# Deposit before puppy is born



## TheMunchkin (Oct 18, 2008)

In doing research from reputable breeders, I realized that each breeder does things a little bit differently from each other. I spoke with one breeder who told me that she does not have very many litters a year, and once she does they have usually been held for someone who put has put down monetary deposit beforehand. My question is, how typical is it for breeders to ask for a deposit before you can see the puppy? She let me know the sire and dam. And would you personally ever put a deposit beforehand?

Insight and opinions are very much appreciated!


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## missiek (Jan 2, 2010)

I have heard of that as well. I don't know why she would require a deposit to even *see* the puppy. Personally, I would want to see and hold a pup before making a deposit...Just to make sure that that was the pup for me, and they were healthy, etc.


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

I only breed when I want something for me. For that reason I don't even have a "waiting list." When I receive inquiries about puppies I let people know that (1) I have something available; (2) I am expecting a litter; (3) I have nothing available but plan to breed later in the year so check back with me during X month; or (4) I have nothing available and no breedings planned for the near future but I'd be happy to help you hook up with some other breeders who may have something. I do not take a deposit before a litter is born because generally I don't know how many puppies are in the litter until shortly before they are born, don't know whether they will be boys or girls, and don't know what I might want to keep. When I do have a litter on the ground and know what, if anything, I might be keeping then I will have serious conversations with prospective puppy owners and, yes, I do ask for a non-refundable 50% deposit in order to hold a puppy for someone. Until recently I did not require a deposit but after more than once having held a puppy for someone who then decided not to get it while I have turned away other wonderful prospects I do now require a deposit. And until I receive the deposit no puppy is "on hold".

Every breeder does it differently based on what they feel works best for them and their puppies.


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## aprilb (Jul 9, 2010)

I would never put a deposit on any puppy before it is born or before I see it. I have put a deposit on a puppy AFTER I saw it, asked my questions, got to know the breeder, and made a decision to purchase. Some breeders do ask for deposits if you want the puppy especially if you can't pick it up right away. There is nothing wrong with that, imo. Like Mary H said, the puppy is being held and other folks are being turned away that would be good home prospects. I used to be a breeder and it is very expensive. You could be breaking even and everybody's fine, then have a c-section and still lose the whole litter. I was always in the hole. :huh: That deposit goes for the care and feeding of the puppy until the new owner picks him/or her up.:thumbsup:


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## LJSquishy (Feb 27, 2008)

I believe in most cases where the breeder asks for a deposit on an unborn puppy in a litter, if you are not 100% satisfied with the puppy produced by the breeding whether it be the fact that the sex you wanted was not born, or the estimated adult size is smaller/larger than what you had discussed with the breeder, etc, your deposit is transferable to a future litter. If the breeder is not willing to let you have a floating deposit like that, I would personally walk away. It is not terribly uncommon to put a deposit down on a future breeding, though.


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## princessre (Dec 23, 2008)

I think it depends how specific you are in what you're looking for. I wanted healthy, sweet, of course. But I wanted a specific look, i.e. baby doll head, small size, etc. There were a couple breeders that tended to produce the look that I was after. For those two or three breeders, I would not have a problem putting down a deposit before the pup was born at all. For other breeders, I would have to see the pups first. That's me. But for you, if you do not have a very specific look or type or line in mind, then there is no reason I can think of for you to put a deposit down beforehand.


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## Cosy (Feb 9, 2006)

I'm not a fan of making a deposit on a pup I could not even see first, either with pics or in person.


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## Furbaby's Mommie (Jul 10, 2004)

The breeders I am interested in puppies from all breed for themselves not for clients (For Sale). They most often don't know if a puppy is probably going to be shown until about 16-17 wks. and many times until their permanent teeth come in at about 6 mo. So giving a deposit on a puppy before there is one available doesn't suit my situation. 

Maybe I'm just too particular, but I also want to see how a pup will change between birth and 3-4 mo., not only physically but how they develop in personality. I'm not fixated on a particular breeder and their "look". I'm fixated on a beautiful healthy sweet dog who is as close to "standard" as possible--so I won't be giving a breeder an indefinite term deposit for someday.

It would be lovely to have such a close relationship with a person who is breeding your breed of choice that you would want *"their" *puppy only, and that would be the only reason I can see to deposit for "someday". That person would probably live close enough that you could develop a close relationship of trust, and you would also have intimate knowledge of their dogs and the breeding practices and socialization of their puppies. I'm not lucky enough to have breeders here in Oregon I can socialize with! Darn it!:angry: Even shows I can attend are very rare. I just keep trying to absorb enough long-distant knowledge to suffice. Not an easy way, especially when you are so particular about 'who' you add to your family for a lifetime.B)


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

I don't think there's anything wrong with others choosing to buy a puppy sight unseen, but it's not my thing. 

