# No Annual Secret Buddy Event



## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

I was informed by Yung this morning that I should not have gone forward with this as I had not talked to the moderators about the idea. The moderators are now *CONSIDERING* whether or not to *ALLOW* us to hold this event.

I wasn't aware that we needed the moderators' approval for voluntary events such as this, Secret Santa, Rescue Raffle, games that people like Daisy G have put together, etc.

Each of my SM friends are very dear to me, however, SM seems to be changing and, imho, not necessarily for the better.

Thank you all for letting me be a part of the SM community, however, at this time, I feel that I must say goodbye to SM.

If the moderators finally approve the event and someone else wants to run it, I will give you everything that I have received and the list of emails, etc. Just email me.

Goodbye for now. Remember, I'm on Facebook, so those that want to keep up with me can do so there. 

Hugs,

Lynn, Lacie and Tilly


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## casa verde maltese (Apr 7, 2007)

The rescue raffle is really good and benefits Maltese Rescue - I am surprised that the moderators would not think that is something a Maltese Website should do? So, I sincerely hope that's not the case.

We might not be able to have Secret Santa? That's really sad. 

sigh..

see you on Facebook, Lynn.


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## elly (Sep 11, 2006)

I hate change :angry: I am very sad that so many great people are leaving SM, see you on Facebook


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## njdrake (Apr 23, 2007)

Lynn, you can't leave!! You're such a big part of SM! I hope you change your mind. :crying: 
Is this a new rule? Does this mean we won't be doing SS or the raffles? I loved both and can't understand why this would be a problem. You did all the work for both and made sure it ran smooth. I just cant understand why it would need approved if the site has nothing to do with it. Is everything going to be censored? I even loved (and miss) Daisy's silly bingo games, they were fun and I think everyone enjoyed them. I'm another one that hates change too. Why change things when it's great? 
This makes me so so sad. :crying 2: 
Lynn, we love you and thank you for all the work you've done to make things fun and to bring poeple together. 
I'll see you on facebook too.


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

Hopefully we'll be provided with a list of what we can and cannot do here anymore. 

One could almost get the feeling that some "house cleaning" of members is happening here. And sadly some of our very good friends are being weeded out to make way for a new and different kind of forum.

:yucky: :thmbdn: 


Lynn is one of the nicest people anyone could ever hope to meet.... 


I better stop now.... 

EDIT: I just came back because this has upset me so much. Do you realize Lynn was ONLY doing all this extra work to make Spoiled Maltese fun again??


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## CeeCee's Mom (Sep 14, 2006)

I really think Yung should give us an explanation as to what is going on..........please. Lynn has done a lot of work on these projects and to just say it can't be allowed anymore is something we all need to discuss. We are the forum. Without us there would be no forum. Bring it to us to vote on.........We have to count for something, don't you think???


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## LUCY N PETS (Apr 21, 2009)

Oh, no not you to Lynn, please stick with us I am sure they will realize that they are not doing any good and only harming our great site. I hate losing so many good members and I am sure lots more will leave if we are being scolded and told what we can or can't do on our own time. If there are rules then we should be told about them now not after a situation arises to their disliking. What are our rules to obey? Do we have to run it through you on everything we do and say on this forum? Haven't you ever heard of free speech?


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## angel's mom (Feb 14, 2007)

That is CROCK!!!!!!!!!! What is the harm in the group of people doing something fun??? Why does that have to be approved? What difference does it make to the owners. They are out nothing. I hate to see all our members leaving, even though we can stay in contact on FB. It is the members, those very members that have made SM what it is. 

This is just crazy! Did I, by mistake, get on that other forum, the one where many people came from because of this very type of restrictions and censorship?????

How many times were we told that "NOTHING WILL CHANGE"????


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## jenniferhope423 (Jun 25, 2007)

I am very upset that SM seems to be changing and not for the better in my opinion. I don't usually comment on these types of things but I have known Lynn since I became a member here in SM and she has always been the nicest person and I hate to see her go. I hate to say that if things continue on like they are then I am certain that I will no longer be a part of SM any more.


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

*Yung loved the idea of the buddy exchange but he just wanted the opportunity to look over the rules first. That's all there is to it. 

Whenever a site's members are asked to participate and spend money, donate, etc., it is customary for the owner/admin to give approval and be involved in setting/approving the guidelines. We did this with the first Secret Santa, if you will recall, just as we do with solicitations for donations... they have guidelines and have to be approved.

Yung wrote a very nice PM to Lynn just to say that he wanted to look over the rules and would then put the thread back. 

I really don't think it is fair to misrepresent what he said and what his intention was. I think we are bringing drama in where there really should be none.*


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

I'll see you over at Facebook, Lynn. 

BTW, if any of you are on FB please feel free to friend me: Suzan Robertson, Atlanta.


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## mom2bijou (Oct 19, 2006)

Oh gosh...Lynn please don't leave! You were only putting this together as a way to make SM fun and get everyone connecting with members new and old. Let the rules get the stamp of approval and let's move on with the event! I can't imagine anyone better running and organizing our gift exchanges! You are a major part of our SM family and I know I"m not alone with saying that I hope you will stay! rayer: rayer:


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## CeeCee's Mom (Sep 14, 2006)

I don't think the problem was with Yung being mean or rude Sher. It was that it had to have approval after all this time. He's gotta know that it just seemed like he was going backwards because she was approved or we could not have been doing it and it did not go over well, no matter how sweet the email was. Yes, we got bent out of shape because a good member was upset and leaving us. It seems like we just care about each other very much. Lynn, please do not leave because you are such a good manager of this and we could NOT do without you.


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## donnad (Aug 22, 2006)

Lynn, please don't leave...it would not be the same without you.


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## Administrator (Sep 22, 2009)

I am shocked and extremely disappointed that this thread was started in the first place. I keep reading about how everyone wants all the drama to stop on SM and then there are threads like this one. 

Please allow me to clear a few things up:

1. At NO TIME did I say to Lynn that this initiative was not allowed. In fact, I clearly stated to her that Sher, Joe and myself are in favor of it.

