# Dr Harvey's Dog Food



## izzysmommy (Jun 3, 2008)

Hi guys! I have a 7 month old maltese girl and she is a very very picky eater! Recently I took her to my sister's house who has a bijon who eats Dr. Harveys dog food. When Izzy, my maltese, ate his food she loved it!! I was wondering if this is a good change since she hardly eats any of her Innova food. I have to soften her Innova kibble and literally sit there by her for her to eat even a little bit! Any answers would help! Thanks a lot!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

I have heard that Dr Harvey's is a very good pre-mix, but you probably might have to add a good quality supplement because there is no calcium, among other things, listed on the ingredients bag. I suggest that you call Dr. Harvey and speak to him because your dog is a puppy. He's very informative, I've heard. His phone number is on the website link below.

I have a bag, but haven't tried it so I have no firsthand experience with it.

Dr Harvey's.


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## cloey70 (Jan 6, 2008)

I think this is best food ever, and as close as u can get to preparing your meals all on your own. The great thing, is the mix helps in all the essential vitamins, that your dog needs. I say go for it. I think I am going to try this as well, and see if its difficult. Its way better then any canned, or kibble out there IMO. I don't think you could get any closer to home cooking then this.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Yes I agree, I think it looks very good. I just have to find out first about the vitamins/minerals before I try it. It's so easy to use, all you have to do is add water to rehydrate, add a protein and an oil, like fish oil. I haven't had time to call Dr Harvey and ask him about the vitamins. 

I'm bringing the bag of Dr. Harvey's to my holistic vet appt on Tuesday. LOL, I'm bringing a huge tote bag filled with food pre-mixes, supplements and paperwork for Nikki's nutritional consultation. It's a good thing the holistic vet knows how I am already, or she'd be laughing her a** off at the nutcase with a bag full of stuff.


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## cloey70 (Jan 6, 2008)

Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :

Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614548


> Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :
> 
> Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
> Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.[/B]




I know, but that does not tell me anything. It says that it contains a "whole food herbal multi vitamin," but what exactly are the amounts, which ones are in there, and which ones aren't? I need to know exactly what is in there before I can rotate this food with home cooking recipes. 

I will probably try it tomorrow and see if Nikki likes it, but I'll need to get a go ahead on it from the holistic vet, who knows more about these things than I do.


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## bonniesmom (Jun 2, 2008)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614553


> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614548





> Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :
> 
> Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
> Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.[/B]




I know, but that does not tell me anything. It says that it contains a "whole food herbal multi vitamin," but what exactly are the amounts, which ones are in there, and which ones aren't? I need to know exactly what is in there before I can rotate this food with home cooking recipes. 

I will probably try it tomorrow and see if Nikki likes it, but I'll need to get a go ahead on it from the holistic vet, who knows more about these things than I do.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Suzan, I DON'T BELIEVE anyone knows more about these things than you do! :bysmilie:


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## cloey70 (Jan 6, 2008)

QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:04 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614559


> QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614553





> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614548





> Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :
> 
> Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
> Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.[/B]




I know, but that does not tell me anything. It says that it contains a "whole food herbal multi vitamin," but what exactly are the amounts, which ones are in there, and which ones aren't? I need to know exactly what is in there before I can rotate this food with home cooking recipes. 

I will probably try it tomorrow and see if Nikki likes it, but I'll need to get a go ahead on it from the holistic vet, who knows more about these things than I do.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Suzan, I DON'T BELIEVE anyone knows more about these things than you do! :bysmilie:
[/B][/QUOTE]

No arguement there, lol.........but I believe the packaging, I personally would go ahead with it for Clifford. Its good enough for me, and its better then the kibble I give him now.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 07:11 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614560


> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:04 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614559





> QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614553





> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614548





> Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :
> 
> Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
> Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.[/B]




I know, but that does not tell me anything. It says that it contains a "whole food herbal multi vitamin," but what exactly are the amounts, which ones are in there, and which ones aren't? I need to know exactly what is in there before I can rotate this food with home cooking recipes. 

I will probably try it tomorrow and see if Nikki likes it, but I'll need to get a go ahead on it from the holistic vet, who knows more about these things than I do.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Suzan, I DON'T BELIEVE anyone knows more about these things than you do! :bysmilie: 
[/B][/QUOTE]

No arguement there, lol.........but I believe the packaging, I personally would go ahead with it for Clifford. Its good enough for me, and its better then the kibble I give him now.

[/B][/QUOTE]


It's not that I don't "believe" the packaging, I do, I just want to know _exactly_ what vitamins/minerals are in the herbs, because I'm not an herbalist. But that's just me. I'm pretty "anal" about stuff like that. 

Believe me, I have a LOT to learn about canine nutrition and holistic health in general. I'm glad that Nikki's holistic vet is patient with me.  She books one-hour nutritional consultation appointments, and she actually listens and discusses things in detail. She encourages me to do my own research. And from doing all this research, the thing I've learned is that I have a LOT to learn.


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## cloey70 (Jan 6, 2008)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:21 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614563


> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 07:11 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614560





> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:04 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614559





> QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614553





> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614548





> Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :
> 
> Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
> Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.[/B]




I know, but that does not tell me anything. It says that it contains a "whole food herbal multi vitamin," but what exactly are the amounts, which ones are in there, and which ones aren't? I need to know exactly what is in there before I can rotate this food with home cooking recipes. 

I will probably try it tomorrow and see if Nikki likes it, but I'll need to get a go ahead on it from the holistic vet, who knows more about these things than I do.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Suzan, I DON'T BELIEVE anyone knows more about these things than you do! :bysmilie: 
[/B][/QUOTE]

No arguement there, lol.........but I believe the packaging, I personally would go ahead with it for Clifford. Its good enough for me, and its better then the kibble I give him now.

[/B][/QUOTE]


It's not that I don't "believe" the packaging, I do, I just want to know _exactly_ what vitamins/minerals are in the herbs, because I'm not an herbalist. But that's just me. I'm pretty "anal" about stuff like that. 

Believe me, I have a LOT to learn about canine nutrition and holistic health in general. I'm glad that Nikki's holistic vet is patient with me.  She books one-hour nutritional consultation appointments, and she actually listens and discusses things in detail. She encourages me to do my own research. And from doing all this research, the thing I've learned is that I have a LOT to learn.
[/B][/QUOTE]

I think Nikki is lucky and is getting a great diet. I wouldn't torture yourself over this. I think she'll be fine on the party animal or if you home cook. If you enjoy researching this, then great. I always see you on here, and I feel like it stresses u out, but I'm probably wrong, and your enjoying it. Ihope you'll find peace someday with all this, and be able to relax


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 07:47 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614577


> QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:21 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614563





> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 07:11 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614560





> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:04 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614559





> QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614553





> QUOTE (cloey70 @ Aug 1 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614548





> Its says on his site, that mix has all supplements and vitamins in it here is website :
> 
> Q. Do I need to give a vitamin supplement if I am feeding Canine Health?
> Dr. Harvey's Canine Health. Contains a Whole Food Herbal Multi-Vitamin ,so no additional multi-vitamin is needed. It is essential to add oil to the food as the recipe explains. Dr. Harvey's other herbal supplements can be added to the food for special needs, such as Formative Years, Joint- Ease, Pregnancy , Relax and Stress and Geriatric.[/B]




I know, but that does not tell me anything. It says that it contains a "whole food herbal multi vitamin," but what exactly are the amounts, which ones are in there, and which ones aren't? I need to know exactly what is in there before I can rotate this food with home cooking recipes. 

