# PRO PAC???? has anyone tried it??



## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi everyone:

Once again I need your advice, please... I'm very worried and VERY frustated, let me explain you why...

... My little baby has high cholesterol, in July 2009 she had it very high so my vet told me to change her food (Royal Canin Mini Junior to Hill's i/d), and plus we started doing more exercise (at least 1hr or more walking/jogging every day). Here in my country (Chile) you can only find a package of 9 kilos (very expensive if I might add) and canned. As you might guess my little baby girl is really picky with her food, she didn't like the dry food so she only eat it wet (the can). After a couple of weeks she didn't wanted to eat that food anymore, she starved for like 1 & half day (I was freaking out), and the only food she would eat was her RoyalCanin MiniJunior so I gave it to her. Now she's 14 months old so she's eating Royal Canin Mini Adult, she loves it and still refuses to eat Hill's i/d dry or wet (in fact I gave that food to another puppy who needed it, since I wasn't using it). Past february I did her blood test again, her total cholesterol is ok but the LDL & VLDL cholesterol are still high (LDL: 62.3 mg/dl normal: 30-60 mg/dl, VLDL: 48.2 mg/dl normal: 20-35 mg/dl), so the vet told me she should eat Hill's i/d again and permanently now... The thing is: she just DOESN'T eat that food, I've tried everything: mixing her RoyalCanin dry with Hill's dry, Royal dry w/ Hill's wet, etc etc etc, and NOTHING, she doesn't eat, she starve for like 1 or 1 & half day and then someone at home (my mom, my little sibs or me) gave her Royal...... Since she refuses strongly to eat Hill's I've started to look for another food that might help her, and this is how I found out 'bout Royal Canin Low Fat Digestive, it seems like the perfect solution for her: very very low fat content and plus since she's a RoyalCanin fan it might work for her......... the problem (BIG problem): this food is NOT avaliable in my country..... but that didn't stop me, I tried to find it in a neighbour country: Argentina, it's relativly close and making a big effort I can pay a really fast trip there to buy the food........ again the BIG problem issssssss: NOT avaliable there also!!!..... So I've tried to reach RoyalCanin at my country and they just told me that RoyalCanin Low Fat Digestive is NOT avaliable in South America (thank you very much!!)... So I was very frustated, that's one thing that I hate living here: there is so so little product variety here, I must confess that I'm a little jealous of you guys: you always talk 'bout a huge variety of products (shampoos, conditioners, food, treats, etc etc) and here I've NOTHING!!! ... Well, anyway, back to the topic: today I've decided to make another try and look for another brand of food for my baby, I've found PRO PAC Premium Low Fat, there's a couple of persons that import that food (actually just 2) and in their add they wrote that this brand's sales are higher than Royal's in USA... is that true??... has anyone of you tried this food??, is it good?, is it similar to Hill's i/d??... I'm asking you for any feedback 'bout this brand please...

THANK YOU GUYS!!


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Ingredients and quality can vary by where a food is made. Is this food imported from the U.S.? 
You might get a second opinion...my vet wasn't excited about the values you posted.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

I didn't even realize our pets were tested for cholesterol. I certainly hope Tyler doesn't take after me.
As Jackie said, you might want to check with another vet especially one that sees small dogs. Otherwise did you try ordering the Low Fat Royal Canin over the internet. Here's a link I saw but I think for out of US shipping you have to call their toll-free number which is listed: Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Canine Digestive Low Fat LF 20 Dry Dog Food | PetFoodDirect.com
Don't know how shipping goes to Chile.


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

jmm said:


> Ingredients and quality can vary by where a food is made. Is this food imported from the U.S.?
> You might get a second opinion...my vet wasn't excited about the values you posted.


... yes, the food is imported from the U.S (at least he told me so)
... really,?? those values are too bad??... the thing is my vet has "maternity leave" (no idea 'bout the translation, sorry, she had her baby a couple of weeks ago) and she's not returning my calls or e-mails, so I haven't had any input from her in the past 2 weeks... I'm trying to find another vet, but as I said before, that's another thing I don't like 'bout my country: I can't find a specialist, my vet was going to recomment me one but she has dissapeared :mellow: , I don't trust the other vets from the Clinic because they're all very very young and they've recently graduated (less than 1 year of experience) :smilie_tischkante: so I'm searching for another vet... Can I send you the previous values and the last ones to know what the opinion of your vet is?? :blush: , the thing that worries me also is that she has her Amilase value a little low, and still I can't get a reply from the vet!!:smilie_tischkante::smilie_tischkante: (little freaked out here)