2. The purpose of me moving the original thread and sending Lynn a PM was so I could take some time to go over the guidelines of the initiative. 

3. I clearly explained to Lynn that the admins/mods do AT THE VERY LEAST need to be informed of these initiatives prior to them being communicated to the community. In this case, Lynn's idea was great and terrific and one that we all support. However, suppose another member had an idea that they felt strongly about and posted on the boards in the same manner without informing the admins/mods. What happens when that initiative is not so well supported by the community? Should that thread be removed? Or do we allow it to stay on?

The whole point of my communication to Lynn was to do this in a manner that would not set a precedence so that members in the future would go ahead an post any kind of special initiative they want to. It is important that stuff like this is reviewed by the mods/admins first so that we can see if they align with the values of this community BEFORE it is posted up.

If feelings are hurt, I'm sorry -- it's not my intentions to hurt anyone's feeling. I don't know anyone here on a personal level so I cannot play favorites even if I wanted to. I am here to be fair across the board to every member. All this talk about how SM has changed and stuff like that is purely for the sake of drama. If there are rules posted around here, I invite everyone to have a look. I don't think they've changed at all. The mods/admins continue to moderate this community according to those rules. If there is something that we do that you do not agree with, a simple PM usually gets a dialogue going. Heck, you can be as rude as you want to me in a PM. I won't take it personally. If you're going to resort to taking your disagreement with someone publicly, at least get the facts correct.


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## Snowball Pie's Mommi (Oct 16, 2008)

QUOTE (Lacie's Mom @ Feb 2 2010, 12:32 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880683


> I was informed by Yung this morning that I should not have gone forward with this as I had not talked to the moderators about the idea. The moderators are now *CONSIDERING* whether or not to *ALLOW* us to hold this event.
> 
> I wasn't aware that we needed the moderators' approval for voluntary events such as this, Secret Santa, Rescue Raffle, games that people like Daisy G have put together, etc.
> 
> ...


I am so upset hearing this. I was the one who suggested that Lynn's membership be upgraded by administration because of all the work she put into making the Secret Santa Buddy Exchange so special every year. I'm sure it was a special request ... but, some members did back me up on that. I wanted this for you, Lynn, because you have volunteered countless hours putting together ... and, lovingly doing so ... the SS exchange. In the past, I have seen people upgraded in their memberships. So, I feel I have a right to express my opinion on this one ... as I, and I am sure others have, in the past sent a special donation to help Spoiled Maltese. I don't know if we can get you to stay here on Spoiled Maltese, Lynn ... but, if so, I would be honored, on my own, to upgrade your membership.

And, if I sound dramatic about how I feel ... too bad. I'd rather be honest with my feelings ... than suck up to what others might want to hear. Gosh ... this doesn't sound like me at all ... but, this upsets me. Lynn has gone through so much personally with her beloved husband's serious health issues ... and, yet she has unselfishly and loving helped make Spoiled Maltese a fun and warm place to be. I deeply respect, admire, and love Lynn for that. 

I am not attacking Yung, or Joe, or the moderators ... I just want to make it clear how I feel about Lynn leaving Spoiled Maltese. Lynn, you are loved so much.


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

Yung, I'm sorry. Maybe we're being too hard on you because you don't know how the forum seems to have worked in the past. 

We've had many secret santas, raffles, games, contests, etc. all run by members of the forum. Those who wanted to participate did and those who didn't....didn't (never a problem that I know of). Whenever there was a question, Joe came right out and asked about it in a thread - And we talked about it openly.

Lynn had told me she wanted to do something to try to boost the moral on SM and decided to try to figure out something new to do, the last time I looked at the thread, suggestions were being tossed around....

Now it's a sad day when we start losing members like her. Sad indeed.

And Sher, please don't call me a drama queen. I've always liked you (and think you've done a good job) and I like everyone else here too, but when something happens that touches my heart. I'd rather call it expressing my pain, not drama.


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## ilovemymaltese (Oct 9, 2008)

No, Lynn, :crying 2: :crying 2: :crying 2: 

I don't know if anyone has noticed here, but we _*hate*_ it when anything changes. Please, no more changes. Pretty please with a cherry on top.


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## Orla (Jul 5, 2009)

oh no, don't leave Lynn!!  

I have only been a member here for 6 or 7 months and I love it here - its the most active maltese forum I've found. 
I have been given so much help here.

Lynn is such a great, helpful member! while I have been a member she has organised SS and now the annual gift buddy and from what I have read she has organised many more things OUT OF THE GOOD OF HER HEART!

the events like SS and the annual secret buddy event make SM stand out and make it such an amazing forum - its not like this is Lynns first time organising something like this, why question it?


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## Administrator (Sep 22, 2009)

QUOTE (Amby @ Feb 2 2010, 04:47 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880813


> its not like this is Lynns first time organising something like this, why question it?[/B]


Amby, who is questioning what Lynn is doing? NO ONE questioned what Lynn was trying to organize. If someone did, it wasn't the mods are admins.


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## Orla (Jul 5, 2009)

QUOTE (admin @ Feb 2 2010, 09:56 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880821


> QUOTE (Amby @ Feb 2 2010, 04:47 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880813





> its not like this is Lynns first time organising something like this, why question it?[/B]


Amby, who is questioning what Lynn is doing? NO ONE questioned what Lynn was trying to organize. If someone did, it wasn't the mods are admins.
[/B][/QUOTE]

you and mods are considering whether to let this go ahead - which is the same as questioning it.


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## Maglily (Feb 3, 2009)

Lynne, I don't know you very well but it's really a sad thing if you go, I'd miss you but you know what's right for you. Some of the changes here don't feel very nice at all.

edited to clarify...changes meaning people leaving.

Take care!
Brenda


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## coco (Sep 20, 2006)

QUOTE (admin @ Feb 2 2010, 03:26 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880771


> I am shocked and extremely disappointed that this thread was started in the first place. I keep reading about how everyone wants all the drama to stop on SM and then there are threads like this one.
> 
> Please allow me to clear a few things up:
> 
> ...



