# Questions about mats



## Leila'sMommy (Oct 20, 2012)

I'm sure this has been asked before but I can't find the answers I'm looking for. Leila has been fine with me brushing her ever since shortly after getting her. Well, she never has really liked her face being combed, but it's not as big a problem anymore. All of a sudden, she started hating it when I brush her ears several months ago and is still this way. Her ears were clear at the last checkup about a month ago and she still doesn't have any kind of odor there and the look fine from what I can see. But she keeps getting mats on the tip of her ears even though I brush her at least once a day. Another thing is she no longer let's me stand her up to brush her belly and she keeps getting mats there also, in the chest area. She started hating her ears being brushed and not liking to stand a few months ago, around 9 months old. Nothing has happened around here that I know of to cause this change. The groomer never said anything there did either. Do you think it could be part of the age? The only place she allows me to brush/comb her is on the grooming table or counter. I've tried holding her in my lap like a baby to brush her tummy, but she only wants to play with the brush and bite it like a toy when I do that. I want to give her a bath today but I've got to get these mats out first and by the time I "wrestle" (not literally) with her to do all that, I'm too tired for the bath. She never got mats before her coat started changing and I thought I'd gotten lucky. But once it changed, she gets mats so easily now. 

By the way, I do have Kinky Curly Knot Today and I use it to try to get any mats out during the bath that I may have missed during brushing & combing. 

Do you have any other suggestions? 


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## dmsl (Jan 26, 2013)

On tough mats that I just cant work out with kinky knot today I use thinning shears and cut it out...it never shows as its not a straight cut with regular scissors. You can buy them at any pet store...and I try to work on them after a play session and a treat or two so booboo is tired and willing to lay in my lap pretty still. Or...since I dont have a grooming table I have found the ironing board is great! Perfect height for me and he sits or stands knowing he cant jump off! I still keep one hand on him just in case he tries to back up.


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## nwyant1946 (Jan 2, 2013)

*I love my portable grooming table. If I try to stand and groom her, my back will be on fire in no time. So my table is perfect. I set it on the hassock in front of the sofa, hook her up and I can sit and blow dry and brush until she's done with no discomfort.*


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## Zoe's Mom88 (Apr 25, 2011)

Brushing alone isn't enough. You also need a Buttercomb which you would use after brushing. You would be surprised how many knots there still are after you brushed her. Also, I find that their ears sometime hang down into their food while eating and that may be why the ends of her ears are knotted....they get wet. I know that happens with Zoe since her hair is on the longer side.


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## Leila'sMommy (Oct 20, 2012)

I do have some thinning shears and will try those on the mats I can't get out. Thanks!

My grooming table isn't portable. Maybe I should get one because my back also hurts when standing and I need knee replacements. But hubby just have me this table for Valentine's, so I still need to use it some too. 

You're right, I do need to get a butter comb. I've been using the wide tooth part of her mustache comb but since she's bigger now, it's not big enough for her body. 

It's not actually at the tip of the hair on her ears, but up where the skin part is at the tip. 


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Pam-I think you said you are using the mustache comb only. I bet that is part of the problem. It is prob taking longer to remove mats and comb in general, esp when she is wet. I bought a good comb last year finally, and a CC slicker brush. My groomer showed me how to run the slicker over them first and it makes the mats much smaller by time I comb them out. I separate the tail in pieces and that helps if she has mats there. I used to cut them some, then I learned to run slicker over them first, and try to pull it apart some, then comb little bits at a time. Penny does not have alot of mats, but when she got a bad one, I was cutting them some, so I was glad to know how to avoid that. If dry groom, I run wet comb along the bottom of ears first, then small sections on ears at a time with Penny, she pulls away too. Then I can brush them good. They get tiny knots some days from the water bowl/food, like Barbie said. My breeder said to first wet the comb for face or ear daily combing if you have snags in coat. I picked up my comb and slicker at Eukanuba booth. Cathy showed them to me. I love them both. I have the med size Greyhound SS comb with a handle. 
Penny is not 2 yet, and she started rebelling in general, by sitting down a lot, and circling the table. I tried the leash some, but I didn't stick with it. I use a heavier grooming table like yours. I asked my groomer about this, and she said she stands fine for her. She told me to use the leash on a front leg or loose around her neck/shoulders. Just kinda hang it on her. Just having it there helps. She stopped the dropping down right off, and was more still. Took a bit, but now she knows when I put in on right away. I don't have to leave it on the whole time now. Groomer said if they know they can :smmadder:they will try anything to make us STOP. 
With me, I had to be more assertive with her, and use the leash. But I know even with a better comb and the slicker brush running over her first really cut down on the grooming time and on those difficult areas. I _really_ like it for the legs too..:thumbsup: 

