# Bailey is shaking and scared this morning...



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

*Although this situation has been resolved and the situation turned out to be different than originally thought (see later post)...Bailey was sick which was why he was pacing & shaking out of discomfort... I am not deleting the original post because others may learn from the entire situation... Bailey is now doing just dandy!!







If you still need to discuss spanking vs not spanking, PLEASE start another thread... Thanks so much!







*

OK... this a bit long... the past couple of days, he has been regressing on his potty training and making messes inside instead of ringing the bell to go outside to potty. He has been a little out of sorts I think after the neutering thing is a bit understandable for a few days. This morning he did his business outside when I woke up then I fed him and got into the shower then went to let him out and went on with my morning stuff. He sat on the couch and looked out the window all morning. Usually he is running around and playing until I have to leave.









When I go downstairs to play for a couple minutes before putting him in his crate... he started shaking and cowering like something he did was wrong... I was asking "what wrong Bailey" and check his wee wee and sure enough it was damp so that means he had an oopsie but I couldn't find anything... he was shaking A LOT and I didn't know why?!?









I talked to my husband and he admitted to spanking his booty yesterday when he peed on the stairs instead of going to ring the bell to go out. He brought him over to the mess and did a "you see that... bad boy bailey" and spanked him with a rolled up paper. 








I got angry and said that I did NOT want him to punish him like that for mistakes because of all the negative results that comes with negative reinforcements... he just kinds glossed over with an "ok" comment but he does not hear me on this topic. I am so frustrated because I do NOT want our pup fearful of us and shaking like that. 

Then today during lunch, I went home to let him out to potty as usual but today, instead of going to his usual spot in the grass... he hid under the back porch and pees... and stays under there shaking and pacing but wont come out to the grass... not even when I am offering a treat.







He won't come to me and just looks at me all scared and shaking!!!









My heart is breaking seeing this and it doesn't seem to bother my husband much! He just shrugs his shoulder like "I don't know" "I didn't hurt him or anything" "you think he got spooked by a bird out here or something?" NO... HE'S AFRAID TO POTTY IN OUR PRESENCE because of your punishing him when he messes in the house!!!!
















How do any of you deal with differing opinions on your furbabies and your spouse/family/etc ???









So sad and frustrated right now!!! HOW DO I MAKE THINGS RIGHT WITH BAILEY AGAIN???


----------



## Julie718 (Feb 17, 2006)

I can totally relate to this! My boyfriend has wanted to "tap" Tango on his butt for going potty in the house. I am like you and don't want to do this. We have little arguments about this too.







I don't really have any advice about this. I know that I just I have told him not to tap him anymore!!! Hopefully, there will be some more posts how to make things better with Bailey.


----------



## Scoobydoo (May 26, 2005)

Gee I am so sorry your hubby feels the necessity to spank Bailey, that is a huge no no in training as all that does is frighten the dog and also it confuses him too. As you can see the end result he isn't connecting peeing outside with a good thing but rather remembering a spanking and being told off with peeing.
These little guys are just so very sensitive and they take a long time to forget an unpleasant experience but I guess you are going to have to rebuild the trust with Bailey so that he knows he isn't going to be punished for peeing outide. It may take time and effort but I would perhaps try taking him out on a leash to get him to pee till he is confident again and make sure when he pees outside you give him a treat and cuddle him and make him feel really good about it, then in time he may become more relaxed about it again.


----------



## corisu (Jan 18, 2006)

I can relate also! Seems to me your husband gave Bailey the wrong message and it resulted in him fearing to pee in your presence. I have a submissive yorkie who is afraid of everything so I can never raise my voice let alone spank her. I am currently reading a book called: "The other End of the Leash" by Patricia McConnell. You can find it on Amazon. This is an excellent book on explaining to you why your dog behaves the way he does. It not only lets me understand how my dog views me based on her bahaviors, but lets me know how to react to it in a positive way. I encourage you to read the reviews on this book to see if this is something you want to get. This helped me alot on communicating with my yorkie so that I can give her confidence and comfort that I am her leader and not out to get her and also how to communicate with her from what's right and what's wrong. Your dog knows the command to go outside to potty, but may have some problems holding it after getting neutered. I think the problem that needs to be addressed here is how to communicate to Bailey that you are his mommie and you mean no harm. 

In addition, I find the book: "Help for your Shy Dog" by Deborah Wood is good too. It can me found on Amazon as well or click here.

Good Luck and I hope this helps you.

Mary


----------



## Deanna (Jan 14, 2005)

That really is too bad. The only thing I can suggest is maybe if you print some information about positive training and let your husband read it, he will get it. 