I will probably try it tomorrow and see if Nikki likes it, but I'll need to get a go ahead on it from the holistic vet, who knows more about these things than I do.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Suzan, I DON'T BELIEVE anyone knows more about these things than you do! :bysmilie: 
[/B][/QUOTE]

No arguement there, lol.........but I believe the packaging, I personally would go ahead with it for Clifford. Its good enough for me, and its better then the kibble I give him now.

[/B][/QUOTE]


It's not that I don't "believe" the packaging, I do, I just want to know _exactly_ what vitamins/minerals are in the herbs, because I'm not an herbalist. But that's just me. I'm pretty "anal" about stuff like that. 

Believe me, I have a LOT to learn about canine nutrition and holistic health in general. I'm glad that Nikki's holistic vet is patient with me.  She books one-hour nutritional consultation appointments, and she actually listens and discusses things in detail. She encourages me to do my own research. And from doing all this research, the thing I've learned is that I have a LOT to learn.
[/B][/QUOTE]

I think Nikki is lucky and is getting a great diet. I wouldn't torture yourself over this. I think she'll be fine on the party animal or if you home cook. If you enjoy researching this, then great. I always see you on here, and I feel like it stresses u out, but I'm probably wrong, and your enjoying it. Ihope you'll find peace someday with all this, and be able to relax  

[/B][/QUOTE]


LOL, I hardly ever stress about anything, even if it sounds that way. Our dogs usually do okay despite their most well-intentioned owners.

I just have a very curious, skeptical brain. I always want to know the exact identity of everything that goes into my body and my dog's body. It comes from my own health issues.


And of course a curious mind is a writer's curse. :smilie_tischkante: Or blessing!


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## izzysmommy (Jun 3, 2008)

thank you guys so much!! I feel much better about giving my baby this type of food! Im actually going to try and call Dr. Harvey tomorrow.. If you do find any important information about this food brand from the vet could you please let me know as well? It would really help! Thanks again and I will let you guys know how she does on this type of food when I start it on Monday!


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## SpringHasSprung (May 4, 2007)

WAAAAHHHHH! I've tried Dr. Harvey's twice and Spring (and now Summer) won't touch it. I so want them to eat it...but it's a definite NO GO in our house. They take one taste and walk away.


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

Hi, I feed Perri Dr. Harvey's. I had a nutritional blood test done with a veterinary nutritionist first, and he has a customized vitamin blend that I add to it. The doc knows what is in it, and kept that in mind when making the blend, so as far as Perri is concerned I know he's getting exactly what he needs, but if I weren't adding that blend then I would want to know the analysis of it. Something else I wonder is how the vitamins can be equally dispersed in that bag so that they're getting the same amount with each batch you make up. I talked with Dr.Harvey before starting this, but didn't think about that till later. So if you talk to him ask him about that. I cook half a batch of the mix at a time because the regular amount is too much. Just add the water, bring to a boil, and then take off the stove to let cool and thicken. It was recommended to me to do it that way instead of cooking it the full 8 minutes. I add organic chicken, a probiotic and digestive enzyme powder, his vit. blend, and alternate days with organic flax and then organic hemp seed oil. (This was not what the nutritionist originally told me, I do the hemp instead of a fish oil because Perri would not go near it when I used a supp. with fish oil so he said that would be fine for him). I do about a 50/50 between the chicken and mix, the nutritionist said to do 75% meat but that was just too rich for Perri. I had to play around with the amount a bit, and surprisingly he only gets a little bit, but I weigh him regularly and he is maintaining his weight - probably because it's just higher protein than he was getting and it's not as processed as kibble. The reason I switched to this is because he was very picky and I didn't want to have to keep switching foods and I wanted to see him happy to eat. He certainly is very happy now, he even rouses himself from his morning slumber to eat breakfast, something he rarely did before. I'm happy because I know he's getting what he needs, and it's very easy. Full-blown home cooking wasn't an option so this is perfect and very easy. Please let me know if you have any questions, and I'm sorry if this is a bit scattered, it's been a long day!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Here is the email answer I received from Dr. Harvey's regarding Nikki's age (9 months) calcium requirements and vitamins:

***

*Canine Health is the very best way to start your puppy's life ! Follow the directions for puppies and add plain organic yogurt and cottage cheese until she is 18 months old. Many top breeders will not let puppies go home until the new guardians know how to feed Dr. Harvey's.* *We think you have made a great choice. In fact, we believe there is no better way to feed your companion than to feed Dr Harvey's.**
**The balanced meal that you will prepare has vegetables that contain calcium too and their is a whole food multi- vitamin in the Canine Health also.

* *You are doing the very best thing for you pup by feeding fresh food everyday.**Everything that she needs for proper and balanced health is contained in our food.**Remember to rotate the protein source and oil frequently.* *
**Please let us know if you have any additional questions.**
**Thank you.**
**Yours in truth and health,**
**Wendy Shankin-Cohen**President* *and **The Staff at Dr. Harvey's

*_******_*


*Although I didn't find out about the other vitamins yet, I will still try this food over the weekend. I will be using chicken thighs, the cottage cheese/yogurt, and hemp oil at first. 

I will let you know what my holistic vet says about it after I see her. 

Regarding Precious Prince's question about vitamin disbursement: since the vitamins are contained in the food/herbs, not added to it later, so if you shake the bag every time you use the food, it would help disburse the vitamins during the time each bag is used. It's not an exact science, but I don't think there's a problem concerning that.


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## paris'mom (Jul 14, 2004)

I have been feeding Dr Harveys mix for about 3 months (consistently) but I always have to hand feed them because the food gets all over their face if I don't...

My question to Prince Perri's mom: How do you keep his face clean when he's eating? I wonder if my food is too moist...


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

Mimi, well first I put it on a plate and that helps a lot. I also band his moustache so that it doesn't get in the food. So between those two things he really doesn't get his face messy thank goodness!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Well I made the Dr. Harvey's tonight with chicken, hemp oil, and yogurt/cottage cheese. Nikki absolutely loved loved loved it. So I'll feed it to her until I get my home cooked recipes. Dr. Harvey's is very easy to put together. The only think that takes a little time is cooking the protein, but I just put some chicken thighs and a little olive oil in a baking dish and threw it in the oven to bake. The food was very soupy when I first put the water in, but it absorbed most of the water after 8 minutes. It smells heavenly!! I'm going to call Dr. Harvey on Monday to ask him some questions about the vitamins.


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

I boil the chicken and it takes just minutes, you can always try that if you're pressed for time. I don't think boiled chicken tastes very good but Perri doesn't mind! Also, I didn't want the chicken to sit in it's grease. You said it was soupy, how did you cook the mix?