Sounds pretty darn reasonable to me. Thanks for your explanation.


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

Yung and Sher,

The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM. For either of you to chalk it up to "drama" is unfair given that the folks who have expressed their feelings here did not do so in any sort of mean or abusive way. Maybe it would have worked better, Yung, for you to have posted something like "Wow, I didn't intend my PM to Lynn to mean at all what she took it to mean. I have PM'd her again, we are working through this, and Lynn and I will keep you posted." Sher, for your part, the same applies. We all need to remember the meaning of "moderation" and "sensitivity" and not be so quick to use the word "drama".

MaryH


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (MaryH @ Feb 2 2010, 05:17 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880830


> Yung and Sher,
> 
> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM. For either of you to chalk it up to "drama" is unfair given that the folks who have expressed their feelings here did not do so in any sort of mean or abusive way. Maybe it would have worked better, Yung, for you to have posted something like "Wow, I didn't intend my PM to Lynn to mean at all what she took it to mean. I have PM'd her again, we are working through this, and Lynn and I will keep you posted." Sher, for your part, the same applies. We all need to remember the meaning of "moderation" and "sensitivity" and not be so quick to use the word "drama".
> 
> MaryH[/B]


 :goodpost:


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## Matilda's mommy (Jun 1, 2005)

I've been here almost 5 years, we have had ups and downs, but to many are leaving, I really think Joe, Sher and Yung need to pm members time to time and ask them their opinions, Lynn has always been so sincere and has given from the bottom of her heart. I am so dissapointed in what is going on. Please consider getting sm members ideas, maybe a thread on what WE might like. No we arien't drama queens here, we just want to be heard. No one likes change, this all can be done in such a way where we arien't offended.


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## njdrake (Apr 23, 2007)

QUOTE (MaryH @ Feb 2 2010, 05:17 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880830


> Yung and Sher,
> 
> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM. For either of you to chalk it up to "drama" is unfair given that the folks who have expressed their feelings here did not do so in any sort of mean or abusive way. Maybe it would have worked better, Yung, for you to have posted something like "Wow, I didn't intend my PM to Lynn to mean at all what she took it to mean. I have PM'd her again, we are working through this, and Lynn and I will keep you posted." Sher, for your part, the same applies. We all need to remember the meaning of "moderation" and "sensitivity" and not be so quick to use the word "drama".
> 
> MaryH[/B]


 :goodpost:


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## Cosy (Feb 9, 2006)

I don't get it. Why the confusion or uproar over this? We all know we have a new ownership
and with that comes getting to know the board and what has transpired here before. I'm 
surprised Lynn didn't check with Yung before suggesting this. Joe has always had a say in
whether something takes place or not. This isn't new. I haven't really seen any changes...
other than some may be leaving thinking it will change. Please, can't we all take a deep
breath and give the owners a chance to prove things will not change unless for the better?
I love this board and hate to see rumors or inuendoes take it's toll here.


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## CeeCee's Mom (Sep 14, 2006)

I don't have a problem with Sher at all in this matter. I find her to be kind, considerate, honest and she has an uncanny ability to cut to the chase. I was only upset that Lynn was leaving all her friends here and we love her and don't want her to leave. I love Sher too!! Just to let Lynn know how much we care and to please come back because we are all friends. I think Yung did say he was sorry in his post.....lets re-evaluate what we want and I for one, do NOT want to leave my friends at SM. I just could not do it because I have so many friends here. Lynn has been through a horrible time with her husband and I think she would miss us too. Please tell me you would miss all of us Lynn......I am trying to be funny here because I want Lynn back and all of this to end. After what I went through last night with my sister, I don't want to hold any kind of grudge against anyone.........


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

QUOTE (Cosy @ Feb 2 2010, 06:22 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880855


> I don't get it. Why the confusion or uproar over this? We all know we have a new ownership
> and with that comes getting to know the board and what has transpired here before. I'm
> surprised Lynn didn't check with Yung before suggesting this. Joe has always had a say in
> whether something takes place or not. This isn't new. I haven't really seen any changes...
> ...


I'm guessing Lynn didn't realize she had to get permission, neither would I. Joe always had a say, but he did it within the threads, making suggestions, thoughts, concerns, etc.


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

i hate to use this word, but.... seriously ??? for years now we have asked that members contact us with ideas like this, if for nothing else, so that we know what is going on, what is involved and what the "rules" for the event are, so that we are prepared for any questions or can resolve any problems and there is absolutely no harm in knowing the intent of something as the site owner or administrator, no matter who is spearheading it. 

fot instance, years ago, we had a raffle, a true raffle is illegal to hold in most states, we had to tweak it to stay in guidelines, that is when i started paying attention to what kind of contests, raffles, events we were holding, to do my best to protect SM and its members, I dont know of one time where I had to say no to anything and noone has ever had a problem sending me a PM and just making sure it was OK

it disappoints me that some jumped on the negativity bandwagon not knowing what was going on, all Yung was doing is what we have been doing for a LONG TIME! he, sher or myself NEVER ONCE considered saying no to this, as a matter of fact Sher PMd me that it looked like a great thing to do and unfortunately i did not have time to look at it last night, and now yung and Sher are getting blasted for something that I would have done and we have done without problem, for years!!!!!!!!!!!!

QUOTE


> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM. For either of you to chalk it up to "drama"[/B]


but alot of it is drama, i truely dont understand the unhappy, confused, edgy feel, and why people are screaming they are leaving SM, there has been minor change, there will be more change, again, nothing I havent or wouldnt have done, does everyone agree with everything i do, yung will do? no. but i can tell you from experience this is one of the best run forums on the webinet and you guys have a Saint and a voice in Sher, she has done more for SM that anyone gives her credit for, to see the reactions in this thread just baffle me

QUOTE


> you and mods are considering whether to let this go ahead - which is the same as questioning it.[/B]


Lynn was NEVER told this was a bad idea, NEVER told it wouldnt happen, I will not appologize for us taking an interest in something where personal information between members was going to be shared, we need to know that, it's unfortunate that she took exception to it, and i too hope she hasnt left, we never questioned what she was doing and think its a great idea

QUOTE


> Sounds pretty darn reasonable to me. Thanks for your explanation. [/B]


 :thumbsup: and for me to agree with coco means alot :biggrin:


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## camfan (Oct 30, 2006)

QUOTE (2MaltMom @ Feb 2 2010, 07:00 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880874


> QUOTE (Cosy @ Feb 2 2010, 06:22 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880855





> I don't get it. Why the confusion or uproar over this? We all know we have a new ownership
> and with that comes getting to know the board and what has transpired here before. I'm
> surprised Lynn didn't check with Yung before suggesting this. Joe has always had a say in
> whether something takes place or not. This isn't new. I haven't really seen any changes...
> ...