I know with some dogs a stern "no" works, but Maltese are SOOOOOO sensitive that even speaking harshly to them can sometimes upset them.


----------



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

> I can relate also! Seems to me your husband gave Bailey the wrong message and it resulted in him fearing to pee in your presence. I have a submissive yorkie who is afraid of everything so I can never raise my voice let alone spank her. I am currently reading a book called: "The other End of the Leash" by Patricia McConnell. You can find it on Amazon. This is an excellent book on explaining to you why your dog behaves the way he does. It not only lets me understand how my dog views me based on her bahaviors, but lets me know how to react to it in a positive way. I encourage you to read the reviews on this book to see if this is something you want to get. This helped me alot on communicating with my yorkie so that I can give her confidence and comfort that I am her leader and not out to get her and also how to communicate with her from what's right and what's wrong. Your dog knows the command to go outside to potty, but may have some problems holding it after getting neutered. I think the problem that needs to be addressed here is how to communicate to Bailey that you are his mommie and you mean no harm.
> 
> In addition, I find the book: "Help for your Shy Dog" by Deborah Wood is good too. It can me found on Amazon as well or click here.
> 
> ...










Thanks so much for the advise... definitely going to check into these books... seeing if local Barns & Noble has it or order it through them so I can flip through it before possible buying it.

I can't tell you how much this community of furbaby owners has helped me!!! I am going to make it a point for my hubby to get informed and read up on these posts and books as well!









Going to try to undo the damage already done... thanks for the input on potty issues after neutering... didn't know about that! 

~ Leslie


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

Yes, he is shaking and scared because of what your husband did to him. He is probably afraid to "go" in front of you. This breed is very, very sensitive. If I even look at K & C the wrong way their little ears go down. There is absolutely no benefit whatsoever to hitting a dog and putting his nose in "it".

When a dog makes a mistake it is our fault not theirs and we should hit ourselves with the newspaper, not a defenseless Malt baby. It's our fault because we have not trained them or were not watching them or gave them too much freedom, etc. 

I hate to say this but I wish people had to take a training course and test before they could own dogs. Our misinformation and harsh "training" can harm these little souls and it just breaks my heart.























I hope this post isn't too harsh but I guess everyone has their "hot button" issues and hitting an animal of any kind is just something that pushes my buttons, as they say. These little guys love us so much and look to us to take care of them and our hands should only be used to give love. ... I better stop or I will start crying for real....


----------



## Guest (Apr 13, 2006)

I have never heard about the bell system. It seems complicated to me. Also have never used pads or diapers. There is nothing wrong with any system that works for you. We have always trained our Malts to go outdoors to go potty. It takes awhile to train them, but works fine later! Our "Tucker" 3 1/2 yrs old, will sit by the door if he has to go out. He is on a trolley cable so has some freedom to wander. When he is done (doing whatever he wants) he comes and sits by the garage door. I realize it is a pain when the snow is flying, along with summer rain, but it works and we have to put forth a little more effort. When he use to go potty in the house, we had a rolled up newspaper and "tapped" him on the rear, put hom outside and left him for awhile. Finally he got the hang of what he was suppose to do. These dogs are intelligent and probably have us "snowed" to see things their way!! I do not have any idea what in your sdogs mind, but wish you good luck in finding a solution. Dick Perry


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> I have never heard about the bell system. It seems complicated to me. Also have never used pads or diapers. There is nothing wrong with any system that works for you. We have always trained our Malts to go outdoors to go potty. It takes awhile to train them, but works fine later! Our "Tucker" 3 1/2 yrs old, will sit by the door if he has to go out. He is on a trolley cable so has some freedom to wander. When he is done (doing whatever he wants) he comes and sits by the garage door. I realize it is a pain when the snow is flying, along with summer rain, but it works and we have to put forth a little more effort. When he use to go potty in the house, we had a rolled up newspaper and "tapped" him on the rear, put hom outside and left him for awhile. Finally he got the hang of what he was suppose to do. These dogs are intelligent and probably have us "snowed" to see things their way!! I do not have any idea what in your sdogs mind, but wish you good luck in finding a solution. Dick Perry[/B]


I'm sorry but I don't know what it is about men who seem to have no problem hitting a dog. There are other more humane ways to train a dog than hitting him/her. And I would never leave a Malt outside alone either.


