# Need Advice on Secret



## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

I'm trying to make a very difficult decision about whether or not it's time to put Secret down. It is sooooooooooooooooooo hard for me to even be thinking about this.:smcry::smcry:

I need some logical input from my SM family that I know understand how emotional this is and how hard it is to make a decision.

Here are the facts:

1. Secret is 14 1/2.
2. She is completely deaf.
3. She is about 90% blind.
4. She no longer wants to be loved on or cuddled but prefers sleeping in her bed in either the guest room or the office room.
5. She isn't at all ill except for the hearing and seeing issues.
6. Her appetite is excellent.
7. She remembers where she is supposed to do her potties and makes it to the pee pee pad about 85% of the time.,
8, She sleeps about 70% of the day and walks around (mostly in the kitchen going to her dinner bowl which doesn't have food in it) for the other 30%
9. She was always an angel about her grooming but for the last 9-10 months , she has a fit when I want to groom her, so I have to keep her shaved down so that I usually only have to do a bath and clip her nails. 

One of the biggest problems is my lifestyle now that I've retired. When went to the condo in Florida at the first of the year, it took her about 2 weeks to be OK with the transition because she didn't know where things where due to her lack of sight and her deafness. Last week we traveled to Mexico for a 2 week holiday with friends and she is again having trouble adjusting to the change. We will be home in New Mexico next week and I know that she will have to readjust to being home. Then in mid-May, Lynne Girdner (Angel's Mom) and I plan on taking her RV on a 3 week Road Trip to go to Nationals in Spokane. I know that this will once again be a big adjustment for Secret. About a week after we finish that trip, I will be going to Brittany France and will be staying in a small cottage that I own there. I will be taking all the girls with me, and we will be staying until mid-September or so. It's not the actual travelling that bothers her but the adjustment to a strange place as she can't find things and runs into walls and furniture, etc. And I can't help her by talking to her because she can't hear me.

I want her to have the best life she can at this point in her life and truly don't know how much enjoyment she has as it seems the only thing she enjoys is her food and treats.

Breeze and Lacie sometimes try to help her, but that just seems to annoy Secret as I'm not sure she knows what they're trying to do.

Because she's not sick, I feel that it's wrong to put her down and yet I continue to ask what kind of quality of life she really has.

I guess that I could give up my trips and stay home to try to give her more stability for the remainder of her life. There's really no one I would feel save leaving her with as she is somewhat frail (maybe not so much but because she's so tiny it just seems like it). Every once in a while she does her little happy dance and runs little if she's sure of the room and knows that they're nothing that she will run into.

Except for her eye meds, she's not on any medications as she's healty except for old age. She does have a touch of arthritis from time to time, but really not very much. She still does her leg stretches daily.

I'm hoping that my SM friends can give me some good advice as I need it. I love little Secret but she's not a loving type of fluff and is mostly in her own little world. She's always been very independent. :smhelp::crying::crying:


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## Smtf773 (Apr 8, 2015)

Lynn this was Oliver the last year or so of his life. I had to stop taking him with me even to my sisters house when we'd go over to visit. It was just to unsettling for him. It got to where if he was outside his normal environment it had to be a very small space for him to be content. So id take one of those 4 sided baby gates. Once he knew it was a small space then he would settle. Otherwise he would pace the unfamiliar room. It was so stressful for both of us. Eventually it was just too hard on him. I asked about the cuddling because Oliver stopping cuddling too. He said that he was probably achy from old age and I could put him on meds if it got worse. He had CHF so adding meds was difficult.


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## Polly's mom (Apr 29, 2013)

:crying::crying:Oh Lynn, I can't even begin to feel your pain. It is a horrific position with no true right or wrong. I know how much you love Secret and what a wonderful Mommy you are to all you girls. I for one support you in any decision. There but for the grace of God....we have all been there or will be there in the future. 

I am sending prayers to help you find the clarity you need in such a difficult time.


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## mdbflorida (Feb 28, 2013)

Oh Lynn, I am afraid only you will know when it is really right. Amos, my beloved wheaten before we got Boo was 16.5 years old (normal life span for them is 12-14). He could hardly walk, see and hear. He only was a wake to eat, drink and poop. When he started having seizures is when I decided I could not keep him alive only because I couldn't make the hard decision. It all comes down to quality of life I suppose. The other sign is panting because that might show they are also in pain. Hugs from Boo and Zach.


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## kd1212 (Nov 5, 2013)

Hey Lynn,

This happened to my sister when her Toy Poodle was about 17--same exact list of symptoms you have. Poor Teddy even rolled down a flight of stairs, hit his head, which caused a seizure--he was okay though. He also had hip issues-an ongoing issue he had early in life, which remained a problem. Her decision was that she couldn't put him down--even though he was pretty much suffering and his quality of life was gone. 