I'm guessing Lynn didn't realize she had to get permission, neither would I. Joe always had a say, but he did it within the threads, making suggestions, thoughts, concerns, etc.
[/B][/QUOTE]

It never would have crossed my mind to get permission either. Just saying!

BTW, sort of off topic, but who is Jung anyway? :brownbag: lol. I've been here for 3 years, took several months off, and things have changed quite a bit. 

I know that a forum needs to have some hard and fast rules in some cases, but in instances like this--let's remember that the forum is the PEOPLE and they should at least be heard if they are feeling like something is askew (sp?)

Not taking sides. Just saying  Lynn, don't go!!


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (2MaltMom @ Feb 2 2010, 08:00 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880874


> I'm guessing Lynn didn't realize she had to get permission, neither would I. Joe always had a say, but he did it within the threads, making suggestions, thoughts, concerns, etc.[/B]


most of the time yes, however, yung is new, he's not the devil, he's still learning me and Sher, he's still learning maltese, he is still learning SM, he is still learning the members here, what we do, when we do it, how we've done it in thepast, all that was needed here was a little patience, is that too much to ask? me and Sher have pushed him to be more involved and he has taken the bull by the horns, he didnt do anything wrong here, nothing was denied, there was no great debate about what Lynn was doing, it was just a different way for it to happen, "permission" so to speak isnt what is required here, its just letting us know, we should have input and the ability to agree or disagree with aspects of it, before its presented to all members, i honestly dont think that is too much to ask

thats not "change", its been that way for a looooooong time

Joe


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (camfan @ Feb 2 2010, 08:21 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880880


> BTW, sort of off topic, but who is Jung anyway? :brownbag: lol. I've been here for 3 years, took several months off, and things have changed quite a bit.
> 
> I know that a forum needs to have some hard and fast rules in some cases, but in instances like this--let's remember that the forum is the PEOPLE and they should at least be heard if they are feeling like something is askew (sp?)
> 
> Not taking sides. Just saying  Lynn, don't go!![/B]


yung is the new admin employeed by the owners of the site, me and sher also still run/handle day to day operations

I agree, the PEOPLE should be heard, and we listen better than a majority of sites out there, we allow things like this when other sites dont, we have no inclination what so ever to deny things like this, never, never have, we just need to know about them, thats all :thumbsup:


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (Casa Verde Maltese @ Feb 2 2010, 01:37 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880686


> The rescue raffle is really good and benefits Maltese Rescue - I am surprised that the moderators would not think that is something a Maltese Website should do? So, I sincerely hope that's not the case.
> 
> We might not be able to have Secret Santa? That's really sad.[/B]


NOONE, NOONE, NOONE has ever said that, we have never denied things like this, SM has done more for Maltese rescue than any Maltese site in the world, and more in the way for it's own members with exchanges and contests than that of many many many forums combined, i challenge anyone to prove me otherwise and SM will continue to do it


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## casa verde maltese (Apr 7, 2007)

QUOTE (Joe @ Feb 2 2010, 05:39 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880894


> QUOTE (Casa Verde Maltese @ Feb 2 2010, 01:37 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880686





> The rescue raffle is really good and benefits Maltese Rescue - I am surprised that the moderators would not think that is something a Maltese Website should do? So, I sincerely hope that's not the case.
> 
> We might not be able to have Secret Santa? That's really sad.[/B]


NOONE, NOONE, NOONE has ever said that, we have never denied things like this, SM has done more for Maltese rescue than any Maltese site in the world, and more in the way for it's own members with exchanges and contests than that of many many many forums combined, i challenge anyone to prove me otherwise and SM will continue to do it 
[/B][/QUOTE]

Whew, Joe & Yung & Sher
I know that moderating a forum this large is a great responsibility. Thanks for taking the time to answer questions and address our concerns.


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## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

I didn't mean to start such a controversy here, but I do want to clarify a few things.

1. I did not run this by Yung, Joe or Sher because, in my mind, it was a "take off" of the Secret Santa Gift Exchange that we do annually and which had previously been OK'd.

2. The Guidelines that were put together were from members suggestions and not from me personally. The Guidelines are almost exactly the same as those that are used for Secret Santa. The SS Guidelines were approved 2 years ago when I created them, so, because the only real changes in the guidelines where those that would not make sense because it wasn't Secret Santa, there was virtually no change.

3. Yung did not tell me that we could not hold this event, just that the moderators and administrators would need to review and approve prior to us going forward.

4. I decided because of Yung's pm that I would not go forward with running the event, however, once the moderators and administrators had an opportunity to review and approve the event and guidelines, someone else here on SM would be able to run the event and I would provide the info that I had already received.

5. The Privacy Issues regarding the exchange of personal information is EXACTLY the same as for Secret Santa. The wording in the guidelines is identical to the wording in the Secret Santa guidelines, so I'm confused about Joe's concerns on this one.

6. The pm that Jung sent to me was "nice" but it set the wrong tone, in my mind. Had Jung simply said that he liked the idea but just wanted to review the Guidelines that had been posted prior to our going forward with the event, it would have been much nicer. There was much more to the email that annoyed me. Specifically that SM had rules in place that REQUIRED us to run ideas by the Administrators and Moderators. I wasn't aware of that and may have missed it someone on SM, but since I'm the only one that has been organizing SM events for the past few years, I doubt that I missed it.