----------



## kkrize (Feb 4, 2006)

Animals are no different than humans. We all respond to love and positive reinforcement and become fearful and distant when we are mistreated. I feel that a lot of the misbehaviors we see in dogs is a result of "human error'. There is a lot of responsibility in the decision to own a dog...any dog. That responsibility far exceeds just the care and feeding of the pet...it includes providing a loving environment and teaching good behavior. I feel there is NEVER any reason to hit a dog! All this teaches the dog is to be fearful. A tap on the bottom with a newspaper may not physically hurt the dog but it touches their spirit and trust. Imagine how you would feel if someone tapped you on the bottom with a newspaper everytime you slipped up. Would'nt it just "kinda damage you" and make you feel scared.

I'm sorry to be on my soap box about this but this is just one thing that I get really upset about. I've just seen so many good dogs become scared and submissive particularlly around men. 

My Deja is currently taking obedience training and my instuctor is unbending on this issue. Never hit a dogor force it (as in dragging it on a leash) to do something is does not want to do. The goal is to teach it to want to do the right thing with positive reinforcement


----------



## Teddyandme (Feb 6, 2005)

I have not read what others have said because right now I am shaking I am so upset for your little one. You mention that this little angel got neutered recently and that you understood that it may make his potty habits a bit off.....well of course it would. I don't mean to be rude but is your husband an unfeeling person normally or just on this issue....has he ever had surgery...does he know how much it affects everything and especially a tiny little innocent puppy who is still probably not himself from the surgery. I am crying for this little one.

The second thing is that even if he had not had surgery, I cannot imagine hitting Teddy in any way for any thing....he is way too sensitive and from what I have seen on this very site is that most of our little ones are the same way. Teddy would do anything to please me and that is how we have to train these little ones not with fear. 

I have had animals all my life but Teddy is my first Maltese and I can say that he is the most sensitive, smart, loving creature I have ever seen....so to hit him with a newspaper would be like torture to him. If your little one is anything like Teddy and I am sure he is...he is now horribly upset.

You must now undo the damage which could be hard because they also remember very well. I would absolutely talk with your husband until he understood you or just agreed because he loves you not to ever hit this little one. Then I would praise praise praise and praise some more every single time he goes outside...and I would say nothing when he does it inside (if he does)

Praise will bring this little one around hopefully but for now he needs your love and support...you are his advocate....he is a tiny innocent and you are his protection....

Good luck - Be safe little one


----------



## Guest (Apr 13, 2006)

I am very sad for your little dog right now. Can you imagine how scary it would be for him to have someone hit him. He looks at you and your husband as his pack. Now he is probably very confused on who he can trust.

Truthfully, if my husband did that, I would never leave him with my husband again. Especially because it doesn't seem like your husband even understands what he did was wrong. Besides, for the fact its not the dogs fault, I can't see whats the big deal of a little pee on the carpet anyways. The are much bigger problems in life. 

Malteses remember for a very long time. I am trying not to be too forward, I've held back most of what I would like to say.


----------



## Maidto2Maltese (Oct 19, 2004)

I can tell you from naddie that the punishing can lead to serious potty training issues.
Naddie is a rescue... It is thought by rescue.fosters and vet that she was likely punished when pottying where she shouldn't. She was extremely fearful of "going" in front of people...thus makes the training all the harder! they feel they must be secretive ...to the point of even utside or wherver you want them to go. All they associate is potty = punishment if human sees them.
it took "forever" for naddie to even go while on a long extended leash and that was merely because I think she simply couldn't hold it any longer.
Since she also had separation anxiety she rarely left my side. In the begining she went 28 hours!!!! without going!! No no accidents..I know!... she was with me constantly! I was wanred she'd "hold" a long time!
So pleas pass this on to your hubby.. punishing will not "help" the training..it can indeed hinder it!


----------



## Guest (Apr 13, 2006)

I hope you do whats best for Bailey.


----------



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

> ...I hate to say this but I wish people had to take a training course and test before they could own dogs. Our misinformation and harsh "training" can harm these little souls and it just breaks my heart.
> 
> 
> 
> ...










I know everyone means well and this IS a hot button for me too which is why I made it an issue with my husband. I came on here to get other's opinions/tips/info to gather and make him read through to inform him that it's NOT just in my opinion... it's documented through research and animal behavior experts and so on. I do appreciate all the support and constructive criticism but am somewhat saddened and hurt by the implication that I am not a fit momma to my baby... I have had dogs in my family all my life but this is my first with a Maltese mix (though he is more Maltese than anything else). My husband doesn't have any experience training pups... his mom has had dogs through out his life but he never had to take on the responsibility of caring for them - she always did.