I think this is a decision that you have to make on your own. You have to be comfortable with the decision you make--its the most difficult one and I'm sorry you're going through this.

I will tell you what my doctor said to me when Trevor had to be put down. The doctor called me the morning after we admitted Trevor to the hospital. He said there is no change--he ended up at 17 with brain swelling and it didn't go down. He said that I could spend thousands of dollars keeping him stable, put it won't change his condition. We need to put him down. In hysteria I said, "I can't kill my baby." He said, "Kim, I know how much you love him, but he no longer has a good quality of life; the beauty of veterinarian medicine is that we can be selfless and end suffering." I will never forget what he said or his compassion and empathy.

I hope this helps a little bit. No matter what you decide, I know can speak for everyone--we're all here to support you.

xo
Kim


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## aprilb (Jul 9, 2010)

Lynn, I'm so sorry..it is always difficult when we have to make this decision..if you feel that her bad days outweigh her good days, then it is time...you have been a great mom to her and she has had a great life with you..you have gone far and above in your care for her over the years..if she is not wanting to interact with anyone, then in my opinion, this is an indication that she may not be feeling well..you said she has arthritis..she is such a tiny little thing and I feel at this point, more meds could do more harm than good..you will make the right decision and whatever that may be, I support you 100%.. :grouphug:


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

Hi Lynn, have you considered looking into a hearing aid for secret? My mother's neighbor had her dog fitted for one and it made a huge difference. Apparently small dogs adjust to them much easier than larger dogs.


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## zooeysmom (Aug 1, 2011)

Lynn, I'm so sorry you are going through this with Secret  I would either change my plans and stay home with her for the rest of her life or kindly let her go so she doesn't have to deal with all of the stressful travels. The fact that she's still excited to eat and her cognitive functioning is still there makes me feel like I would change my plans to be home with her. But that's me. You've got to do what you feel is right.


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## Sylie (Apr 4, 2011)

Different people judge quality of life differently.My criteria is the same for humans and dogs 1. they are able to eat on their own 2. they are able to go potty on their own 3. they are not in constant pain or emotional distress.

You know that Ru was very much like Secret when she was sixteen, except that I think she could see and hear a little bit. For two years I felt a wave of sadness come over me every time I looked at her. But, I have never regretted letting her go to the natural end.

I'm afraid that you could regret if you had her PTS before you are certain beyond any doubt. I think that when the time is right, there is no question in your mind.

On the other hand, you matter too. Now is the time for you to do the things you want to do. You don't have what seems like forever ahead of you either. 

Give my darling love from her Auntie Sylie. :heart:


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

This is a decision only you can make but based on what you have said, I couldn't do it if it was me. If she is not in pain and not ill, still eating and not soiling herself, I just couldn't do it. If the only problem is adjusting to new places maybe there is some way you could help her adjust. Maybe put her on a leash and help her explore the room so that she gets used to the smells and the placement of furniture. If there is stairs you could get a portable baby gate to block them off. As Sylvia said, we just don't want you to have any regrets.


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## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

Thanks for the feedback, advice and thoughts. Obviously if she were ill or in pain, I would make the hard decision, but sometimes I think I'm just being selfish about wanting to travel. 

I do try to help her to adjust to her new surroundings and we always have a puppy play pen with us that she does feel safe in. 

I didn't even know that they have hearing aids for dogs, so I'll look into that.

Every time I thing I might be close to a decision, Secret gets a spurt of energy and does her 'happy dance" and I know that neither of us are ready. I'll continue praying on this and know that God will help me with this difficult decision.


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## Matilda's mommy (Jun 1, 2005)

Lynn I went through almost the same thing with my Miss Bow, I actually prayed every day that when I woke she would have gone to Heaven's Rainbow Bridge. That may sound terrible to some, don't judge you haven't walked in my shoes. The day came when we rushed her to the vets, Lorin would not let Miss Bow go, I had to make the decision all alone. I was the only one with her when I made that decision, I prayed, loved on her, I told her how much I loved her and I told her I loved her enough to help her make the journey home, I then rang the bell for the vet to come in. I held Miss Bow as the vet gave her a shot, she went so peaceful, after a time I laid her on the table. I was so shocked at how frail and skinny she had gotten, she was bones. I told myself I WOULD NEVER put Matilda through this.
Never will I ever put Matilda or Maddie through what we had done with our Miss Bow. I feel in my heart we should have let her make that journey earlier.
I'm just thankful she didn't have seizures or something else. 
whatever you decide I back you 100% you have loved Secret, cared for her, so knows you love her, she trusts you to make the best decision for her. It sounds like it's time Lynn.


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## donnad (Aug 22, 2006)

I was crying reading this so I wasn't going to post anything. I really don't want to influence you in any way. I had a dog before Chloe and Summer, who had minor strokes and really couldn't walk. I did not have the heart to put her down until she stopped eating. She looked at me with her eyes and I knew it was time. I had a hard time making the decision and I probably should have made it sooner. You will know when its time.