The choice for me not to coordinate the event was solely mine -- however, I still don't know if the Admin and Moderators have approved the event to happen.

I love each of my SM friends dearly and consider you to be a part of my extended family. Maybe at a later time, I will feel better about SM and return, but not right now.

Two other things before I say goodbye:

1. About a month ago I started a thread in the contributors only section asking why many of our old time members had left SM. Several of you read and responded to the post. My original post was about how we might go about luring these people back to SM. The Secret Buddy event type is usually fun and I had hoped that it might lure others back here. After the thread in the contributos section was posted, Sher wrote me asking me WHY I had started that type of post as some of the comments that members made were hurtful. My intend about starting the thread wasn't to be hurtful to anyone but to see what others thought was the reason that people were leaving. It was closed by Joe, his decision not my request, soon after I received Sher's pm. I felt as if we were going to be censored to voice any concerns we had about the direction the forum was taking. I felt as if Joe, Yung and Sher didn't want to hear what SM members thought. I was going to leave SM at that time, but decided to give it one more try. It didn't seem to work out well, and I'm sorry as I will miss what this forum has been about.

2. Perhaps I'm extremely touchy at this point as Jerry, my dh, is back in the hospital at the transplant clinic with very little time left unless a heart can be found for him. So I just didn't want to deal with additional hassles concerning something I thought would be fun.

I may later look back on my decision to leave SM and change my mind, but, for the time being, I just feel very sad about the changes that we all feel are happening on SM. Joe, Sher and Yung may not want to look at the reality, but, obviously I'm not the only one that feels this way about SM.

I'm also MAD AS CAN BE that Yung (or anyone else here) has said that I was trying to create DRAMA. I have enough DRAMA in my life without having to create more. I just wanted everyone to know that I would no longer be on SM and the reason. I did not say anything bad about SM, Yung, Joe or Sher in my post, but I cannot, in good conscience, allow misunderstandings about what happened and will not allow anyone to give a one sided point of view.


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE


> 5. The Privacy Issues regarding the exchange of personal information is EXACTLY the same as for Secret Santa. The wording in the guidelines is identical to the wording in the Secret Santa guidelines, so I'm confused about Joe's concerns on this one.[/B]


I didnt know that and yung didnt know that, until we looked at it, by yung moving the thread and PMing you about it was his way of taking the time to do it, i wasnt online nor had time to review it, he was trying to help

and yes it was approved from the beginning once yung was able to look at it and confer with us, i have done the exact same thing (in a different way) with Sher for many years, even before she became an admin, all it would have took was a few hours of patience and everything would have been back up as it would, the "drama" so to speak was the goodbye thread and the backlash from something that given a little tiime, never had to occur

QUOTE


> Specifically that SM had rules in place that REQUIRED us to run ideas by the Administrators and Moderators. I wasn't aware of that and may have missed it someone on SM, but since I'm the only one that has been organizing SM events for the past few years, I doubt that I missed it.[/B]


yes, its always been there, me and sher have discussed every single contest, raffle, special event that has been posted

QUOTE


> I felt as if we were going to be censored to voice any concerns we had about the direction the forum was taking.[/B]


i dont, nor have we ever censored opinions or concerns, that has nothing to do with when a thread is closed

QUOTE


> Perhaps I'm extremely touchy at this point as Jerry, my dh, is back in the hospital at the transplant clinic with very little time left unless a heart can be found for him. So I just didn't want to deal with additional hassles concerning something I thought would be fun.[/B]


your dh has been in my prayers from the beginning and will continue to be :grouphug:


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## LUCY N PETS (Apr 21, 2009)

Lynne I am so sorry to hear about your husband being in the hospital again and will say many, many prayers for him and also for you. Please let us know how he is doing and God bless you for all you have done for all of us you will truly be missed and hope you can return to us soon.

Hugs
Lucy


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

QUOTE (Joe @ Feb 2 2010, 07:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880879


> QUOTE





> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM. For either of you to chalk it up to "drama"[/B]


but alot of it is drama, i truely dont understand the unhappy, confused, edgy feel, and why people are screaming they are leaving SM, there has been minor change, there will be more change, again, nothing I havent or wouldnt have done, does everyone agree with everything i do, yung will do? no. but i can tell you from experience this is one of the best run forums on the webinet and you guys have a Saint and a voice in Sher, she has done more for SM that anyone gives her credit for, to see the reactions in this thread just baffle me
[/B][/QUOTE]


Joe,

In the initial discussion regarding the change of ownership, you yourself admitted to agonizing over the decision. For some people this forum is a place to come and learn about Maltese, for others it started that way and has become like an extended family. With so much strees in all of our everyday lives, and having SM as an outlet where one can let loose or let go of the everyday life, even the threat of change can be upsetting. Again, moderation and sensitivity go a long way. I'm not taking sides, not saying who is right or wrong, but another reality is that admins and moderators are "managers" and in life managers, for better or for worse, are held to a higher standard.

MaryH


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

QUOTE (MaryH @ Feb 2 2010, 08:35 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880933


> QUOTE (Joe @ Feb 2 2010, 07:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880879





> QUOTE





> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM. For either of you to chalk it up to "drama"[/B]


but alot of it is drama, i truely dont understand the unhappy, confused, edgy feel, and why people are screaming they are leaving SM, there has been minor change, there will be more change, again, nothing I havent or wouldnt have done, does everyone agree with everything i do, yung will do? no. but i can tell you from experience this is one of the best run forums on the webinet and you guys have a Saint and a voice in Sher, she has done more for SM that anyone gives her credit for, to see the reactions in this thread just baffle me
[/B][/QUOTE]


Joe,

In the initial discussion regarding the change of ownership, you yourself admitted to agonizing over the decision. For some people this forum is a place to come and learn about Maltese, for others it started that way and has become like an extended family. With so much strees in all of our everyday lives, and having SM as an outlet where one can let loose or let go of the everyday life, even the threat of change can be upsetting. Again, moderation and sensitivity go a long way. I'm not taking sides, not saying who is right or wrong, but another reality is that admins and moderators are "managers" and in life managers, for better or for worse, are held to a higher standard.