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 2 2008, 06:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614964


> I boil the chicken and it takes just minutes, you can always try that if you're pressed for time. I don't think boiled chicken tastes very good but Perri doesn't mind! Also, I didn't want the chicken to sit in it's grease. You said it was soupy, how did you cook the mix?[/B]



It wasn't soupy. What I meant that when you first pour in the water it appears soupy but it quickly absorbs the water just fine. I thought about boiling the chicken, but I had the oven on anyway.


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## paris'mom (Jul 14, 2004)

I used to make a batch for about 3 days but I started to think that wasn't very good so here is what I do now...

I have a quick boil electric kettle, so I put that on and it gives me boiling hot water under a minute. Pour that into the cup with the pre-mix, stir, and cover. I then cook salmon, turkey, or chicken breast (for poultry, I always boil it) and in the time the protein is cooking, the premix should be good and done. 

I then put the protein source into a little electric mixer (holds about 2 cups only) and grind up the meat into these little shreds and mix that into the food, so there is meat in every bite. LOL 

I then feed the boys with my finger. One at a time. I literally put a bit on the food on my index finger and let the boys eat off my finger. If Aries is very hungry, he will be too excited and may bite me in the process. Paris is my gentleman and has always been very careful on what's food and what's mom's finger. haha


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 1 2008, 06:39 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614544


> I'm bringing the bag of Dr. Harvey's to my holistic vet appt on Tuesday. LOL, I'm bringing a huge tote bag filled with food pre-mixes, supplements and paperwork for Nikki's nutritional consultation. It's a good thing the holistic vet knows how I am already, or she'd be laughing her a** off at the nutcase with a bag full of stuff.[/B]


Please let us know what your holistic vet thinks of this diet. I've been searching for a brand of food to bring into my store for some time now and the more I look, the more confused I get. I don't have much room for big bags and cans, and no room for freezers for raw. I've been looking at Dr. Harvey's for awhile now and like that I can bring it in for dogs and cats, can be adapted for puppies/kittens and various stages of their lives, and can be made with either raw or cooked food depending on the preference of the mom or dad. I was thrilled when I saw this thread.

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 1 2008, 10:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=614693


> Hi, I feed Perri Dr. Harvey's. I had a nutritional blood test done with a veterinary nutritionist first, and he has a customized vitamin blend that I add to it. The doc knows what is in it, and kept that in mind when making the blend, so as far as Perri is concerned I know he's getting exactly what he needs, but if I weren't adding that blend then I would want to know the analysis of it. Something else I wonder is how the vitamins can be equally dispersed in that bag so that they're getting the same amount with each batch you make up. I talked with Dr.Harvey before starting this, but didn't think about that till later. So if you talk to him ask him about that. I cook half a batch of the mix at a time because the regular amount is too much. Just add the water, bring to a boil, and then take off the stove to let cool and thicken. It was recommended to me to do it that way instead of cooking it the full 8 minutes. I add organic chicken, a probiotic and digestive enzyme powder, his vit. blend, and alternate days with organic flax and then organic hemp seed oil. (This was not what the nutritionist originally told me, I do the hemp instead of a fish oil because Perri would not go near it when I used a supp. with fish oil so he said that would be fine for him). I do about a 50/50 between the chicken and mix, the nutritionist said to do 75% meat but that was just too rich for Perri. I had to play around with the amount a bit, and surprisingly he only gets a little bit, but I weigh him regularly and he is maintaining his weight - probably because it's just higher protein than he was getting and it's not as processed as kibble. The reason I switched to this is because he was very picky and I didn't want to have to keep switching foods and I wanted to see him happy to eat. He certainly is very happy now, he even rouses himself from his morning slumber to eat breakfast, something he rarely did before. I'm happy because I know he's getting what he needs, and it's very easy. Full-blown home cooking wasn't an option so this is perfect and very easy. Please let me know if you have any questions, and I'm sorry if this is a bit scattered, it's been a long day![/B]


Did the Vet Nutritionist think this was a good food, or did he/she know that was what you were using and made the vitamin blend according to the food? As for the oil, would the quick snip caps of Essential Fatty Acids that I LOVE and am currently using be ok, or would I still need to add a certain amount of oil for consistency? I also have mine on Probiotics and Digestive Enzymes. Jett had IBS but since I've had him on the Probiotics and Digestive Enzymes for about 8 months now, I've been able to add more things into his 'limited diet'. So I'm ready to say he no longer has IBS (fingers crossed) and switch him to a food I feel better about. Just did a vaccine Detox on Jett and am going through an Allergy Detox for Zoe and the Essential Fatty Acids are a must for her.


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

Yes, Dr. Goldstein is a respected vet. nutritionist and he highly recommended Dr. Harvey's, and he did know I'd be using it when he made Perri's neutraceutical powder. I don't know what oil supplement you are using or if it would be good or not, since you have good results with it call or email Dr. Harvey and tell him what's in it and see what he thinks. (The oil is not neccessary for consistency of the mix.)
When I bought the food I also bought Dr. Harvey's health and shine oil to give him, until I could order what Dr. Goldstein told me to get, but I'm glad I got that first before I bought the other fish oil supplement because I quickly found Perri did not like either the smell or the taste of fish oil - and it was mixed with other oils too in the supp. too and he only got half of it per meal so it wasn't even very much! Anyway, it's fish oil (wild caught salmon, I made sure first), organic flax oil and borage oil. I mention it bc if you sell the mix you could sell the health and shine too to make it easier on people. Also if you do, make sure to carry the little bags too because the price of the bigger bags could be daunting to a first time buyer of it, and this way they could try it without spending much. I bought a 20 oz bag as well as the 5 lb so in case Perri didn't go for it I could return the big bag. That small bag lasted me like 2 months! Yes that's for a small dog but it's still a long time. In fact whenever I run out of the 5 lb. (probably in a year lol) I'm only going to buy the small bags so it will be fresher. 
Also, I emailed them yesterday bc they never got back to me on a question I had about the treats, so I also asked them the question about the vitamins and their dispersement, since I'm curious now. I got a response saying they would send me that info tomorrow, I'll post it if I do.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 3 2008, 07:06 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615460


> Yes, Dr. Goldstein is a respected vet. nutritionist and he highly recommended Dr. Harvey's, and he did know I'd be using it when he made Perri's neutraceutical powder. I don't know what oil supplement you are using or if it would be good or not, since you have good results with it call or email Dr. Harvey and tell him what's in it and see what he thinks. (The oil is not neccessary for consistency of the mix.)
> When I bought the food I also bought Dr. Harvey's health and shine oil to give him, until I could order what Dr. Goldstein told me to get, but I'm glad I got that first before I bought the other fish oil supplement because I quickly found Perri did not like either the smell or the taste of fish oil - and it was mixed with other oils too in the supp. too and he only got half of it per meal so it wasn't even very much! Anyway, it's fish oil (wild caught salmon, I made sure first), organic flax oil and borage oil. I mention it bc if you sell the mix you could sell the health and shine too to make it easier on people. Also if you do, make sure to carry the little bags too because the price of the bigger bags could be daunting to a first time buyer of it, and this way they could try it without spending much. I bought a 20 oz bag as well as the 5 lb so in case Perri didn't go for it I could return the big bag. That small bag lasted me like 2 months! Yes that's for a small dog but it's still a long time. In fact whenever I run out of the 5 lb. (probably in a year lol) I'm only going to buy the small bags so it will be fresher.
> Also, I emailed them yesterday bc they never got back to me on a question I had about the treats, so I also asked them the question about the vitamins and their dispersement, since I'm curious now. I got a response saying they would send me that info tomorrow, I'll post it if I do.[/B]