Snowbody said:


> I didn't even realize our pets were tested for cholesterol. I certainly hope Tyler doesn't take after me.
> As Jackie said, you might want to check with another vet especially one that sees small dogs. Otherwise did you try ordering the Low Fat Royal Canin over the internet. Here's a link I saw but I think for out of US shipping you have to call their toll-free number which is listed: Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Canine Digestive Low Fat LF 20 Dry Dog Food | PetFoodDirect.com
> Don't know how shipping goes to Chile.


yes, they do all sort of blood test to our pets, I didn't knew they do such amounts of different test :blush: I thought the would do only the most common ones (CBC, lipid & biochemical profile), but there's a HUGE list!!... 
I've tried to buy from internet, but the thing is since I'm from SouthAmerica guarantee issues expires here so they don't send those kind of things over here, plus my country has very strict rules 'bout importing that kind of products, I can't just bring it by mail, I need to have special permissions from the SAG (Agriculture & Livestock Services) and other entities first, it is easier when you travel to another country and then bring the products with you, you still need to fill a form but the process is easier and cheaper.... but I'll see what I can do... THANKS!!


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Sure, get the results. I have a dog who always has elevated chol and triglycerides and his internal medicine specialist has never mentioned a need for diet change.


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

really??... wow, that's wierd!!...
here are the links for the test's results: 
http://www.swoopshare.com/file/0a4853f19681d71b62d5ed988ef4a8d4/Sagirah%27s+exams+July+2009.pdf.html

http://www.swoopshare.com/file/7ff83cd9671e385410d714756f172463/Sagirah%27s+exams+February+2010.pdf.html

.. still haven't found a specialist... I'm trying to reach the lab that took the tests, maybe they can recommend me a person...

THANKS, you're an angel!!


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Was she fasted for 12 hours before these tests?


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

yessss!!!... both times!!!, her last meal was at 21:00 aprox, the test were taken at 9:00 - 10:30 .... the results are too bad??


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

I'm not a health care professional, I just like to research, and from my research I can tell you that high cholesterol is not a health issue for dogs. (Unless someone wants to sell dog food or medicine, that is.)

Is your dog overweight?

Please do not restrict feeding fat to your dog unless you are sure that it needs to be done. Fat is *vital *for cell growth and function in the body and brain for humans and animals. Without cholesterol, we would die. 

People and dogs do not get high cholesterol from eating foods that contain cholesterol. Insulin controls fat storage in the body. Carbohydrate/sugar intake drives insulin production, not fat. 

I wouldn't worry too much about it at all. If you don't have variety in your food choices in your country, perhaps you can consider home cooking for your dog.


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## almitra (Apr 24, 2009)

Cardiovascular exercise (walking, etc) raises the GOOD cholesterol in humans, so the same is likely true for canines. Also, it is worth remembering that approximately 75% of a _person's_ total cholesterol number (likely true for dogs also) isn't related to food consumption at all, but rather by the liver itself. Increasing her exercise by walking longer or more often will do wonders to control weight, improve her cardiorespiratory system, and help manage her cholesterol. This is something you can do right now to benefit her.
Let us know what you learn from your vet, old or new, too. We're very interested to hear.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

almitra said:


> Cardiovascular exercise (walking, etc) raises the GOOD cholesterol in humans, so the same is likely true for canines. Also, it is worth remembering that approximately 75% of a _person's_ total cholesterol number (likely true for dogs also) isn't related to food consumption at all, but rather by the liver itself. Increasing her exercise by walking longer or more often will do wonders to control weight, improve her cardiorespiratory system, and help manage her cholesterol. This is something you can do right now to benefit her.
> Let us know what you learn from your vet, old or new, too. We're very interested to hear.



Walking is great!
:goodpost:


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

I'm not excited at the results. Sent them to the vet I worked for...she wasn't either. It is not really routine to check a lipid panel unless there is a problem. It is not mentioned if the serum was lipemic or not. That can falsely effect some results.


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

@Suzan: I like to research too, I'm a biochemist so I'm very used to do that.... Really, you've found that high cholesterol is not an issue for dogs?, I've found the opposite: High cholesterol in dogs is as bad as it is for us, that's the cause of hiperlipidemia...