MaryH
[/B][/QUOTE]

:goodpost:


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (MaryH @ Feb 2 2010, 09:35 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880933


> Joe,
> 
> In the initial discussion regarding the change of ownership, you yourself admitted to agonizing over the decision. For some people this forum is a place to come and learn about Maltese, for others it started that way and has become like an extended family. With so much strees in all of our everyday lives, and having SM as an outlet where one can let loose or let go of the everyday life, even the threat of change can be upsetting. Again, moderation and sensitivity go a long way. I'm not taking sides, not saying who is right or wrong, but another reality is that admins and moderators are "managers" and in life managers, for better or for worse, are held to a higher standard.
> 
> MaryH[/B]


i wont disagree with any of this, the decision was very hard, one i think about every day, and I recognize and expect concern, but not panic and the lack of patience, open minds or understanding, SM never would have become what it did, or helped new owners, or helped rescues, or helped with donations for surgeries or gave each of us a shoulder to lean on, an ear to bend or the love we have shared and much much much more without "change", it has happened from day one, some good, some bad, but no matter what, SM has been there and will be here, it wont be for everyone, it wont please everyone, but it will be here, we lose sight that it's not just for us, it is for our fluff butts, those who need help and rescue, new owners who need guidence, and much more, some of the things we argue about or disagree on is but a small piece to the pie, only "we" can destroy what we have built here, not me, not yung, not new owners, not new software, but us, and how we go about what we love

yes, moderators and admins, managers as you say are held to different standards, unfortunatly it de-humanizes us to a degree, we become the face of right or wrong and not one of the "masses" like everyone else, we are critisized and often not given accolades of any sort for the things we do, the people we help or the time we spend, but, in the end, we are human, we have feelings, we try our best and are never, ever, out for anything other than what is best for everyone, and THAT is a no win situation

joe edit: haha, please excuse the many speeling errors :biggrin:


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## camfan (Oct 30, 2006)

QUOTE (Joe @ Feb 2 2010, 07:33 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880891


> QUOTE (camfan @ Feb 2 2010, 08:21 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880880





> BTW, sort of off topic, but who is Jung anyway? :brownbag: lol. I've been here for 3 years, took several months off, and things have changed quite a bit.
> 
> I know that a forum needs to have some hard and fast rules in some cases, but in instances like this--let's remember that the forum is the PEOPLE and they should at least be heard if they are feeling like something is askew (sp?)
> 
> Not taking sides. Just saying  Lynn, don't go!![/B]


yung is the new admin employeed by the owners of the site, me and sher also still run/handle day to day operations

I agree, the PEOPLE should be heard, and we listen better than a majority of sites out there, we allow things like this when other sites dont, we have no inclination what so ever to deny things like this, never, never have, we just need to know about them, thats all :thumbsup:
[/B][/QUOTE]

Oh, ok, Hi Yung! **waves**

Lynn--all my very best to your hubby right now--I'm sorry for his condition and I hope for the best. :grouphug: It would be nice, and probably good for you, to stick around here with your friends at this time--we're here for you!

I'll let you guys hash this out--I said my few words and hope everyone will stay put and feelings will all get worked out. :grouphug:


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## thefab5 (Feb 1, 2007)

Ok, I see everyones point! BUT!!!!!

I want to know one thing: why do we have to wear our feelings on our sleaves?

These fights seems to be about our feelings.....and sometimes just SOMETMES we need to take a step back 
and look at what this is really about. There are times to let our feeling go and times we need to take the feelings out!

It just seems that some get there feathers ruffled when it should not be about it personally........

that's my two cents....take it or leave it!


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## coco (Sep 20, 2006)

Sounds pretty darn reasonable to me. Thanks for your explanation. 

:thumbsup: and for me to agree with coco means alot :biggrin:

Well, I see the big grin, but I call them as I see them. Good thing you put that smiley on there, or I'd be really mad and run off with my tail between my legs. :HistericalSmiley: Sometimes we agree, and sometimes we haven't. At least you know where I stand on a subject. Frankly, this seems like much ado about nothing to me. I don't take part in all these things on SM because I've heard that sometimes the prizes don't arrive, gifts don't arrive, etc. I'm also not into giving my address, or personal info, to people I meet on the Internet. That being said, I still don't understand the big deal about this. Sounds like it should have been run by the powers that be, and then they'd refuse or allow. Simple as that. I'm bothered more about other things here than something like this. Rules are rules. Abide by them or don't be here. That's not hard to understand.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Lynn, you know I love you dearly and I will always be your friend and be 'on your side'. You and your DH are always in my prayers. I can't even begin to imagine the emotional turmoil and stress you have been under this past year. Not to mention the toll it takes on you physically. I truly hope that you can give yourself a little time and space and like you said, come back and maybe see things from a fresh perspective. We have all talked about how communication on the internet can be difficult because you don't have the facial expressions, tone of voice, etc to go by and a seemingly harmless statement can be taken in a completely wrong way. I know it's happened to me. Usually when I'm in a hurry and send something off that makes perfect sense to me, but not so much to the person receiving it who doesn't hear the unwritten words or meanings that were there in my mind when typing.

Coming from a background where I have had to take things that had at one time been a small, simple and friendly group, plan, etc to a larger scale I can totally understand why things need to be looked over by those in charge. And I also know that it has been this way for as long as I've been a member. It is often not because of the event or people involved in handling the event, but to think about the 'what if's', legalities, and possible future people who may not be someone that is well known and trusted who want to propose and run something. And the hardest part is when a dear friend who has been doing things faithfully and well needs to also abide by safeguards that are in place to protect the very thing we all love and are trying to help. Not because they really need to since they've been doing it forever and know how to do things within the guidelines, but because if someone else would want to do something and not go through the appropriate process, it could get really muddy when the old, "but she/he was able to do it that way" is thrown into the mix. Also, I'm sure we can all relate to learning what worked and didn't work on a particular project, as well as some problems or concerns that cropped up that we had not thought about. So it's just best to have the same guidelines/procedures apply to all each and every time.