Thanks so much for your quick response. All good info to know! I'm carrying the Animal Essential line of holistic products and supplements. My vet, who is not a holistic vet, but very open to the holistic approach of treating animals, researched thier line thoroughly for me and is VERY impressed. I'm very fortunate to have a vet who thinks like me, that one form of medicine without the other, is not complete. We are both thrilled with the results we've had with Zoe and her beginning stages of allergies with the Detox/Allergy Blend and the Essential Fatty Acids. The Probiotics they carry is just the tops. I've had several others tell me they tried other brands of Probiotics and saw little to no results. Then they tried Animal Essentials and were like me. Saw a change within 24 hours and a complete turn around in a few days. The Essential Fatty Acids have both the Omega 3 and the Omega 6 fatty acids. The quick snip caps ingredients are: Marine Harvested Menhaden Fish Oil 150 mg, Borage Oil 150 mg, Flax Seed Oil 150 mg, Wheat Germ Oil 100 mg, Lecithin 100 mg, Beeswas (as a gelatin hardener), Vitamin E, Sea Bed Trace Minerals & Spirulina. My two have always been great eaters but go absolutely CRAZY when they see me squirt the Omega Caps into thier food. I'll have to compare to Dr. Harvey's Health & Shine.


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

Yes that is a good line, and since you already carry it, they like it, and it has the same ingredients and more of the health and shine, I don't see why not. Glad to hear Zoe's doing well!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Animal Essentials is a good line. You might want to look at Dr. Harvey's supplements, too. There's info about them on Only Natural Pet Store

I will ask the holistic vet a million questions and report back all of the info some time on Tuesday.


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## tamizami (May 1, 2007)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 3 2008, 05:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615514


> Animal Essentials is a good line. You might want to look at Dr. Harvey's supplements, too. There's info about them on Only Natural Pet Store
> 
> I will ask the holistic vet a million questions and report back all of the info some time on Tuesday.[/B]


Thanks for all the recommendations and serving suggestions! Which product are you all referring to? Canine Health or Veg-to-Bowl?


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

I am using the Canine Health right now, with the grains. I also have the veg to bowl. I want to see how Nikki does with the grains. The Canine Health has more herbs. The veg to bowl has calcium added and has a great appearance-lots of veggies.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Forgot to mention that they don't sell it in my area. I ordered mine from Only Natural Pet Store but I noticed that The Hungry Puppy has free shipping:


http://www.thehungrypuppy.com/merchant.mvc...amp;Screen=SFNT


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 3 2008, 08:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615514


> Animal Essentials is a good line. You might want to look at Dr. Harvey's supplements, too. There's info about them on Only Natural Pet Store
> 
> I will ask the holistic vet a million questions and report back all of the info some time on Tuesday.[/B]


Being a retailer, I have access to them directly. I just haven't called to talk to Dr. Harvey personally yet until I checked out some other resources who I know & trust first. I'm so new to the world of nutrition and holistic care so I'm not claiming to be an expert by any means. So I really have to rely on those whose advice and council have been proven over time to me while I'm learning.

I've not thoroughly checked Dr. Harvey's supplements yet, but what I've checked so far, although really good, I believe the Animal Essential line to be superior and far more extensive.

I'm really anxious to hear what your holistic vet has to say on Tuesday. The main question I have, is can the amount of protein be changed to accomodate special dietary needs? We know the protien amount and type can be changed for various stages of life and pregnancy, but what about those who need a low residue diet? I really wish he would have something for those who are needing a limited diet as well.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 3 2008, 07:30 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615472


> Yes that is a good line, and since you already carry it, they like it, and it has the same ingredients and more of the health and shine, I don't see why not. Glad to hear Zoe's doing well![/B]


Do you by any chance make a big batch at one time and freeze part of it? I'm just wondering for those, myself included, where free time is limited, if that is an option or if it is better to do small batches at a time. I probably should just call Dr. Harvey myself and quit bothering you. LOL


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (Crystal&Zoe @ Aug 4 2008, 07:38 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615668


> QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 3 2008, 08:48 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615514





> Animal Essentials is a good line. You might want to look at Dr. Harvey's supplements, too. There's info about them on Only Natural Pet Store
> 
> I will ask the holistic vet a million questions and report back all of the info some time on Tuesday.[/B]


Being a retailer, I have access to them directly. I just haven't called to talk to Dr. Harvey personally yet until I checked out some other resources who I know & trust first. I'm so new to the world of nutrition and holistic care so I'm not claiming to be an expert by any means. So I really have to rely on those whose advice and council have been proven over time to me while I'm learning.

I've not thoroughly checked Dr. Harvey's supplements yet, but what I've checked so far, although really good, I believe the Animal Essential line to be superior and far more extensive.

I'm really anxious to hear what your holistic vet has to say on Tuesday. The main question I have, is can the amount of protein be changed to accomodate special dietary needs? We know the protien amount and type can be changed for various stages of life and pregnancy, but what about those who need a low residue diet? I really wish he would have something for those who are needing a limited diet as well.
[/B][/QUOTE]




I think that the amount of protein could be changed but I think that if people want to do that they either have to speak to Dr Harvey or use a veterinary nutritional consultant, especially if their dog has health issues. I know that my holistic vet will tell me that. 

I feed Nikki one ounce less food than the recommended serving, but I add cottage cheese and yogurt for calcium. I can't overload her with protein because of her MVD. But if I wanted to decrease the meat protein, I'd add more cottage cheese/yogurt (must add both) and/or eggs. 

If you are going to carry this food and other holistic items then you might want to look into a consultation in person or by phone with a holistic veterinarian, or veterinary nutritionist if you haven't already done so. I don't know if my holistic vet does phone consultations. Here name is Dr. Susan Wynn. She is located here. In my experience in working in the health food industry and being a long time user of holistic remedies, there is a lot of hype out there, and I have to sift through information and find out what works. I have concerns about supplements because there are many that are being sold that do not contain what they say they do, or contain harmful additives/residues, like lead, which was found in Pet Tabs, or mold, which was found in Ark Naturals probiotics.

(BTW I DON'T believe that *more* govt regulation is the answer. I believe that an educated customer is the answer. The govt just mucks things up. If we support the good companies, the bad ones will fade away.) 

My holistic vet is very careful to recommend supplements that either have been tested by ConsumerLab.com or have been proven to work. The thing is, there are people on both sides of the medical arena who are very dogmatic and insist that the other side is harmful and/or doesn't work. That's why balance is the key. I'm a believer in *preventative* medicine and nutrition. I use both traditional and alternative medicine, but I go with holistic first, then traditional, unless there is an injury or life-threatening situation. 

I've decided to trust my holistic vet because she isn't dogmatic, and she practices both traditional and conventional medicine. I don't always agree with everything she recommends, but I trust her. 