As for another post above, on ALL accounts, my husband is a very loving gentle considerate, thoughtful caring man. Unfortunately, he is of the "old school" mind on the house training thing cause that's what his parents did (mind you I am not pleased with their yorkies lack of discipline and yapiness) so I can see why he doesn't instantly get it... but when you know better, you do better ...and that's what I am trying to impart on him.








As for making mistakes along the way... we ALL do that and no one instantly knows everything there is to know about their pet's breed right from the get go... same goes for parenting... we all just try to the best we can for the ones we love but we WILL  make some mistakes... that does not make me an incompetent pup momma does it?!? I live for Baileys licks and lovin and so does my husband. I was venting my frustrations right after seeing the first signs of something wrong... after much talk when he got home from work... he has agreed to my rules on how to teach Bailey how to behave in our home.








I know this is long but I feel the need to defend ourselves from some of the harsh reactions. Maybe I should have cooled off first before posting my original post... there is a more recent development which I will post in a bit...


----------



## paris (Apr 8, 2005)

I'm glad that you and your husband are on the same track. I hope that after a while your precious Bailey will be back to his "unscared" self. Give him a big hug and kiss from Paris and me.


----------



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

Turns out that Bailey was sick and that's what was causing him to shake so much and I noticed yesterday when coming home for lunch, he wasn't excited and energetic as he usually is to great me. He has been very lethargic, perched on out couch staring out the window, not wanting to play with any of his toys (very abnormal since he is always a bundle of energy)







and not wanting to outside to potty, pacing outside and shaking, not eating much and not drinking water much at all. Wasn't sure what was up and just comforted him and tried to get him to eat a little and drink some water.









Went home early from work and still no change. He didn't touch his dinner at all so then I got worried and checked his gums and they were pinkish and warm so that was good, normal temperature, wet nose but a bit runny and he keeps sniffling/sneezing... called the vet's emergency number since they were closed by then. got a call back from the vet on call and he said it might be a cold but to give him half a baby aspirin and some honey/water mixture (1tsp honey to 2 teaspoons water) with the crushed half tablet of baby aspirin since he may be uncomfortable and not eating or drinking.







(I was getting so worried) Then he said to bring him in first thing in the morning and to call if anything gets worse... I had to study for an exam on Friday but ended up curled up with him on the couch all night instead. He looked so worn-out and sad and shaking and sniffling... kept smooching him and comforting him and wishing I could do more to make him feel better!!! 

Went to the vet and his heart, lungs and temp were good but his tonsils were a little swollen. He got some antibiotic shot and the vet asked to keep him overnight to be monitored especially since he was just neutered last Thursday. I hate to leave him (he looked so sad looking up at me wanting me to take him with me)







but it would be better that he be supervised since he hadn't eaten or drank much the last 24 hours.

So I am praying he will be better by tomorrow and will be able to come home once he looks like his on the mend and more alert.

Although more was going on than just the spanking, that issue has still been resolved and my husband has promised to just stick to the positive reinforcement way which has worked so well the month and a half he was away on TDY... oh and I also ended up buying that book "The other End of the Leash" by Patricia McConnell, it looked very informative and my hubby has promised to read through it with me
















Thanks for all the positive support









~Leslie


----------



## ddarlingfam (Mar 30, 2006)

I'm sorry he's sick. Hope he is feeling better and back to his regular self soon.


----------



## paris (Apr 8, 2005)

Sorry to hear the little guy is not feeling good. Hopefully, when he comes home tomorrow all will be better. Good luck on your exam tomorrow.


----------



## Guest (Apr 13, 2006)

> > index.php?act=findpost&pid=175850
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't know what kind of reactions you were expecting considering this is a forum where most people love animals and will try to do whats best for them.


----------



## corisu (Jan 18, 2006)

So sorry to hear that the little one was not feeling well and I agree with you that people do make mistakes. Hope you don't take offense, everyone feels bad for Bailey since they heard he was shaking after the incident. I guess if we were not there and based it on the information you had provided it is easy to assume he behaved this way as a result of what had happen to him earlier. I am also so glad you took my advice on the book!







This will definitely help you both communicate more effectively and efficiently with Bailey or with any dogs. I wished I had known about this book a long time ago.

I hope he feels better.

Mary


----------



## jude'n'jools (Apr 6, 2006)

hi, i'm sure Bailey will be just fine and he'll have forgotton all about the little mishap, cause he's sure to know and feel the







love







that both you and your husband have for him. Take care. xx


----------



## Teddyandme (Feb 6, 2005)

I am so sorry that your little one is ill...it sounds like he never really recovered from the neutering...poor little boy. 