As far as how SM has changed, I still have not been able to renew my SM Membership so I can't get into that section of the Forum so I don't know what all was shared. Maybe I'm a bit obtuse, but I really don't see a lot of change. I see that some people have left and I'm not sure why. I'm sure sometimes it was due to hurt feelings and disagreements. Perhaps with the mods and or ownership, but maybe with other members. Not everyone is going to get along. But for the most part, the people who have left were imo, the ones who liked to argue and debate a lot of things that really weren't posted for the sake of argument or debate. Which has actually made SM a more pleasant place to be for me personally. Now there are others who have left that I don't put in that category at all so please don't think I'm saying everyone who has left was an 'arguing debater'. lol The only other thing that I think has changed is that there were some who really got on a few about how to approach newbies who got their precious bundles of fluff from puppy mills or byb's, or brokers. And even though I think they were correct in how we need to approach that subject with newbies, it has unfortunately made us fearful to say anything to the point that there was a puppy broker who posed as a new mom and everyone was telling her she wasn't making the lady she got her fluff from in a bad light. So I finally questioned her right on the forum about whether the place she got the puppy from was indeed a broker. No one blasted me for that so I guess I did it in a kind and respectful manner. 

I just hope everyone can take a breath, drink a cup of tea (or Pat...maybe a margarita lol) and get back to having fun on SM.


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## Administrator (Sep 22, 2009)

QUOTE (MaryH @ Feb 2 2010, 05:17 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880830


> Yung and Sher,
> 
> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM.
> 
> MaryH[/B]


I'm still confused by all this talk about change. What has changed since the ownership change in terms of what is done on this site? The only change I can remember announcing is the change to a new forum software that is coming in the next couple of months. Aside from that, what has actually changed?


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (Crystal&Zoe @ Feb 2 2010, 11:12 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880988


> I just hope everyone can take a breath, drink a cup of tea (or Pat...maybe a margarita lol) and get back to having fun on SM.[/B]


 :chili:


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

QUOTE (admin @ Feb 2 2010, 10:15 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880992


> QUOTE (MaryH @ Feb 2 2010, 05:17 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=880830





> Yung and Sher,
> 
> The reality is that some people are edgy, some unhappy, some confused, with the changes that have taken place and continue to take place on SM.
> 
> MaryH[/B]


I'm still confused by all this talk about change. What has changed since the ownership change in terms of what is done on this site? The only change I can remember announcing is the change to a new forum software that is coming in the next couple of months. Aside from that, what has actually changed? 



[/B][/QUOTE]

The ownership change was a "biggie". Upcoming change to a new platform might or might not be another "biggie" depending on how smoothly it goes ... and hopefully it will go more smoothly than Farmville's last upgrade. :smpullhair: The only other change that I've noticed is the addition of some new emoticons. And while ownership and platform might be big changes for some, for me it was the new emoticons. So I'm going to sit back and ... opcorn: 

MaryH


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## 3Maltmom (May 23, 2005)

I'll never forget our first raffle. Yep, Raffle for Ringo. That was great, and Joe, you were awesome with the details, and
in making sure it all ran smoothly. You had questions, I wouldn't even have thought of asking. And we collected over $1,500,
with so few members at the time. Thanks for that, Joe. 


I've come up with some pretty lame ideas. Sher knows, as I always throw them by her first. She always comes back with
something that makes me think "duh, why didn't I think of that, boy that was a lame attempt". 

I won't even admit my latest brainstorm. Thanks Sher for keeping me out of legal trouble ~ :thmbup: :HistericalSmiley: 

And Joe, what can I say except :smootch: 

Now LBB says, let's not "look" back, let's "look" forward. :dothewave:


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## Katkoota (Feb 18, 2006)

I am better at reading right now than responding long ( not at home and using my cellphone but will try my best) 

I have to say that I agree with Brit (cosys mom ) Mary Ann ( cocos mommy ) crystal ( Zoe and Jetts mom ) and everyone who has similar thoughts about the Rules. Mods are doing their job. It is a normal procedure for anyone who is running a community in a right way as much as he/she can whether in real life or Internet forums. Yung, Joe and sher explained that they didn't ban the idea; it only had to go through a procedure of reviewing the guidlines, concepts and all. That is normal procedure. Maybe I am understanding this concept today better than how I used to before - in school; I always wondered why the little rules tiny little small and detailed procedures existed. Today since this is part of what my job is about at this period), I understand this so well. Just imagine if they did not exist. Wow it will be a mess. I also understand why some got upset about this specific issue. Lynn has been organizing the fun SS, it has been going well and everyone, including me, always had fun viewing and reading SS reveals. The new idea of yearly SM buddy is very similar. Getting it through the procedure of reviewing didn't seem necessary. 

But just like any other new activity, it has to go through the review ( normal procedure - mods are doing their job)

sorry to read that it upsetted some members - really hope that u will just amile about it tomorrow  

Lynn, I will keep u and ur hubby in my thoughts. I also really hope that u stick around in SM and continue organizing this fun idea of having a fun SM buddy for a year- who would do it better than u (((hugs))) previous SS were all sooooooo much fun and well made 
This one will also b so much fun. Snowy and Crystal can't join only because their mommy is not sure if she can keep up with it in her so busy life. Yes, I am around here in SM at least for an hour each day during this period, but trust me at another periods and more often, I don't even have the time to be on. It all depends on how life goes with me. If I wanted for my Malts to be involved, I want them to do it right: meet their deadlines without being late. Since I have dozen of other deadlines, better stick to enjoying everyone else reveals ^_^ 

I do believe that Joe sher and yung are trying their best here. To me, the biggest change that I notice is when members leave or start to post less or be around less. I just miss them. That's all. I didnt notice a very big change on how things are run here. Maybe bacause I sometimes just miss a lot lol 

generally speaking: Things no matter where u are or what you look at change that's for sure ( life itself is always changing) . No where is perfect. Heck, no one is perfect. But I believe that we should always focus/look at the possitive/good stuff about them And to be honest with u, I see A LOT of possitive things here in SM that makes the very little negatives (I honestly don't see the negatives clearly ) in this forum
I truely LOVE SM and Will always b thankful to SM because I got to meet u and your precious fluffs. We made some good friends here and already met a very good one in person, shared knowledge, info advice tips care .... Etc together - lots of good memories were shared together and others that we also sad. But we were always here for eachother - without SM all oof these werent going to happen. Again I say, I love SM and this will always be the place I will come to 2 Take a little break from my busy daily life, to be around these innocent fluffs, read the cute and funny stories and just have a good time 

although I haven't met u in person, MANY are really so dear to me here. 