Personality and temperament are really really important to me, and then there is that "sixth sense" thing, where you just know whether a dog is right for you and vice versa. I must meet and hang out with the puppy first to see if we "click."


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## princessre (Dec 23, 2008)

You might ask the breeder if you can have the deposit back if you don't end up getting the pup from them. I have a good friendship with the breeder I put down the deposit for, and she did not hesitate to give me back my deposit when I found a pup somewhere else. I know of a member here who wanted her deposit back from another breeder, and that breeder was unwilling, to say the least. That did not turn out too pretty. So maybe ask if it's nonrefundable.


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## CloudClan (Jan 31, 2007)

This breeder is asking for it because he/she can. However, personally, given the huge number of things that can go wrong with an expected litter I can not imagine paying a deposit based on a "planned breeding" or even a litter that was due any day. So many things would be up in the air at that point. 

I will tell you that I know many reputable show breeders with beautiful puppies available right now who do not require such a thing. So while this breeder can certainly ask that of you, remember you have lots of options as well.


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

It's interesting, I think, how things differ also from breed to breed as well as breeder to breeder. I have a friend who breeds Akitas, has bred them for years, including multiple Best In Show dogs. She will not even do a breeding anymore unless she has deposits for at least 5 or 6 puppies. She has awesome dogs, a stellar reputation, and apparently has the flexibility to breed what she wants, when she wants, and for whom she wants. So again, I don't think there is any set "rule of thumb" to go by. Personally, at the present time I do not take deposits before a litter is born nor do I have (or want) a waiting list. That's not to say that I won't do something differently in the future.


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## CloudClan (Jan 31, 2007)

MaryH said:


> It's interesting, I think, how things differ also from breed to breed as well as breeder to breeder. I have a friend who breeds Akitas, has bred them for years, including multiple Best In Show dogs. She will not even do a breeding anymore unless she has deposits for at least 5 or 6 puppies. She has awesome dogs, a stellar reputation, and apparently has the flexibility to breed what she wants, when she wants, and for whom she wants. So again, I don't think there is any set "rule of thumb" to go by. Personally, at the present time I do not take deposits before a litter is born nor do I have (or want) a waiting list. That's not to say that I won't do something differently in the future.


I think that there is a big reason that such a thing could be done in Akitas but would not be wise to do with Maltese. Maltese commonly have very small litters. Akitas have huge litters. And larger breeds do not nearly have the newborn mortality rate that Toy breeds do. 

Again, the breeder has every right to ask for it. But on the part of the buyer? I personally think the buyer would be taking a big gamble to put down a deposit on a litter unborn. To do so, they would have to ask, what would happen to the deposit if the puppies all die, if it is true the breeder breeds rarely would they be expected to wait until the next breeding which could be a year from now? I would hope the deposit is fully refundable, but I would still be uncomfortable handing over my money and expecting a full refund if things do not work out. I have heard too many times about buyers who had to "fight" to get their money back. Or who did not get their money back at all. I heard a story of a buyer for a show dog whose dog did not turn out. The contact said she gets one of equal value in replacement. However, the breeder has not had a litter of viable pups in almost 2 years. She still does not have her "replacement" pup. 

I say again, the breeder can ask it, but as a buyer I would recognize the many options that a buyer has of wonderful breeders out there who would not require this and I would move on.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

I personally would never ask for a deposit on an unborn litter, mostly because I breed for my next show dog, not just to have puppies to sell. If I let someone put down a deposit on an unborn litter, I wouldn't feel I had the option to keep what I want for show. What if there is only one pup in the litter? 

I do not ask for a deposit but am beginning to see the wisdom of asking for one once the litter has been evaluated for show and puppies are available, for the same reasons Mary has started asking for a deposit.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

I would have to agree w/most of what has been discussed. The breeder has to protect itself against someone just opting out when others have been declined. As a buyer I also have the option not to pay deposit, wait, take my chances on getting something I value after viewing. With Kitzel I only saw photos but agreed to buy and made a deposit sight unseen (in person) because I knew the reputation of the breeder. I have NOT been disappointed! I did do lots of research before hand so I sort of KNEW what to expect. 
I think it is fair for the breeder to ask for a deposit, but I would not go there until the litter was born & I had some assurance that this was a good idea!


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## TheMunchkin (Oct 18, 2008)

Wow... there is so many things to consider. In my situation right now, I would definitely have a "floating" deposit, where if there is not one PERFECT baby for me in this upcoming litter, it would automatically transfer to the next litter...It's tempting for me because it is a reputable breeder whose babies are absolutely stunning and the price is just right. Plus, I'm just not in any hurry at all. But, with that said (thanks to everyone here!), I now understand what my choices are and how I don't have to stick around if I don't have to. 

Thank you everyone and also to Mary and Stacy for giving me the perspective on the other end of the spectrum!


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

I forgot to say that I also studied the pedigree carefully and asked specific questions that were pertinent to me & what I wanted. I did consider other breeders----and I prayed for wisdom!