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## Malt Shoppe (Jul 20, 2011)

Lynn, you are faced with one of the toughest decisions in life.
Years ago when it was necessary for me to be traveling alot, and always took my beloved Truffles with me, I used to say she probably thought every motel or home we went to was now her new home.

Then, while on the east coast, she fell over one day, I thought she just lost her balance. At home, she had a seizure. Not the normal twitching kind, she fell over and I thought she was dead; she was limp and non-responsive. When she came out of it, I called the vet and said we were on our way. He said we had been traveling alot and would be best to stay home for awhile; that was the cause of her seizures, indicating the east coast fall was a seizure. I cancelled the upcoming trip we were to go on. There is no way around it, travel does stress dogs out.

Hard decision, have had to make it several times, not ever easy.


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## Kathleen (Aug 4, 2011)

Lynn, I am so sorry you are going through this. 
As you said, if there is any kind of physical pain it is a different thing. When it is us trying to interpret what their mental state is, their level of happiness, it seems so much more complicated. How do we know for sure how they are feeling? If they are just old and tired, and not as happy as they used to be, well isn't that just part of old age? So hard to know.
I went through this recently with Teddy. He was at least fifteen (we only adopted him about a year earlier), and blind and deaf. He slept all the time. He wasn't in pain, but he didn't seem happy. But he also didn't seem unhappy.
It was so hard to know what to do. How do you make a decision about another creature's life and death based on your interpretation of their mental state when you can't be sure? Of course it really depends on our own spiritual and religious beliefs about death. Personally, I had a really hard time making a decision to put him to sleep if he wasn't suffering. But I also didn't want to wait until he was suffering, and have him suffer just so I wouldn't feel guilty. Eventually, he started wandering and spinning and I had to make the call, still based on just his mental state. But it was still so hard.
You are a very kind and selfless person to think about delaying your travel plans to make Secret's remaining time more happy. That is wonderful, and she is lucky to have you.
I have had two elderly dogs who were blind and deaf, and I really found that using scent to help them find their way around really worked. There are little scented stickers that you can use to mark certain locations. They help them to "map" their location. 




It sounds like you don't have to be in a rush to make a decision, which is something to be grateful for, and can take the time to really think it through and be certain. It is so hard - sending hugs. :grouphug:


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## Snowball Pie's Mommi (Oct 16, 2008)

Lynn, I read your post in the middle of the night and have been thinking about it all day. I know we talked about this on the phone some time back ... and, so I know and understand what a difficult decision this is for you.

I am glad you have reached out to your friends here on SM. I think it is wonderful that everyone is sharing their experiences and thoughts ... I hope this helps you.

I only have one other thought ... in addition to what you and I have already talked about in regard to Secret. If it were me, I would do everything in my power, to have her home with me ... when it is time for the final good-byes. 

It is a little less than three weeks ago when Snowball was in ICU. With everything that was going on in my mind ... my greatest fear was not being there with him, if God forbid, he left this earth. When I spoke to Snowball's cardiologist, I made him promise me ... that if Snowball got any worse, that Dr. Tyrrell or someone on the critical care staff would call me right away ... so that I could be there with Snowball. My world would have collapsed around me if something had happened to him then ... and, if I could not hold him in my arms during the last moments that he took his last breath. So, with Secret, I am hoping that when the time comes for her (and, maybe she will pass on naturally) ... that she can be with you in her home environment. I think that would give you great peace of mind.

Only you, Lynn, can make the final decisions as to what is best for Secret. It probably has to be the most selfless decision you will ever have to make right now. Whatever you decide, you have my blessing and support ... because I trust that you will know what to do.


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## Steph_L (Jul 20, 2015)

I've never had to experience old age with a dog before, but I did grow up with a cat. Her name was Princess and I got her when I was 5. When I was 17 and she was 12, she started to get less cuddly, laying under the bed all day, and lost a lot of weight. One morning she started vomiting and my mom took her to the vets and she was pts. She wasn't very old but she wasn't young either. 

Before my husband and I got Daisy we tried taking in a miniature poodle from a family that was divorcing and couldn't/wouldn't keep him. He ended up having heart worm and it was pretty severe. He was actually coughing up blood and what looked like worms (not in vomit). The vet said that even if he survived the treatment (the dead worms can cause blockages and embolisms), his whole life he would have heart and lung problems because of the damage the worms caused and wouldn't have the stamina of a healthy dog. He was only 2 and we couldn't thinking of him having to live with shortness of breath and heart problems his whole life and he was pts. 

My parents are almost at a similar spot in life with their beagle/black lab mix. He gets snippy and doesn't like going on walks anymore. He's only 8 so they are waiting but he was also rescued from a puppy mill so they understand his health could be compromised. 