I am going to get recipes from her and do home cooking, not because I don't like Dr. Harvey's, but because I want to feed Nikki _fresh_ organic veggies. I wil use Dr. Harvey's as my back-up food, and feed it to her every couple of weeks. 

Two other companies that you might want to look at are Thorne and Vetri-Science.

Here's an article regarding alternative medicine that I found in my RSS feed this morning:

http://www.diet-blog.com/archives/2008/08/..._or_hogwash.php

(BTW, I believe that acupuncture _really _works, but I don't know why or how, and I've never done it myself. But I've seen great results with other people's dogs.)

In case the link doesn't work, here's the post:


Just because a treatment/remedy/supplement is "natural", does not mean it is safe or effective.
Just because a treatment/drug is "conventional", doesn't mean it is vastly effective.
Conventional and natural medicines have their merits and their flaws. Conventional medicine is skewed by corporate pharmaceutical interest, while many aspects of natural medicine are poorly regulated and not supported by strong evidence. There are ethics problems in both forms of medicine.
The best approach to health is a preventative one. Lifestyle management including healthy diet and exercise are the ONLY truly preventative approaches to health. Natural medicine does not equal preventative.
Both conventional and alternative medicine are multi-billion dollar industries (conventional much more so than alternative)
Natural therapies should be given opportunities to be studied more rigorously to determine therapeutic value. The industry is big enough to fund independent studies.
Speaking of therapeutic - anything strong enough to cause a therapeutic effect will be strong enough to cause side-effects.
It is a sin that medical schools spend so little time teaching nutrition and nutrition-based therapies as mandatory courses.
An integrative approach, in my opinion is the best way to look at medicine. Taking the best of both natural and conventional methods.
I favor looking at whether a therapy is evidence based rather than whether it is "conventional" or "alternative".
Consider the placebo effect. This normally accounts for about 35% of any result and has been shown to account for as high as 80%! Be sure that whatever remedy/treatment you study, that it has undergone placebo-controlled studies.
Both allopathic physicians and naturopathic physicians are well educated, however they tend to blindly follow they philosophies in which they were taught (I realize I'm generalizing here - it's just my observation/opinion). It is difficult to open one's mind to a completely different paradigm.
When examining specific types of CAM disciplines, it is difficult to label any one as "effective" or "ineffective" due to the wide variety of therapies used therein. For example, one may conclude that chiropractic works, even though it wasn't chiropractic per se, but rather manipulative therapy used by a chiropractor that was useful (Physiotherapists are trained in manipulation as well).
There is often blurring with regards to whether an intervention is alternative or conventional - with the philosophy behind each treatment making the difference. For example, stick needles in someone according to meridians because their "chi" is off and it's alternative (acupuncture). Stick needles in someone to relieve trigger points based on neuromusculoskeletal anatomy and its conventional (Intramuscular stimulation).<blockquote>There's acupuncture, which works on the principle of distraction. You're not going to feel the arthritis in your knee when someone's ramming a butterfly specimen needle into the nape of your neck. It's the same reason your nose never itches when your ankle is caught in a bear trap.</blockquote> Again, Dennis Miller 
Being 'open-minded" does not necessarily mean relinquishing critical thinking skills. There is a fine line between skepticism and closed-mindedness, but there is an equally fine line between open-mindedness and gullibility.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (Crystal&Zoe @ Aug 4 2008, 07:53 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615674


> QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 3 2008, 07:30 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615472





> Yes that is a good line, and since you already carry it, they like it, and it has the same ingredients and more of the health and shine, I don't see why not. Glad to hear Zoe's doing well![/B]


Do you by any chance make a big batch at one time and freeze part of it? I'm just wondering for those, myself included, where free time is limited, if that is an option or if it is better to do small batches at a time. I probably should just call Dr. Harvey myself and quit bothering you. LOL
[/B][/QUOTE]


Yes you can freeze it.


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## Furbaby's Mommie (Jul 10, 2004)

Wow I finally got around to reading this thread. Susan you are a wonderful source! I love your attitude about holistic and traditional nutrition and medicine. Can't wait to hear what your vet says. I am so interested in _truth_ in nutrition, and believe it is hard to find. I've been leery about the words _Organic/Natural/Holistic, _but want them to true. Reading labels can, and usually is, like reading fairy tales. They may be based on truth, or using the right words, but what is really there in the product, or how much of the ingredient. I think this is especially true with pet foods and supplements. 

I haven't tried Dr. Harvey's but keep looking at it. I tried all of the Honest Kitchen products and Shoni won't eat them. I hate the green color of them that gets on faces anyway. For Shoni I use is still what he *will* eat. Right now it is FreshPet Select that he will eat. For a while it was Organix canned. I'm giving him a heaping teaspoon of organic plain yogurt every morning, cottage cheese some days, Missing Link Plus, and FortiFlora probiotics (prescribed by his vet, it is flavored and he likes it. It sprinkles on top of his food instead of a pill), and a little chicken breast to tempt him to eat. He also has a mix of dry food--Healthwise & Newman's (poultry), mostly. For treats it's pieces of fruit, cheerios, etc. I tried a bag of the FreshPet Treats and he likes them, but the bag is big and they can only stay opened in the refrig. for 14 days.

I'm so glad you are sharing your research and knowledge with us. That is so generous, and so valuable!  Thank you!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Okay, I spoke with Dr. Harvey today. He assured me that his pre-mix foods contain a multi-vitamin mineral complex which is similar to what is put in commercial dog food. But there's a huge difference: The vitamins and minerals are contained _in the vegetables, grains, and herbs_ in the pre-mix, and since it is dehydrated, not cooked, the vitamins are retained. He does not use cheap synthetic vitamin mixes from China, which 99.9% of pet food companies use. 

He said that when started thinking about making an easy pre-mix to help owners get their animals off commercial food, he looked into using the typical synthetic vitamin pre-mixes from pharmaceutical companie and he decided against them in favor of whole food vitamins. He said that although the vegetables and herbs in his food are not _certified_ organic, they are _not _sprayed with pesticides. (There are a lot of factors that go into certified organic food, like farming in organic soil for years, etc.) He said that to buy dehydrated _certified _organic veggies would drive the cost up way too high for most people. 

Since with this food, the dog owner chooses the protein and cooks it themselves, they know exactly what the dog is getting. He said that even certified organic commercial dog food might contain questionable animal parts, like feet and beaks, and other gross stuff, because they aren't required to list what part of the animal the protein comes from, even if the food is certified organic. He said that in order to disburse the vitamins in his food, shake the bag before pouring out the contents. In the course of time as you use up the contents in the bag, the dog will get the required vitamins/minerals. Since they are whole food vitamins, there's no real danger of too little or too much, like the synthetics.

Dr. Harvey said that his name and integrity are on the line regarding the food, and he wouldn't compromise in any way, that he has ethics and he really cares about the animals welfare. I really like Dr. Harvey, he's a down to earth guy, and I don't think he's in it to make millions, but he seems to really care about our furbabies getting good, healthy nutrition. Of course there is no way of me knowing that all is perfect with this food, but my guess is that is must be better than canned or kibble. 