I did want to explain something to you because I don't like getting off on the wrong foot with anyone especially my friends on SM...when someone comes on and lays out a scene to us...all we have to go on is your word....and we all know that what you write is read by many more eyes than just yours. You sound like a wonderful puppy mommy, but the scene that you mentioned could be done by others who may not know how wrong it is...you came for advise, others may just read your thread and move on....

I take personally the hitting of animals...it sounds like you do also or you would not have been upset...you already knew that it was wrong...but there are others out reading this post who do not know that it is wrong and they are looking for justification to hit the little fluffbutts...which is why I feel it is my responsibilty to put in the most strong way I can that it is never ok to hit these little angels. You helped teach someone, I am sure with your worry over your little one. Please take our words in the way they were intended...to help teach people what is best for these little ones. 

I will pray for little Baily that he gets well and is home in your loving arms before you know it.

Susan


----------



## mwend (Dec 27, 2005)

I hope Bailey is feeling better!

Mary & Chloe


----------



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

> I am so sorry that your little one is ill...it sounds like he never really recovered from the neutering...poor little boy.
> 
> I did want to explain something to you because I don't like getting off on the wrong foot with anyone especially my friends on SM...when someone comes on and lays out a scene to us...all we have to go on is your word....and we all know that what you write is read by many more eyes than just yours. You sound like a wonderful puppy mommy, but the scene that you mentioned could be done by others who may not know how wrong it is...you came for advise, others may just read your thread and move on....
> 
> ...










Bailey is home now but still not quite himself but doing better, eating more and playing a little but although not as energetic as he usually is. The vet sent him home yesterday with some antibiotic drops and special easily digestible canned food for a few days.

Susan - as for some of the posts above that were a bit over zealous... I understand it was coming from the right place and we all get worked up because we love our furbabies so much... I am not angry or have any harsh feelings or anything… I just wanted to address the responses to bring light to the fact that when we post or fears, concerns, questions and what not... we are already frustrated, confused, scared, sad and that constructive criticism is good but only when it addresses the problem and not attacking the person... like our pups, positive reinforcement works for people too!

More so, although I am in *NO* way excusing or saying it was ok for my husband to tap Bailey on the butt for potting inside... but a few responses made it seem like he beat him or that we are irresponsible inhumane parents... I understand it was about driving the message home that spanking in any way was wrong *BUT* it was directed at us in a way that insinuated that we were horrible people that did not love or care for our puppy like the kind that should be reported to the pet police for domestic violence or something... it was just to far to one extreme. 

I would hate to have others be afraid of bringing up a topic or situation for fear of being bashed on these boards… just wanna keep it positive and constructive cause I love this site sooo much and all the wonderful support and help we all get from each other.

I do appreciate your latest reply and by no means am I upset… we are all just trying to do the best we can for our babies.









~Leslie


----------



## Guest (Apr 15, 2006)

> Bailey is home now but still not quite himself but doing better, eating more and playing a little but although not as energetic as he usually is. The vet sent him home yesterday with some antibiotic drops and special easily digestible canned food for a few days.
> 
> Susan - as for some of the posts above that were a bit over zealous... I understand it was coming from the right place and we all get worked up because we love our furbabies so much... I am not angry or have any harsh feelings or anything… I just wanted to address the responses to bring light to the fact that when we post or fears, concerns, questions and what not... we are already frustrated, confused, scared, sad and that constructive criticism is good but only when it addresses the problem and not attacking the person... like our pups, positive reinforcement works for people too!
> 
> ...



I really feel I must say something here. You know I really don't think the reponses were over the top at all. What you described is a classic example of a scared little dog. What kind of responses were you expecting? It seems like you want some sort of pat on the back or something. Well let me tell you I think it is wrong to scare a little animal and I think your responses are sad. I know I was very upset and worried about little Bailey and from the responses here it seems like many other people are worried to. Know one bashed you, they gave their opinions to help, so your little dog wouldn't be treated poorly. As Baileys mommy you are responsible to whats best for him and put him first. Thats what people did on this forum and it seems like you have a big problem with that.


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> I really feel I must say something here. You know I really don't think the reponses were over the top at all. What you described is a classic example of a scared little dog. What kind of responses were you expecting? It seems like you want some sort of pat on the back or something. Well let me tell you I think it is wrong to scare a little animal and I think your responses are sad. I know I was very upset and worried about little Bailey and from the responses here it seems like many other people here are worried to. Know one bashed you, they gave their opinions to help, so your little dog wouldn't be treated poorly. As Baileys mommy you are responsible to whats best for him and put him first. Thats what people did on this forum and it seems like you have a big problem with that.[/B]


I agree with "Pink Belly". Your original post was very dramatic and my interpretation was that you were terribly concerned and upset because your husband would not believe you when you said that hitting was not the way to train Bailey. You mentioned in a 2nd post that he would possibly be reading the thread and that maybe he would learn something from it.