Hugs 
kat


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

QUOTE (TheMalts&Me @ Feb 3 2010, 07:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=881104


> I am better at reading right now than responding long ( not at home and using my cellphone but will try my best)
> 
> I have to say that I agree with Brit (cosys mom ) Mary Ann ( cocos mommy ) crystal ( Zoe and Jetts mom ) and everyone who has similar thoughts about the Rules. Mods are doing their job. It is a normal procedure for anyone who is running a community in a right way as much as he/she can whether in real life or Internet forums. Yung, Joe and sher explained that they didn't ban the idea; it only had to go through a procedure of reviewing the guidlines, concepts and all. That is normal procedure. Maybe I am understanding this concept today better than how I used to before - in school; I always wondered why the little rules tiny little small and detailed procedures existed. Today since this is part of what my job is about at this period), I understand this so well. Just imagine if they did not exist. Wow it will be a mess. I also understand why some got upset about this specific issue. Lynn has been organizing the fun SS, it has been going well and everyone, including me, always had fun viewing and reading SS reveals. The new idea of yearly SM buddy is very similar. Getting it through the procedure of reviewing didn't seem necessary.
> 
> ...


 :goodpost: I agree with all Kat says here. I wouldn't run or moderate a forum if you offered me a million dollars.  And I don't even think our administrators get paid (correct me if I'm wrong) so I can just imagine how heart-wrenching this turmoil must be. I see all points of view and hope that after a cooling down period the hurt can go away. 
Lynn, I would miss you terribly if you leave. I consider you one of my friends, one heck or an organizer and would feel lost without you here cheering us on. We care about you and know this is an incredibly stressful time for you and want to be here for you. I have a FB account but I really don't use it much nor post much at all. Those people don't get our love of our fluffs so I really don't go there with Tyler stuff. We're all good people here who love our Malts and want to help those who are less fortunate and I've found solace, laughter and support when I've faced issues Malt and non-Malt related. 
I was thinking of an analogy: I have a close knit family who never really argue and certainly do not "not talk" to each other. I look at friends who have families who don't talk to each other and think, how sad. Life's too short. You can't get those moments back. I hope that my SM family will keep talking. :grouphug:


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## nostresstoday (Nov 10, 2009)

I clicked on this because I wanted to say that I'd like to be part of the Annual secret Buddy Event. 
I'm thankful that someone would want to organize it. :smheat: 
I'm new, and when I first read about it I thought...Now that is one organized thoughtful Maltese owner to organize it. She must be a saint. :aktion033: 

Please stay.

Darlene and Miley


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## godiva goddess (Nov 19, 2007)

Lynn, you were always such a wonderful and caring person, I will continue to keep you and Jerry in my prayers.


I have been w/ SM for more than 2 yrs and I dont personally see any change after the new Administration (Yung) took over. Granted, I do not post as often but I do not sense any changes that is detrimental to the function of SM. I think the new SM is actually quite good! Many thanks to Yung and Sher.

Regarding "disappearing SMers:" A valid reason can be that many SMers stopped posting on here b/c they don't have time!! LOL!! It can be as simple as that. Posting/Reading on forums is ALOT of work, and very time consuming. Many pp just do not have the luxury to read AND post often anymore. I use to post more but to be honest, now I am so busy at work, if I have "down time" the last thing I want to do is write some more novelas (lol) on SM b/c my brain is so tired.... :biggrin: I also think it is an INCORRECT assumption that people left SM b/c they like to" argue and debate" or some how, feelings got hurt in exchange. That is just specious reasoning. I think people who post on internet forums know that this is the nature of the beast, so to speak. People disagree, might get heated, so what, big deal! Move on....If longtime SMers leave, or stop posting, there is usually a more serious issue than "hurt feelings" over internet debates (lol). I keep in touch w/ some SMers who no longer post and none of them "left" b/c their feelings "got hurt" from some debate on SM...lol....It is only the internet, after all! Really not that serious. People who disagree do not need to become enemies. Actually, I find that disagreements can (and often do) bring two unlikely people together and forge friendships. Sometimes, we have the most respect for our "adversaries." I know that from my 2+ yrs on SM, I became friends with 3 SMers whom I "met" through "arguments!" LOL!! You know who you are! :smootch:


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## Orla (Jul 5, 2009)

So, will there be an annual secret buddy event if someone will organise it?
I have organised a secret santa on another forum and I would volunteer to organise such events here, however I think it would be very cheeky of me as I am a newish member.
So, I hope someone can organise it


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## roxybaby22 (Feb 25, 2009)

QUOTE (godiva goddess @ Feb 5 2010, 10:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=882360


> Lynn, you were always such a wonderful and caring person, I will continue to keep you and Jerry in my prayers.
> 
> 
> I have been w/ SM for more than 2 yrs and I dont personally see any change after the new Administration (Yung) took over. Granted, I do not post as often but I do not sense any changes that is detrimental to the function of SM. I think the new SM is actually quite good! Many thanks to Yung and Sher.
> ...


:goodpost:


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## bellapuppy (Dec 1, 2008)

Hey, Lynn!

I never participated in the secret santa and the raffles, but wanted to . I have to say, from what I have seen you are a valuable member of this community. I, too, would hate to see you leave. You have my prayers for your DH. Maybe you just need the time to spend with him, but you know you have friends here when you need a shoulder to lean on, so please don't leave for long - if at all.

That said, I can see the Mod's point re: liabilities and legalities and the like. I wouldn't have that job for any amount of money or "fame" either. Hugs. :heart:


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