Here's the thing. If you are considering using a premix but are pressed for time, all you have to do is add water to the mix, then add cooked beef, chicken, turkey, fish, or eggs, etc. You could use canned wild salmon, or pick up an already cooked rotisserie chicken or chicken breast, and then it would take less than 10 minutes to put it together. Then add your choice of oil (and cottage cheese+yogurt for a puppy's extra calcium needs) and you are done. You could make a huge batch and freeze it too. 

I'm not trying to sell this food, and I hate to recommend food and supplements because I'm not a professional and what works for one doesn't always work for another. But the more I investigate commercial dog food, the more turned off I am. Even the _best_ canned or kibble, even certified organic, apparently has its problems. So I will definitely feed Nikki this food, in addition to some homemade recipes. 

I encourage you to give him a call yourself if you have questions. He's very down to earth and helpful. 1-866-362-4123

After I speak to my holistic vet on Tuesday I will start a new thread with any helpful information I receive. I hope this info helps you!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (Furbaby's Mommie @ Aug 4 2008, 01:10 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615771


> Wow I finally got around to reading this thread. Susan you are a wonderful source! I love your attitude about holistic and traditional nutrition and medicine. Can't wait to hear what your vet says. I am so interested in _truth_ in nutrition, and believe it is hard to find. I've been leery about the words _Organic/Natural/Holistic, _but want them to true. Reading labels can, and usually is, like reading fairy tales. They may be based on truth, or using the right words, but what is really there in the product, or how much of the ingredient. I think this is especially true with pet foods and supplements.
> 
> I haven't tried Dr. Harvey's but keep looking at it. I tried all of the Honest Kitchen products and Shoni won't eat them. I hate the green color of them that gets on faces anyway. For Shoni I use is still what he *will* eat. Right now it is FreshPet Select that he will eat. For a while it was Organix canned. I'm giving him a heaping teaspoon of organic plain yogurt every morning, cottage cheese some days, Missing Link Plus, and FortiFlora probiotics (prescribed by his vet, it is flavored and he likes it. It sprinkles on top of his food instead of a pill), and a little chicken breast to tempt him to eat. He also has a mix of dry food--Healthwise & Newman's (poultry), mostly. For treats it's pieces of fruit, cheerios, etc. I tried a bag of the FreshPet Treats and he likes them, but the bag is big and they can only stay opened in the refrig. for 14 days.
> 
> I'm so glad you are sharing your research and knowledge with us. That is so generous, and so valuable!  Thank you![/B]



I am more than happy to share info. You can use what works and ignore the rest!!  
Just an FYI. The Dr. Harvey's doesn't look green like Honest Kitchen. It looks like a veggie stew. And BTW, if you feed cottage cheese be sure to feed yogurt too, as cottage cheese has a lot of phosphorus and you need calcium - like from yogurt, to balance the phosphorus.


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## SpringHasSprung (May 4, 2007)

I feel very positive about this food and have for a long time. The fact that you are giving it the "green light" is all the more important to me. I know that YOU know what you are talking about! 

I have tried a couple of times and my dears just will not eat it. Now I'm wondering......when I made it, it was sticky as heck. I mean that I had to push it hard off the spoon and then smooze it off my finger in the dogs' dish. Is that normal???? Maybe I should try again and add more water if it does that again? It was kind of like sticky paste.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (SpringHasSprung @ Aug 4 2008, 03:05 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615811


> I feel very positive about this food and have for a long time. The fact that you are giving it the "green light" is all the more important to me. I know that YOU know what you are talking about!
> 
> I have tried a couple of times and my dears just will not eat it. Now I'm wondering......when I made it, it was sticky as heck. I mean that I had to push it hard off the spoon and then smooze it off my finger in the dogs' dish. Is that normal???? Maybe I should try again and add more water if it does that again? It was kind of like sticky paste.[/B]



Well, I have a lot to learn regarding holistic foods etc. I'm no expert. I don't really like to recommend stuff, because nothing is perfect, and I don't want to recommend something that might end up being not what it is supposed to be. Everyone has to do their own homework. If something works or doesn't work for Nikki, I'll tell people. But I can't tell anyone what to feed, or what not to feed. That's their decision. 

The _Canine Health_ is a little bit sticky, almost like a thick veggie stew or porridge. That's because it has dehydrated grains. If they didn't like the food, you might try the grain free mix, the _Veg-to-Bowl. _I don't know what type of protein or oil you used, that could make a difference with your dog's taste. I used chicken, and organic hemp oil. Perhaps change the oil, and/or the protein, and add a little bit more water, or perhaps add a bit of something that they LOVE, whatever that might be.


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## SpringHasSprung (May 4, 2007)

I actually have tried both the grain one and the veggie one. It was a no go both times. I used chicken in both which they LOVE...but I don't remember which oil.

I don't mean to make you feel that you have any responsibility in anything you've written and I know you are not recommending this. I understand your position...but I've read many of your posts and I just know that I would highly recommend your advice to myself!  You are clearly one smart lady on canine nutrition.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (SpringHasSprung @ Aug 4 2008, 04:04 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615837


> I actually have tried both the grain one and the veggie one. It was a no go both times. I used chicken in both which they LOVE...but I don't remember which oil.
> 
> I don't mean to make you feel that you have any responsibility in anything you've written and I know you are not recommending this. I understand your position...but I've read many of your posts and I just know that I would highly recommend your advice to myself!  You are clearly one smart lady on canine nutrition.[/B]



Thanks, you're very kind. :ThankYou:


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## luvmyfurbaby (Feb 11, 2007)

I have always feed them the stinky power patties (freeze dried tripe) from Dr. Harvey and they have always loved them. I just ordered last week all the suppliments, and both types of food for dogs & cats for my store and am even test driving Dr. Harvey's bird food. I can't wait for the shipment!! Mine are very picky so let's see how it goes. I have tried the Sojo dehydrated veggies before and they were never interested and I wasn't thrill because it reminded me of the soups that came in a cup that I use to pick up on the run when I was younger.


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## tamizami (May 1, 2007)

Thank you for sharing this info Suzan! You are a tremendous help to those of us that don't want to feed commercial dog food and don't have the time to do as in-depth research. I really appreciate it. :aktion033:


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (tamizami @ Aug 4 2008, 06:12 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615891


> Thank you for sharing this info Suzan! You are a tremendous help to those of us that don't want to feed commercial dog food and don't have the time to do as in-depth research. I really appreciate it. :aktion033:[/B]



Glad to be of help. Hope you are well.


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## preciouspups (Apr 13, 2008)

Thanks Suzan, for sharing your research. How do you introduce this new food ? Same method as any other new food? ...just add a little bit daily to their food they are currently eating?


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

QUOTE (PreciousPups @ Aug 4 2008, 06:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615906


> Thanks Suzan, for sharing your research. How do you introduce this new food ? Same method as any other new food? ...just add a little bit daily to their food they are currently eating?[/B]




However you usually do it. I never transition. I just fed it to Nikki. She loved it.