When you say things like "_spanked him with a rolled up paper_","_he just kinds glossed over with an "ok" comment but he does not hear me on this topic."_ and "_My heart is breaking seeing this and it doesn't seem to bother my husband much"_ and other equally disturbing remarks, I'm not sure why you are so surprised that it would upset those of us who cannot bear the thought of a Malt being physically punished. I know that several of us were quite upset at the picture you painted of the way training is handled by your husband.

It certainly was not my intention to make you suffer further. 

I am very glad to hear that Bailey is recovering from his illness.


----------



## Laceys mom (Nov 12, 2004)

First - I just read through all the posts. So happy to read he is doing better.
Second - WE all love our little ones but we do make mistakes. I feel that when we do we learn and move on.
I'm sure you and your husband are wonderful parents to this little one. Just remember that we all love our little ones and we are all very protective of ours and all the other little maltese in the world.


----------



## Guest (Apr 15, 2006)

> I would hate to have others be afraid of bringing up a topic or situation for fear of being bashed on these boards…[/B]


I see whats going on.


----------



## MalteseJane (Nov 21, 2004)

Here we go again. This is the best exemple of what happens when people overreact and jump to conclusions in the heat of the moment.


----------



## Guest (Apr 15, 2006)

> Here we go again. This is the best exemple of what happens when people overreact and jump to conclusions in the heat of the moment.[/B]



Hi,

If you are referring to me, thats ok, you are entiled to our own opinion. I would like to point out though, I didn't overreact or jump to conclusions. I read all the posts and I am entiled to my opinions as well. The first post on this thread is just so disturbing. I'm not the type to bury my head in the sand. I don't mean to give anyone a hard time, but this in my opinion is a very serious matter. 

A little innocent dog afraid to go pee. It is just so sad. (I didn't make this up, read the first post.)


----------



## Boobookit (Dec 3, 2005)

> hi, i'm sure Bailey will be just fine and he'll have forgotton all about the little mishap, cause he's sure to know and feel the
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, I agree with the above statement.....

We, as humans, have memories and minds that are endless...While our furbabies are smart, they have a one track mind. I have said this before and I will say it again. A dog that has been abused, yes, will have issues. This dog was NOT abused, he was swatted with a paper. Although most of us do not agree with this, it's certainly not abuse. Your little furbaby doesn't care about yesterday and certainly does not have the ability to worry about tomorrow...He lives in the now, today......and today he doesn't feel well, and for that I am sorry.

I certainly hope that he feels better fast and he recoups from the vet. If he is still shaking when you get him home about going outside then take him on the leash and walk him in the yard until he is sure on his feet again.

I will be thinking of him and hoping for his speedy recovery.

Marie & Pacino


----------



## Teddyandme (Feb 6, 2005)

I had to jump in here again because it is just so important to me...when I was in college one of my favorite classes was speech....not in the beginning because I was terrified but once I chose what my speech was going to be about I knew that I had a mission.

My speech was on the hitting of children....and it was so important to me to give an unforgettable speech because there was a young person in the class who carried his Bible and quoted the scriptures all the time about hitting being perfectly fine. I worked on this speech for a month and I still remember the nightmares I had over preparing for it. I don't think I ever worked harder on any paper and that includes my major of psycology not because I needed to ace it, I already had a 4.0 but because I wanted to enlighten at least one person so at least one child would not be hit. 

I included research on the incredible tranformation of those who are introduced to possitive reinforcement vs corporal punishment...the devastation of those individuals who are hit and how it affects more than the moment that they are hit...I included just as many passages from the Bible that showed without doubt that the Good Book does not want us to hit anyone, passages from the New Testement that preach about using love as our guide. I truly believe that God lead me in the speech because not only did my fellow classmates listen but others were standing outside listening as well (word had gotten out that I was speaking on this subject and they wanted to see which of us would win the battle...the driven young man who quoted scripture or the driven type A mother of an 8 year old). 

I know if I do nothing else in life that this was a success...why? Because the man who had been so consummed with preaching "spare the rod spoil the child" came up to me after class and with tears in his eyes and promised me that he would never hit a child. There were others in the class and in the hall who said the same thing, but they were not vocal advocates of hitting and were not preaching to hitting. I reached my goal that day because I changed the view of not one but a number of people on the benefits of possitive reinforcement.