Good luck....:wub: I know what your dealing with for sure.


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## Bailey&Me (Mar 8, 2010)

I'm looking forward to reading everyone's replies because I am going through similar things with Emma. She is seven months old now and is starting to mat quite a bit  I brush her daily but can't keep the mats away still. Over the past couple of weeks I have been in the process of moving and have been crazy busy...so I haven't been that good about Emma's grooming  She went two weeks without her bath and although I have been brushing her, I must not have been doing a very thorough job because she was full of mats!  So last night I spent THREE hours bathing and grooming her! I painstakingly took each mat out and thank goodness she was a good sport about it, poor thing. I had the toughest time with her tummy though. There was a row of nasty mats going across her chest...probably from her harness...that I just had to cut out. I was soooo sad to cut it but she's not that great with laying on her back for tummy grooming yet...and it's a sensitive area so I didn't want to push her. I will try thinning shears as someone suggested, for next time I need to cut out a mat. I used the Kinky Curly Knot Today stuff and also John Paul Detangling spray and the combination of the two helped a lot. 


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Wanted to add, the thing that helps me with mats MOST is when I use the slicker brush or a comb (not brush) quickly over Penny's chest and armpits nightly near bedtime. I didn't always make it every night and often used a brush instead. I think they make them worse when laying down sleeping for hours. So doing it late I see less mats now. :thumbsup:


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## eiksaa (Jun 8, 2012)

Nida, I have found their hair definitely mats more when it's not the cleanest. When we first brought Mieka home, Gustave had gone about 7 days without a bath already. By the 3rd day of having her here I was worried he was going to be constantly matted forever. 

Well, I gave him a bath and it cut down on the matting! No more matting on the first 5 days or so after a bath even when they play all the time. On the 6th day he starts showing some signs of mats that tells me he needs a bath pronto. 

Mieka has a trouble free coat that doesn't mat. She does tend to mat on her belly though. I know this isn't the correct answer for anyone who's trying to grow out their coat, but for us the answer was just trimming the belly way shorter than the rest of her coat. I also think it will help her stay cool this summer. 

I have used kinky curly knot and I always found it worked best if I applied it right after their bath, before drying. The coat stayed generally easier to maintain till next bath. And then spot application whenever I found mats. However, I have recently switched to Crown Royale conditioning spray and I really like that also. While it works the same as KKN for dematting, I find it leaves a better coat texture. Also, it is very easy to spray a diluted version on their coats daily pre brushing to get the coat wet.

About making them used to lying down for tummy grooming, I went through the whole process with Gustave after I saw Carina and Stacy do it at nationals. Oh boy, it has simplified grooming time so much. He is a fighter but not he's completely used to it. Something that worked for me in the beginning was instead of laying him on my legs, perpendicular to my torso (like I saw Stacy and Carina do), I sat down 'Indian style' (is that considered offensive?) and put him on my lap parallel to my torso, craddling him like a baby with one arm, but letting his body rest on my lap. He was much better about that and I can now just put him belly up on my legs the correct way.