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

They emailed me the list of vitamins today. I didn't realize it was actually in the food, I thought it was just some mix that they didn't put on the label, when it's actually there on the label because it's from the food! They emailed it in a word doc, so I will copy/paste. If someone knows how to link to a .doc then let me know so it's not taking up so much space. *ALFALFA

*One of the richest sources of minerals and trace minerals on earth. Ancient India’s traditional Ayurvedic physicians used alfalfa (Medicago sativa) to treat ulcers. The ancient Chinese saw their animals eating alfalfa enthusiastically, and began to prepare the leaves to stimulate appetite and treat digestive problems, particularly ulcers.

Modern scientists are discovering the potential healing benefits our ancestors dreamed of. Animal studies show that alfalfa leaves help reduce blood cholesterol levels and plaque deposits on artery walls. Alfalfa also is a source of chlorophyll (a blood purifier).


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

QUOTE (Crystal&Zoe @ Aug 4 2008, 07:53 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615674


> QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 3 2008, 07:30 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615472





> Yes that is a good line, and since you already carry it, they like it, and it has the same ingredients and more of the health and shine, I don't see why not. Glad to hear Zoe's doing well![/B]


Do you by any chance make a big batch at one time and freeze part of it? I'm just wondering for those, myself included, where free time is limited, if that is an option or if it is better to do small batches at a time. I probably should just call Dr. Harvey myself and quit bothering you. LOL
[/B][/QUOTE]

You're not bothering me at all Crystal! You can, but I don't. I buy a pack of organic chicken tenders, cook a couple, then freeze the rest with a few in each bag. I take one bag of chicken out of the freezer and put it in the fridge the day before I run out and will need to cook more. I never freeze the mix as I think it would taste better fresh. I cut the mix recipe in half so it's only enough to last a couple days, like the chicken. Since you have two though you probably wouldn't have to. I add the water to the mix, bring just to a boil and then let stand a few minutes to thicken. The whole process is so short that I find no need to cook up big batches. Also, I keep the mix and the chicken seperate until feeding time because I feed half protein and half mix and it's just easier to do right before feeding then worrying about ounces and everything if I were to mix a big batch up at once. Really, it's super easy, and this is coming from a lazy person who thought boiling chicken was too much like "cooking" LOL - at first I was buying canned organic pure meat to add to it just so I wouldn't have too!

A couple of other comments to different things I read earlier - 
--the veg to bowl is not for adding to the regular mix as the mix has the same things and it's not neccessary, according to Dr. Harvey

--for people who tried it and their dogs wouldn't eat it, perhaps try it with just the mix and chicken, no oils, supplements, ect first to see if they eat it. I was very disheartened when at first Perri was disinterested in it, it didn't take me long to figure out he didn't like the fish oil I was putting on it.


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## SpringHasSprung (May 4, 2007)

OK! I got hyped up over this thread and decided to try it again. I made up a small batch of the Veggie Dr. Harvey's and fed it to them with chicken and some of their kibble. This time they ate it!!! woohooo!

My only complaint is that there are beets in there and the whole thing turns red...and smelly beet smell. Of course, you're reading words from a lady who DESPISES beets! :shocked: :smscare2:


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

^^ Oh good, I bet they were like Perri and it was one of the supps you were adding that they didn't like. Now you can just do a process of elimination with the oils.

As far as the beets go, I pick those out every time I make a batch of the mix. Even though I tie Perri's moustache up so his face doesn't get messy while eating it, I'm afraid that any tiny bit that may get on him would stain if it had the beets in it. Normally if he gets some on the tip of his 'stache I just wipe it off with a baby wipe, however if it had beets in it it wouldn't come off so easily I bet. So this way I'm safe LOL!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Thanks for the vitamin mineral breakdown. I could never remember all that from my phone conversation with Dr. Harvey!!


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Thanks for the vitamin mineral breakdown. I could never remember all that from my phone conversation with Dr. Harvey!!


OOPS Sorry double post


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 4 2008, 08:24 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615968


> As far as the beets go, I pick those out every time I make a batch of the mix. Even though I tie Perri's moustache up so his face doesn't get messy while eating it, I'm afraid that any tiny bit that may get on him would stain if it had the beets in it. Normally if he gets some on the tip of his 'stache I just wipe it off with a baby wipe, however if it had beets in it it wouldn't come off so easily I bet. So this way I'm safe LOL![/B]


I'm thinking that may be the hot new look of the season! White dogs with red 'staches & beards! :HistericalSmiley: We could start a trend!! Hey, I grew up in the 80's and I look back at the trends then and can't imagine why I or anyone else would have followed such awful trends!!! :w00t: :brownbag: 

Oh.....and it would detract from any tear staining if someone's Malt has tear stains!!  

Ok...seriously. How messy is this stuff? Messier than canned I'm guessing. I had homecooked for Zoe (pre Jett) during all the food recalls when she was being diagnosed. It ended up being kind of a thick stew with rice. She has a longer muzzle than the baby doll faces and it really wasn't all that messy. Jett may be a different story. :blush:


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

It is messy, but it's manageable by banding the moustache and putting it on a plate instead of a bowl. Oh and I pick the beets out before I add the water, forgot to say that. But sometimes the pieces are so tiny you can only see them once the water heats and the color comes out, and you can get them then before they get mushy and turn everything red.


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## SpringHasSprung (May 4, 2007)

Both of mine ate it all tonight WITH the beets included. UGH. It tinges ALL of the food red, but neither one of mine have any remnants at all on their 'staches. LOL


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## SpringHasSprung (May 4, 2007)

I think I might be dumb. :bysmilie: It doesn't say to add any oils to the Veggie one...so I don't/didn't. Isn't it just the one with the grains where you have to add the oils??


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## tamizami (May 1, 2007)

So it looks like with Veg-to-Bowl you need to purchase the Multi-Vitamin, Mineral and Herbal Supplement (1 product). But for Canine Health you don't because bee pollen, etc are already in the forumla. Right?

Thanks for posting the supplement info, I love whole food supplements.

Suzan - whats your thought on additional Omega 6??? Don't dogs get enough of this from meat? How about extra Omega 9? I am under the impression that our regular diet contains enough of these 2 and that we really need to supplement Omega 3. I'm just curious if you have an opinion on this.....and while I'm at it - how about flax as a source of Omega 3 for dogs? I heard its not as easily assimilated into their system as fish oil. Thanks in advance if your research has provided you any insight into the Omega (EFA) area.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

I'm not a huge fan of flax oil, unless it is organic. I like the tast of Hemp Oil much better, and since we use it, that's what Nikki uses. Hemp Oil has a good ratio of Omega 3, 6, and 9, and tastes very similar to sunflower seeds. I buy Nutiva Organic hemp oil on amazon.com. They have a great price. I think that dogs get omega 6 and 9 oils in meat, but adding an Omega mix shouldn't hurt the dog, but you might want to check with Dr. Harvey.

You could always cook the meat in a bit of olive oil to get other Omegas, then add an Omega 3 oil to the mix. I don't think the Veg to Bowl mix needs oil because there are no grains, but you might like to add a little omega 3 oil in, but check with Dr. Harvey first, to see if that is okay.