Now you may be saying that a child and a dog are two different things but let me assure you that the reseach I did was across the board...the studies were on monkeys, dogs, mice, etc. The reseach is clear that children, animals and all living beings thrive when given possitive reinforcement and are stunted when given corporal or abusive verbal punnishment. 

The next time anyone wants to hit anything...think about this. As an adult what would you do if someone came up to you everytime you did something you shouldn't and slapped you...would it be ok for your boss to smack you for not doing what he asked...would it be ok for your children to smack you if you mess up the mothering or the fathering? If you did not pay a bill on time, would it be ok for a credit card company to slap you. Just because we are bigger does not mean the feelings of children or animals would be any different than our own if we were hit...we would be mortified and so are those who are hit.

We as a group have given ourselves the responsibility of raising tiny little animals who weigh less than most newborns...if we must use our power instead of our love and intelligence to teach them, then we don't deserve the love they give us. 

I just ask that you think of how you would feel before you hit again....whomever may be reading this and hits.

Thank you for sticking with me for so long...it was important to me and all those who may not be hit again.

Susan

P.S. This post is not in response to Bailey Luda's post, but to anyone who may read this now or in the future with questions on why to not hit our little fluffbutt angels.


----------



## Gemma (Jan 19, 2006)

> P.S. This post is not in response to Bailey Luda's post, but to anyone who may read this now or in the future with questions on why to not hit our little fluffbutt angels.[/B]










I was going to say this and then I saw you already did. Thanks

Perhaps next response should be a new topic regarding abuse of dogs which has nothing to do with this topic. Poor Bailey's mom, she just came to ask us for help. She was assuming that could be the reason of the shaking which it wasn't. and he did say that he didn't hurt him or anything. I think they are great loving parents to Bailey and I sure hope he is back to normal now.


----------



## miko's mommy (Feb 8, 2005)

> This dog was NOT abused, he was swatted with a paper. Although most of us do not agree with this, it's certainly *not* abuse.[/B]


Pacino's Mommy,

I definitely agree with you!!!! I hope Bailey is feeling better.


----------



## ddarlingfam (Mar 30, 2006)

> > index.php?act=findpost&pid=177443
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for posting this, I certainly agree hitting is not ok. But I don't see this as a problem just as a mistake made by a human being. No one is perfect. I hope bailey is doing better and I'm sure he will do fine with potty training from now on.


----------



## lucida.ann (Feb 18, 2006)

It sounds like this was a valuable learning tool for Bailey's daddy, and isn't that what Spoiled Maltese is all about? Bailey's mom, thanks for making this post. I commend you for caring enough for your animal to write something that had the potential to - and did - earn you some personal criticism that I am glad to see you aren't taking _too_ personally. It wasn't easy for you to witness or write this, but focus on the good that came out of this. No harm, no foul.

I know people were upset by reading about this incident, and most people who have a heart would feel badly for Bailey to differing degrees, but it's important to keep in mind that not everyone who comes here is as experienced or knowledgeable as the next person. Just as the little ones rely on us for guidance, so do people who come here genuinely seeking advice, and as long as they demonstrate a willingness to learn and correct past mistakes, I think we should give them the guidance they seek in as non-judgemental a manner as possible. Lots of people lurk without posting - I did so for months before signing up and posting here, and believe you me, I have learned boatloads. For that reason, I am also appreciate of "Teddyandme"'s "speech" posted above.

Now someone who doesn't want to listen or make necessary changes is a different story...fifty lashes with a wet noodle!


----------



## Furbaby's Mommie (Jul 10, 2004)

Hey Leslie, How's Baily now?







I just found this post today and my impression from the start was that something else was wrong with Baily, not just that your husband scared him. I've seen Frosty acting the way you described when he was in pain.

I think most people's reaction to him being "tapped" with a rolled up paper was at least somewhat justified, but a little over the top. Your husband didn't "beat" him and injure him. We all learn as we go with both our fur and skin kids, and this has been one of those learning experiences. It's so true these Maltys are the most sensitive things I've ever come across, and corporal punishment is not the way to teach them, but I doubt Bailey is scared for life from his brush with a newspaper.

I hope Bailey has regained his happy attitude and is feeling frisky again.








Best wishes to you and your little family,








Dee


----------



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

> Hey Leslie, How's Baily now?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Dee -







He is much much better since the culprit of his shaking and strange behavior was his upper respiratory infection and swollen tonsils... he was on antibiotics and is about done with the meds and acting like a frisky mischievous puppy again!!!