About tools, I always find using my fingers faster than using a brush, comb or slicker comb. I wet my fingers with detangling spray, start from the ends and pull hair out little by little and then use a comb to make sure I got everything.


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## Tashulia25 (May 19, 2013)

nwyant1946 said:


> *I love my portable grooming table. If I try to stand and groom her, my back will be on fire in no time. So my table is perfect. I set it on the hassock in front of the sofa, hook her up and I can sit and blow dry and brush until she's done with no discomfort.*


I have my portable table transformed in to this  My hubby got the table top out from table base and attached it in to my drawers  My boy loves to watch what is going on outside while I groom him 


























Zoe's Mom88 said:


> Brushing alone isn't enough. You also need a Buttercomb which you would use after brushing. You would be surprised how many knots there still are after you brushed her. Also, I find that their ears sometime hang down into their food while eating and that may be why the ends of her ears are knotted....they get wet. I know that happens with Zoe since her hair is on the longer side.


:thumbsup: I love to use Chris Christensen buttercomb


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Bailey&Me said:


> I'm looking forward to reading everyone's replies because I am going through similar things with Emma. She is seven months old now and is starting to mat quite a bit  I brush her daily but can't keep the mats away still. Over the past couple of weeks I have been in the process of moving and have been crazy busy...so I haven't been that good about Emma's grooming  She went two weeks without her bath and although I have been brushing her, I must not have been doing a very thorough job because she was full of mats!  So last night I spent THREE hours bathing and grooming her! I painstakingly took each mat out and thank goodness she was a good sport about it, poor thing. I had the toughest time with her tummy though. There was a row of nasty mats going across her chest...probably from her harness...that I just had to cut out. I was soooo sad to cut it but she's not that great with laying on her back for tummy grooming yet...and it's a sensitive area so I didn't want to push her. I will try thinning shears as someone suggested, for next time I need to cut out a mat. I used the Kinky Curly Knot Today stuff and also John Paul Detangling spray and the combination of the two helped a lot.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using PG Free


Nida, Don't feel bad about it. I never had issue with Sammie, he just does not mat. Well, I was not prepared for Penny:smhelp:and didn't realize how fast they formed. :smhelp:I went through same thing as you are now with Emma and after couple times of having to use scissors too, that cured me. I talked to the groomer, and started nightly combing her arm pits and tail, and no more bad matting. My new groomer table and slicker CC slicker have been godsends.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

eiksaa said:


> Nida, I have found their hair definitely mats more when it's not the cleanest. When we first brought Mieka home, Gustave had gone about 7 days without a bath already. By the 3rd day of having her here I was worried he was going to be constantly matted forever.
> 
> Well, I gave him a bath and it cut down on the matting! No more matting on the first 5 days or so after a bath even when they play all the time. On the 6th day he starts showing some signs of mats that tells me he needs a bath pronto.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the good tip. :thumbsup: Ya know my breeder mentioned this, I totally forgot about it. she says wetting the comb for face helps too.


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## Tashulia25 (May 19, 2013)

another good thing to use the leave-on conditioner. I spray my madden brush and brush my babies


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## Leila'sMommy (Oct 20, 2012)

Thanks for all the great tips! I will certainly be using them. We have a slicker brush around here somewhere, but if I can't find it, I'm getting a new one tomorrow. I'm also getting a bigger comb and going to start brushing right before bed. I usually do it in the morning so I can do her topknot for the day and get her hair out of her eyes. I have noticed Leila doesn't mat as easily also when she's recently gotten a bath. 


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

When you cut matting out, you create hair of multiple lengths growing together which can create more mats. Keep in mind to try to gently remove mats with as little hair loss as possible. 
Clean dogs mat less. If my dog is going through a coat change, bathing more often can be helpful (like every 3-4 days). 
I use treats to teach my dog how to stand and lay for grooming. Once they have a basic understanding, I will gently hold them still if they fuss. Just a firm "knock it off" and place them back where you want, reward with a treat when they are good.