My baby is not overweight, she's 2.6 kilos (sometime 2.7k, I weight her every 20 days and keep a record), she's like 18-20cm height (from her paw to her shoulder)...

And don't worry, I'm not restricting feeding fat for her, her vet told me to switch her food but she doesn't like the other one (Hill's i/d), so I'm currently giving her her beloved RoyalCanin MiniAdult.

... And yes, I've consider home cooking for her, the thing is she has a very sensitive stomach (she presents gastritis very often), so apart from soup made of chiken, rice, pumpkin and a little carrots, there's no much I can feed her.... And she gets bored of that food after 1 day, and refuses to eat anything else apart of her RoyalCanin... she's very temperamental... Do yo have any ideas for home made food for her (I've looked in this section, with no much luck... maybe I'm not searching very well)

THANKS!


@Sandra: yesss!!!, I've done that since I got the first results.... BEfore that I just took her for a little walk every day, now I walk her for about an hour or more, every day, no matter if I'm tired, sick or whatever... I think because of this her CHOL decreased, 'cause I couldn't change her food... 
I'm still trying to get a new specialist, the old one doesn't return my calls/emails... I'll keep you posted!!
THANK YOU!!


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

jmm said:


> I'm not excited at the results. Sent them to the vet I worked for...she wasn't either. It is not really routine to check a lipid panel unless there is a problem. It is not mentioned if the serum was lipemic or not. That can falsely effect some results.


:smcry:I'm sad now.... Her vet order a lipid panel, biochemical panel & CBC because of her recurrent gastritis, she was always sick back then (july 2009)... Now she's better, but still have some little problems every now and then.... Do you think I need to do some more tests??... As I wrote before, I'm still trying to find a good vet... THANKS for your time!!! :thumbsup:


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

My dog gets bored too but in the end she will eat whatever I feed her because I don't give her anything else! 

(Well, usually I don't give in. :biggrin

We have a home cooking sticky/pinned thread within the maltese food section of this forum

With respect, I know you are a biochemist, but I disagree that high cholesterol is dangerous.

Please see this link to two websites by many reputable doctors and scientists who have quite different ideas on this:

International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

Spacedoc.net

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/27/opinion/27taubes.html?_r=2&scp=1&sq=Taubes&st=nyt&oref=slogin




Gabby said:


> @Suzan: I like to research too, I'm a biochemist so I'm very used to do that.... Really, you've found that high cholesterol is not an issue for dogs?, I've found the opposite: High cholesterol in dogs is as bad as it is for us, that's the cause of hiperlipidemia...
> 
> My baby is not overweight, she's 2.6 kilos (sometime 2.7k, I weight her every 20 days and keep a record), she's like 18-20cm height (from her paw to her shoulder)...
> 
> ...


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

Nikki's Mom said:


> Walking is great!
> :goodpost:


yes, I know that's probably the best thing I can do for her... That's why I've given up my daily ballet lessons: to be able to walk her for at least 1hr/day...

... bout the food, I try to not give in too , but that's so hard!!... She can fast for more than 1 day, and when I get the strenght to do it my mom or my siblings feed her, or my mom & I start to argue (she starts yelling me that I'm a bad person, that I'm starving the little baby and on and on....) or she starts to vomit (like a yellowish foam) 'cause she hasn't eat anything, and then we all freak out.... :brownbag: 

I'll look in the sites you've recommend me. THANKS!!... :smootch:


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Have you had a bile acid assay (pre and post prandial samples) done? Maltese are prone to liver problems and a sensitive stomach and elevated chol could fit so it is worth ruling out. Otherwise sounds like she may have a touch of inflammatory bowel disease. Lower fat diets are actually a good choice for some dogs with IBD regardless of their labwork BUT, since there is usually a food hypersensitivity component, a novel protein/carb diet is ideal.


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

... found a specialist!!! yayyyyy!!!... it's really far away from home but I'll make an appointment with him... I'm so excited!!... I'll tell him 'bout the bile acid assay, inflammatory bowel disease & IBD... THANKS JMM & ALL OF YOU!!.. I'll keep you posted!!


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## Gabby (Feb 21, 2009)

.. in case anyone is wondering what has happened with my baby: I still can't contact the specialist, I've call his clinic, send him e-mails and still NOTHING!!!.. His secretary keeps telling me taht she will concrete an appointment and then call me back... I've called 8 times and nothing... I'll try again tomorrow.... haven't found another specialist... please wish me luck
THANK YOU everybody!!


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