He is no longer shaking, hiding under the porch or hiding when he goes potty. This is something they do especially when they are sick and uncomfortable... they nervously pace cause they don't know what's wrong and don't know what to do about it! Potty training is back on track minus a few accidents cause he still hasn't master being on the 2nd floor and going downstairs to ring the potty bell... he gets lazy and just pops a squat where ever when upstairs (we're working on that) 








Thanks for the support and understanding and to all who have been the same!!! Thanks for all the kind well wishes!!









As for an update... please read the responses before posting a reply as this topic has been addressed and resolved in our home. Bailey even had an oopsie yesterday and although I know my husband was upset cause Bailey ran upstairs just to pee (it seemed)... my husband gave a firm "NO -BAD BOY" and took him outside while I offered to clean up the pee on the carpet.

If the topic of "spanking" still needs discussion... maybe we should open a separate thread. Thanks y'all









~Leslie


----------



## lucida.ann (Feb 18, 2006)

> As for an update... please read the responses before posting a reply as this topic has been addressed and resolved in our home. Bailey even had an oopsie yesterday and although I know my husband was upset cause Bailey ran upstairs just to pee (it seemed)... my husband gave a firm "NO -BAD BOY" and took him outside while I offered to clean up the pee on the carpet.
> 
> If the topic of "spanking" still needs discussion... maybe we should open a separate thread. Thanks y'all
> 
> ...


Leslie - I agree that perhaps a separate discussion of the spanking issue might be productive but probably no longer in this thread. However, I think some people are going to read your initial post and feel compelled to respond without reading through all three pages of comments for the update. Maybe you might want to edit your original post to reflect the current situation and save yourself any more unpleasantries on this subject? You're certainly not obligated to do so, but I just wanted to throw it out there as one possible solution. I know you already edited it to indicate that the situation was not what it originally seemed, but given what a hot-button issue this can be, I do think some people stop processing after they read about the spanking and Bailey's behavior and it doesn't register that it wasn't what you thought it was.

- Lucie


----------



## samsonsmom (May 4, 2005)

With a gentle, loving, caring, mom like you, Bailey will be just fine. He just needs time and the unconditional love that you have always shown him. His surgery has no doubt affected him, and in the best case scenerio, he would need some readjustment. As for your husband, he made a simple mistake because he did not understand. Bailey will forgive him too, and it is absolutely certain that Bailey will not stop loving him. It is just not in a maltese to stop loving somebody. Continue as you are, praise him to high heaven when he does ANYTHING right, and all will be well. Probably already is. Loves and cuddles to all of you.

Samsonsmom

Hey Bailey--ya shoulda seen the pink silk blouse I peed on a few days after my surgery. She put it on the bed and it fell off on to the floor. As far as I was concerned, it became fair game. My whole bottom hurt and I was just relieving the, er, tension. It was okay. She had it cleaned. Then cleaned again. Then after the third cleaning she said it didn't smell like dog pee any more. Like that's a bad thing.....

Sammie


----------



## Bailey Luda (Feb 14, 2006)

> With a gentle, loving, caring, mom like you, Bailey will be just fine. He just needs time and the unconditional love that you have always shown him. His surgery has no doubt affected him, and in the best case scenerio, he would need some readjustment. As for your husband, he made a simple mistake because he did not understand. Bailey will forgive him too, and it is absolutely certain that Bailey will not stop loving him. It is just not in a maltese to stop loving somebody. Continue as you are, praise him to high heaven when he does ANYTHING right, and all will be well. Probably already is. Loves and cuddles to all of you.
> 
> Samsonsmom
> 
> ...


Awwe... thanks Sammie!!! I will be sure to remind my momma of that story next time I do an oopsie on the carpet upstairs. I am being good now that I am feeling tons better... but when I do make a booboo... it helps looking cute and sad afterwards so she cant be mad for too long... how can you resist this face?!?







I have them both wrapped around my little paw









~Bailey


----------



## lucida.ann (Feb 18, 2006)

> With a gentle, loving, caring, mom like you, Bailey will be just fine. He just needs time and the unconditional love that you have always shown him. His surgery has no doubt affected him, and in the best case scenerio, he would need some readjustment. As for your husband, he made a simple mistake because he did not understand. Bailey will forgive him too, and it is absolutely certain that Bailey will not stop loving him. It is just not in a maltese to stop loving somebody. Continue as you are, praise him to high heaven when he does ANYTHING right, and all will be well. Probably already is. Loves and cuddles to all of you.
> 
> Samsonsmom
> 
> ...


Hi Bailey's Mom, I am glad to hear that it all worked out well.
I also noticed the change you made to your original post, and it is perfect. Exactly what I was suggesting.


----------

