhaps know anyone in Rhode Island that can bring this story to the attention of the public? Personally, I would love to see someone track down the vet's who must know about this guy. I'd love to see them on TV explaining how they can support this guy's business.

This guy is deleting FB comments that ask him legitimate questions ... but, questions that he obviously does not like. So, obviously he won't take phone calls or questions on his radio show from people who are concerned about his abusive practices.

I feel sick looking at the pictures of Emme and Manolo. My Snowball cannot handle being in the snow ... he starts shaking. I know some Malt's love the snow. But, for Manolo to be forced to be in that down position in the snow ... and, God ony knows for how long ... is just not right. Look at that poor fluff baby's face. Not only in that picture ... but, with the other huge dogs.

So, instead of just talking about it ... what can we do to make a difference? I am afraid that in the end, someone might complain about this thread behind closed doors, and yet another thread will be closed down, just like the first one. I hope not. My heart goes out to these innocent fluff babies ... I cannot imagine how they are not being mentally and physically abused by this person who calls himself a dog trainer.

So, I ask again ... what can we do to make a difference for the safety and welfare of these innocent creatures who are obviously being abused?

[Leila'sMommy]

That is so cruel! Excuse me for saying this, but that guy needs to have his balls frozen in snow while wearing one of his collars and that wouldn't be enough for what he deserves for torturing these innocent dogs! I had to stop going to his site to check on Emme because it upset me so much.


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[cynthia's]

I have one word for this - Disgusting!!!

[pippersmom]

[QUOTE=Snowball Pie's Mommi;2111088]Deborah, I know this is not true ... but, for some reason, you are listed as a friend on this jerk's site ... with a "like" Your picture from SM is there, so I just wanted to alert you to this so that if you wish to do so, you can delete it.

I find if posting from a phone or tablet, anything with a touch screen, it's really really easy to unknowingly hit "like". I've done it before.

[Snowball Pie's Mommi]

[quote=pippersmom;2111118]

Originally Posted by Snowball Pie's Mommi

Deborah, I know this is not true ... but, for some reason, you are listed as a friend on this jerk's site ... with a "like" Your picture from SM is there, so I just wanted to alert you to this so that if you wish to do so, you can delete it.

I find if posting from a phone or tablet, anything with a touch screen, it's really really easy to unknowingly hit "like". I've done it before.

I know ... it's happened to me, too.

[Furbabies mom]

Yikes!!!? I certainly do not Like this at all!! Thanks for letting me know!!!

[Furbabies mom]

I didn't see me in his friends list, but I saw Celeta(Steve's mom) on it. I know she!s not fond of this guy either! Maybe anyone that checks out his Facebook page is automatically listed as 'Liked" as a friend.