Her little happy dance is a good sign, but I would also ask myself what kind of life does she have if she feels like she can't roam around safely and all she does is lay in her bed and then eat/go to the bathroom.


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

I still stand by my old list method...I keep a list of everything my dog enjoys doing. As they become unable to do one, I cross it off. When there are more crossed off than left, it is time to give serious consideration to euthanasia.


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## wkomorow (Aug 26, 2011)

Lynn,

I thought about this question today. If is the most difficult decision one has to make. To me the most important issue would be are the uncomfortable. It would not be fair to allow them to suffer with no hope of getting better. On the other hand, if they are comfortable I would want to spend as much time as possible. I remember Paula and Ms B & B and how special the sunset time was for both. I also remember Sylvia and Ru.

Only you will know when the time is truly right. I hope the passage into the next life is peaceful for Secret and that your heart is at peace. She is a special little girl who is very much a part of you.


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## Matilda's mommy (Jun 1, 2005)

wkomorow said:


> Lynn,
> 
> I thought about this question today. If is the most difficult decision one has to make. To me the most important issue would be are the uncomfortable. It would not be fair to allow them to suffer with no hope of getting better. On the other hand, if they are comfortable I would want to spend as much time as possible. I remember Paula and Ms B & B and how special the sunset time was for both. I also remember Sylvia and Ru.
> 
> Only you will know when the time is truly right. I hope the passage into the next life is peaceful for Secret and that your heart is at peace. She is a special little girl who is very much a part of you.


 

oh Walter I had forgotten about the sunset, thank you for helping me to remember 
All I can remember is how she was all bones and I had waited to long.

Lynn the sunset is worth it all


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## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

Thanks for all the advice and insight. My motto has always been that if one is truly unsure what to do, do nothing.

For now, because Secret is not ill and does not seem ready to go to The Bridge, I will not put her down. She will still be loved and well taken care of until I know that it is time. I have had to put a couple of my Lhasas down and I always knew when it was time -- it was like they were asking me to let them leave and be pain free. Secret doesn't seem to have any pain.

Paula -- I do remember the Sunset.  

I made a commitment when I took her and will make her comfortable until it is her time.


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

This was posted on Northcentral Maltese Rescue's FB page a few days ago:

Deciding When & How To Humanely Euthanize a Companion Animal

I think it gives us what to think about and look for to make sure we're not acting too soon or leaving them in pain for too long.


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## michellerobison (Dec 17, 2009)

I know how you feel. My Bitsy is at the same stage... She used to be a cuddler but now she would rather just be sleeping curled up.. She gets those silly playful moments that just melt me to my knees..
As long as she eats and potties fine,it's hard for me to let her go..She's got arthritis in her back and on glucosamin and it's helping..
She still jumps at treats and prances once in a while. She's 15 and I know that day is coming.. Like Secret ,she's not sick, she's had her bouts at times but overall pretty healthy.. I just feel for her that her eyesight is nearly gone and hearing is fading.. but she's still hanging in and wants to be on the couch at couch time..


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## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

maggieh said:


> This was posted on Northcentral Maltese Rescue's FB page a few days ago:
> 
> Deciding When & How To Humanely Euthanize a Companion Animal
> 
> I think it gives us what to think about and look for to make sure we're not acting too soon or leaving them in pain for too long.


Maggie -- I had seen that Mary had posted this on FB and it was a really good article, imho. I will keep referring to it. Thanks for posting it here.


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## Maglily (Feb 3, 2009)

I like that Lynn, do nothing if you are unsure. I think I would do the same. I think that because she is not ill - that is the key. 

If she is comfortable and content as she is then I would let her enjoy life as she knows it. It has changed from what it was but if she is not unhappy and content that is the most important thing.


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

Lynn, you know I just went through this with Archie. It seemed like I was walking a tight rope wire trying to make that decision. One side is too early / the other side would be too late. Oh!!! The stress of it all!!!

After a while I realized that I was just waiting. .....waiting for what? for him to get better? to die? He really didn't have a life anymore. In the end, I feel confident that I made the decision at the right time. 

...oh, btw, he was still eating well at the end.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Lynn, in all honesty no one can tell you what is best. I also disagree that you will "know" when the time is right, but I do think you will know better than any of us would. Unfortunately this is one of those lonely roads that one has to walk almost alone---but not because others (we) don't care. I think we all love each & every little personality whom we have come to cherish here on SM in a very special way. We will ALL grieve with you deeply when the time comes to usher your baby forward into God's loving arms. 
I have always found myself praying for a natural death for my babies and so far in low all these ancient years I have only had one of those---and it was one I was not praying about. . . so this is a topic I constantly revisit. I can only say that whatever decision you end up taking I know it will be with a great deal of thought and care. You have my prayers & support for what they may be worth.


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