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## vjw (Dec 20, 2006)

Also, there's less matting if the coat is well conditioned.


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## Bailey&Me (Mar 8, 2010)

eiksaa said:


> Nida, I have found their hair definitely mats more when it's not the cleanest. When we first brought Mieka home, Gustave had gone about 7 days without a bath already. By the 3rd day of having her here I was worried he was going to be constantly matted forever.
> 
> Well, I gave him a bath and it cut down on the matting! No more matting on the first 5 days or so after a bath even when they play all the time. On the 6th day he starts showing some signs of mats that tells me he needs a bath pronto.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice, Aastha! I really need to work on teaching Emma to lay on her back for tummy grooming. I don't think I saw it at Nationals, but last time I was at Carina's, she showed me how she trims paw pads and feet with the dog laying in her lap on their backs...makes it sooo much easier! I'll definitely work on Emma more on that. I'll try your method of cradling her like a baby at first and then working my way up to being able to lay her on my legs the right way. You have a good point about them matting less when they're cleaner. Now I'm not sure if her mats were due to her coat changing or due to the fact that her coat's getting longer and I just need to be more diligent about bathing her every week or sooner. 

I'll try using my fingers more to pull apart a mat - but what I was doing was, with one hand, holding the part of her coat with the mat in it as close to the skin as I could get, and then then with the other hand using a slicker brush to loosen up the mat a bit...and then combing it out. 
Trying to minimize how much I'm pulling on poor Emma. 

Oh and I heard about Crowne Royale conditioner from April and she loves using it for her Eva too. Maybe I'll give that one a shot. 

Thanks again for all the helpful tips!


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

jmm said:


> When you cut matting out, you create hair of multiple lengths growing together which can create more mats. Keep in mind to try to gently remove mats with as little hair loss as possible.
> Clean dogs mat less. If my dog is going through a coat change, bathing more often can be helpful (like every 3-4 days).
> I use treats to teach my dog how to stand and lay for grooming. Once they have a basic understanding, I will gently hold them still if they fuss. Just a firm "knock it off" and place them back where you want, reward with a treat when they are good.


I always appreciate your training tips Jackie. I will use some treats today for Penny after her bath.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

vjw said:


> Also, there's less matting if the coat is well conditioned.


So true-:thumbsup:- I ran out of conditioner once!!


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Leila'sMommy said:


> Thanks for all the great tips! I will certainly be using them. We have a slicker brush around here somewhere, but if I can't find it, I'm getting a new one tomorrow. I'm also getting a bigger comb and going to start brushing right before bed. I usually do it in the morning so I can do her topknot for the day and get her hair out of her eyes. I have noticed Leila doesn't mat as easily also when she's recently gotten a bath.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Pam-you may already have good ones, but I picked up a couple slickers at petstore before I bought the CCrissman (spell?) at a show, what a huge difference. I love the shape, and size. Was about 30-40.00, so almost didn't get it, so glad I did.


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## IzzysBellasMom (Jan 16, 2013)

With Izzy's coat short, she doesn't get very many mats. She also gets bathed twice a week now (one at home on the weekend and once at day care on Wednesdays). My groomer at day care uses the slicker brush on her and I told her I had tried it and she hated it, she actually growled at me. The groomer said to take the brush out and rub it a few times on the concrete, it makes the tips not as sharp so it won't hurt her skin. I haven't done it yet because I love my Maden brush and it works just fine, but I have a slicker or 2 and I guess if I ever need them I know how to get them ready to use.


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## Leila'sMommy (Oct 20, 2012)

SammieMom said:


> Pam-you may already have good ones, but I picked up a couple slickers at petstore before I bought the CCrissman (spell?) at a show, what a huge difference. I love the shape, and size. Was about 30-40.00, so almost didn't get it, so glad I did.


I just looked on his site and found several. Which one do you use?
http://www.chrissystems.com/groomin...ooming-show-dog-and-cat-slicker-brushes-.aspx


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