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

edelweiss said:


> I think it is fair for the breeder to ask for a deposit, but I would not go there until the litter was born & I had some assurance that this was a good idea!


My thoughts exactly.


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## Tina (Aug 6, 2006)

[quote/from Mary H] When I do have a litter on the ground and know what, if anything, I might be keeping then I will have serious conversations with prospective puppy owners and, yes, I do ask for a non-refundable 50% deposit in order to hold a puppy for someone. *Until recently I did not require a deposit but after more than once having held a puppy for someone who then decided not to get it while I have turned away other wonderful prospects I do now require a deposit. And until I receive the deposit no puppy is "on hold"*.[/quote]

With the economy this is happening more and more. I like, Mary and Stacy, never asked for a deposit because I know people change their minds in buying a puppy. I have been left with puppies someone agreed to purchase and then at the last minute back out. I am left with older puppies that people do not want to buy. We are all in a difficult situation when breeding for puppies for show because right now people are very careful what they purchase and commit to right now. I don't want to put a puppy or dog into a situation where someone cannot afford to care for them anymore. JMO


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

TheMunchkin said:


> Wow... there is so many things to consider. In my situation right now, I would definitely have a "floating" deposit, where if there is not one PERFECT baby for me in this upcoming litter, it would automatically transfer to the next litter...It's tempting for me because it is a reputable breeder whose babies are absolutely stunning and the price is just right. Plus, I'm just not in any hurry at all. But, with that said (thanks to everyone here!), I now understand what my choices are and how I don't have to stick around if I don't have to.
> 
> Thank you everyone and also to Mary and Stacy for giving me the perspective on the other end of the spectrum!


As a breeder ... I'm only going to sell a puppy to someone I LOVE, TRUST, AND THINK WILL FOREVER DO RIGHT BY THE PUPPY. If I really find that person but don't have what they want then I will call them when the next litter is born. In the meantime, if I think that person is so awesome that I'd sell them one of my puppies, then I also think they are deserving of having whatever puppy they want. And so I'm not going to take a deposit from someone on something I don't have, thus binding them financially and emotionally for what could be a very indefinite period of time.

As a dog owner ... I'm not an internet shopper and don't buy sight unseen. If I can't at the very least see pictures as well as a pedigree no money is going to leave my hands.


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## ariamaltese (May 10, 2005)

I make it an option for potential families looking to acquire a puppy. I have had actually had a family very upset when a puppy they were interested in was placed with a different family, because I never heard back from the first family and presumed they had moved on or decided they did not want a Maltese puppy. She asked me "why didn't you just ask for a deposit - I would have held the puppy?" So, now I explain to people via email and clearly if you really want to hold a puppy, I can accept a deposit, but it certainly is not required. However, I cannot guarantee the puppy will be available if you do not place a deposit. I leave it up to the family/person to decide whether they wish to hold or not hold the puppy. I also explain, I will choose the puppy -- b/c I agree as a Show Breeder you may decide that you wish to hold back a puppy for show, so, I further explain at about 8 weeks when they come to visit the puppy, or I will send multiple pictures if they are not local, and if they decide that is the puppy for them and I concur it is a good match too then the deposit converts to non-refundable. I don't believe it is reasonable for 1) the family/person to not at least see/visit the puppy prior to the deposit converting to non-refundable 2) the show Breeder to hold a puppy, accept a deposit, turn away other good families/persons as good matches for the puppy and then later (again, following being able to see/get pictures of the puppy) still be required to return the deposit.

I think it's just about being fair to both parties and trying to place yourself in each person's shoes, if you will. So, now for my interested parties it is an option, but not required -- and I believe that actually ends up working reasonably well.

Heidi
:: aria maltese ::


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## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

Heidi -- that is an excellent policy and fair, imho, to both you and the buyer. It is very similar to how I handled deposits when I was breeding Lhasas.


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## jpupart (Jul 19, 2010)

I did put a deposit on a puppy sight unseen, although the litter had been born. The breeder knew what I was looking for in my puppy as I was quite specific. As the puppy got older she was going to be quite a bit larger than what I wanted and her personality was too shy.I went to see the puppy early as I had concerns and didn't want the breeder to hold her for me if she wasn't going to be what I wanted. The breeder was very good about refunding my deposit, although she said I could wait for the next litter. I then found little Candy from Joyce who did not require a deposit- mainly because she breeds for herself (or to show homes) and generally keeps hers until she knows if they are show potential. As she had 3 female pups all pretty close in age, she was willing to let me have one of them. Just good timing I guess on my part!


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## Furbaby's Mommie (Jul 10, 2004)

:thumbsup: and what a little beauty she is!!


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## jpupart (Jul 19, 2010)

Furbaby's Mommie said:


> :thumbsup: and what a little beauty she is!!


Awwwwww.... Candy says "thank you!":wub:


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