If you want to supplement the Veg to Bowl, he sells that whole food vitamin formula in a powder. I looked at it on Only Natural Pet store. There's a geriatric and puppy version, too. I like the regular version.


http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/products/Dr-...ent/269030.aspx


Nikki eats all of it, and doesn't have a problem with messiness. I put the food in a plate with a "lip" around it, and I keep her face hair cut short. Her ears sometimes get a little messy, but I wipe them off after. I'm thinking of using a band to hold her ears back. 


Hope this helps.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

*UPDATE:
*
I saw Nikki's holistic vet (Dr. Wynn) today. Here is her take on Dr. Harvey's food. She thinks that Dr. Harvey's food mix should be fed intermittently only, unless you add a supplement customized to go with the food. While she thinks that Dr. Harvey's pre-mix contains excellent ingredients, since Dr. Harvey's does not have a guaranteed analysis of the vitamins/minerals, and over a long period of time, nutritional deficiencies could develop. Dr. Wynn would not recommend Dr. Harvey's as a _primary_ food.

Please remember that this is one holistic veterinarian's opinion. Everyone has to decide for themselves concerning this food. Dr. Wynn, Nikki's vet, is very conservative even though she is a holistic vet. 

Dr. Wynn had no problem with Nikki eating Dr. Harvey's a few times a month* if *I am feeding either a good commercial food, preferably organic, or a nutritionally complete home-cooked diet the rest of the time.

I'm going the home cooked route this week.And use Dr. Harvey's too, occasionally.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 3 2008, 07:06 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=615460


> Dr. Goldstein is a respected vet. nutritionist and he highly recommended Dr. Harvey's, and he did know I'd be using it when he made Perri's neutraceutical powder.[/B]



QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 5 2008, 11:31 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=616176


> *UPDATE:
> *
> I saw Nikki's holistic vet (Dr. Wynn) today. Here is her take on Dr. Harvey's food. She thinks that Dr. Harvey's food mix should be fed intermittently only, unless you add a supplement customized to go with the food. While she thinks that Dr. Harvey's pre-mix contains excellent ingredients, since Dr. Harvey's does not have a guaranteed analysis of the vitamins/minerals, and over a long period of time, nutritional deficiencies could develop. Dr. Wynn would not recommend Dr. Harvey's as a _primary_ food.
> 
> ...


Hmmmmm....which is what Dr. Goldstein did for Perri. Drat. I don't want to bring in a food that is not complete and balanced. And double drat. I don't have a true holistic vet or vet nutritionist anywhere around here to help customize one for my two. *sigh* Back to the drawing board. :smstarz: 

And I was so looking forward to opening this thread all day!


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

Crystal, while I have a holistic vet, she's not also a nutritionist like Suzan's, so that's why I went to Dr. Goldstein but everything was done over the phone when he consulted with me about the results of the nutritional blood test and diet as he is in CT. So there is still an option for you to consult with one over the phone. Then you could find out about a good vitamin blend to add to it. Dr. Harvey's makes one but I'm not sure if it's really meant for use with the food as half of the ingredients are already in the food... Maybe Missing Link? Or maybe a vitamin that Dr. Goldstein himself has formulated that is for sale called Dr. Bob's Health Nuggets. I'm sure there are lots of options where this is concerned!


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

QUOTE (PreciousPrince @ Aug 5 2008, 10:00 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=616396


> Crystal, while I have a holistic vet, she's not also a nutritionist like Suzan's, so that's why I went to Dr. Goldstein but everything was done over the phone when he consulted with me about the results of the nutritional blood test and diet as he is in CT. So there is still an option for you to consult with one over the phone. Then you could find out about a good vitamin blend to add to it. Dr. Harvey's makes one but I'm not sure if it's really meant for use with the food as half of the ingredients are already in the food... Maybe Missing Link? Or maybe a vitamin that Dr. Goldstein himself has formulated that is for sale called Dr. Bob's Health Nuggets. I'm sure there are lots of options where this is concerned![/B]


Thanks Ashley. I've thought of doing that for my two, but wouldn't it have to be custom blended for any of my customers too? I'm wondering if one basic supplement added to it would be ok in general. I think it needs to be custom blended for each pet, that is my understanding anyway.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

IMO, if people fed Dr. Harvey's premix plus their proteins and oils and then for insurance added a good supplement of their choice, it would STILL be better than feeding commercial kibble. That's just my opinion and not based on scientific investigation. Dogs do require certain vitamins/minerals, but there are some synthetic supplements out there that are good quality.

I'm sure that Dr. Harvey has customers who use his food and don't add a custom supplement. I do not know whether that works for their dogs or not, but I guess everyone has to make up their own mind. Like I said before, my vet is very conservative. Believe it or not, she said that regular adult Centrum is an okay vitamin for some dogs. I'm following my vet's advice and do mostly home cooked, because I have decided to trust her judgment. But I am still going to use Dr. Harvey's, probably one day per week - without a custom supplement added.


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## PreciousPrince (Feb 27, 2006)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Aug 6 2008, 02:33 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=616600


> IMO, if people fed Dr. Harvey's premix plus their proteins and oils and then for insurance added a good supplement of their choice, it would STILL be better than feeding commercial kibble.[/B]


I agree, because it's less processed and everything hasn't been cooked out of it. Suzan please correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think by custom the vet meant doing the NBT that I did. (Even I admit it's a bit over the top, and I also wanted to do it just to have a knowledge of Perri's overall health as a preventive measure.) By custom I'm thinking she meant taking into consideration the particular food and then adding the supplement that would compliment it the best. 
You already know what oils work well for your two and carry them, so all you need now is the general vitamin part. If you had a quick phone consult with a nutritionist to get a recommendation for it, you could carry that and be able to assure your customers that they would be getting a good general maintenance food. And, they would be impressed that you took the time to really find out about it and make sure it was.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

The holistic vet was concerned about the overall nutritional content of the food after it is mixed with the proteins and the oils. Does it contain everything the dog needs? You can't really tell because the food doesn't have a guaranteed analysis of the vitamin/mineral content. So I think that if a very good multi vitamin/mineral were added to the product, it would certainly be "insurance," but keep in mind that you would still not be able to know EXACTLY how much of every vitamin/mineral your dog was getting above and beyond the amounts that are contained in the supplement because Dr. Harvey doesn' have a guaranteed analysis of his food. If people don't have to know they exact amounts and are comfortable feeding their dog the food plus a supplement, that's really their decision. 

The thing, is, how do we really know the vitamin/mineral content of any commercial dog food kibble or canned, except for what's written on the label? How do we know that the vitamins/minerals that are added are good/effective/not out of date? How do we know they added the proper amounts? We really don't know for sure if our dogs are getting what they need. 

But I'd have to say I'd feel more comfortable in choosing their proteins, adding the Dr Harvey's veggies/grains, good omega oils, and then a good supplement than I would feeding Eukanuba or Science Diet. But that's just me.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Hmmmm....and how do we know what ever vitamins and minerals added to regular canned and kibble food has not been cooked or processed out of it?

I understand the importance and actual benefit of adding the protein of your choice and a good vitamin supplement of your choice. Just don't know if the average person will understand that and feel that it should already be in the food. Any thoughts or comments on how to educate people on this point?


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