# URGENT HELP with home cooking



## Tiger's Mom (Jan 9, 2008)

I finally took the plunge and giving them home cooked meals . . .I just baked a salmon but do I take out the skin? also, there are bones in the salmon :w00t: do I make sure no bones gets into their food . . .hope someone can respond to me as I just took it out of the oven :aktion033:


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

i don't know, i buy salmon filets that doesn't have skin or bones. i hope someone replies that can help you soon.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

I'm not sure but to stay on the safe side this time I'd lose the skin and certainly the bones.


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## Dixie's Mama (Mar 19, 2008)

I would say you take off the skin and remove the bones. I would think bones would be ok if they were pulverized and I mean pulverized. Those little salmon bones could get stuck in their throat or intestines as they are. As for the skin I would think since it's cooked they could choke on it also.


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

Skin is okay - definitely take out the bones.


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## mary-anderson (Jan 12, 2010)

I would get rid of the bones...Skin should be fine.


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## princessre (Dec 23, 2008)

The skin is very healthy for our fluffs...it has tons of omega 3. Good stuff!! 

The bones for sure need to be taken out. I take them out before I cook and keep flipping to check the bones are gone while cooking. And each time I portion out the serving, I check again with a small fork.


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

If there are any impurities in the salmon they will concentrate in the skin. Alaskan salmon is generally safe but I personally buy only boneless/skinless fillets and of course only Alaskan.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Above all, make sure it is WILD Alaska salmon, not farmed or color added. 

Skin is okay, bones are not. Hope this helps.


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## princessre (Dec 23, 2008)

Good points, Sher and Suzan!! Farmed salmon is no good!! If there is no wild salmon available, I would rather feed another wild fish or just organic chicken.


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## Tiger's Mom (Jan 9, 2008)

good morning ladies . . I did get the fresh fillet salmon and it came with the skin . . .there are bones even in the fillet, but not much and I did take them all out as I forked them all right after baking which I was sorta shredding it manually . . .I am so excited this morning is their first time.

Do I just completely get rid of their kibble or gradually transition them to avoid any upset stomach.

oh and yes, I did get WILD alaskan salmon (sockeye).

I made enough for two 3 cups veggies but only used a full 3 cup so when I do it all over again, my veggies are all done and ready for mixing . . .it'll save me some time :aktion033:


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## princessre (Dec 23, 2008)

Great job! Isn't it a great feeling that you know exactly what is in your pups' food? 

Our pups never had problems switching from one food to another...but others may have a different opinion. 

Also keeping the components separately helps keep the refrigerated food fresher, I've found. (Obviously freezing keeps the freshest)


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## Tiger's Mom (Jan 9, 2008)

princessre said:


> Great job! Isn't it a great feeling that you know exactly what is in your pups' food?
> 
> Our pups never had problems switching from one food to another...but others may have a different opinion.
> 
> Also keeping the components separately helps keep the refrigerated food fresher, I've found. (Obviously freezing keeps the freshest)


thank you Sophia . .you know I owe it so much to your postings :aktion033: I just realized it isn't so hard once you did it . the first time is just a bit initmidating because you want to make sure you do it right . .but I have come to realize you can tweak recipe's to make it fit to your lifestyle even more. I use to do a lot of prepared dinners to freeze and so I have this chart right next to my freezer on the recommended maximum storage time, and prepared dinners could take anywhere between 2-6 months and stews 3-4 months . .so that means I can make a much larger batch to freeze so instead of doing it every 14 days which might be too much work for me, I can definitely extend it so I can do it only every other month :chili:

I have been chatting with a korean breeder and she gives her babies mostly home made cooked food for them, even snacks . . .they have veggies, a bit of chicken and home made chicken broth for snacks and nothing coming out of a store LOL . . .


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

I'm sure the kids are loving their first home cooked breakfast. What recipe are you using?


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

Des -- :aktion033::aktion033: I applaud your going with home cooking too. The recalls really freak me out and the smell of some of the wet foods for dogs really turns me off and Tyler never has liked kibble.
I've gone to the home cooking route too since I cook most nights at home for us anyway. I got Dr. Becker's book but was intimidated by the mixes to make the supplements so I just got a Animal Essentials Multi Vitamins, Calcium and Enzymes and Probiotics the other day to mix in with the foods. I was so afraid Tyler would back away from it and not eat it but to the contrary -- he's either not noticed or the supplements taste okay (that's what they said on the AE webinar I joined last month) and I'm just so happy with him eating fresh food, veggies and fruit.


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## mary-anderson (Jan 12, 2010)

Snowbody said:


> Des -- :aktion033::aktion033: I applaud your going with home cooking too. The recalls really freak me out and the smell of some of the wet foods for dogs really turns me off and Tyler never has liked kibble.
> I've gone to the home cooking route too since I cook most nights at home for us anyway. I got Dr. Becker's book but was intimidated by the mixes to make the supplements so I just got a Animal Essentials Multi Vitamins, Calcium and Enzymes and Probiotics the other day to mix in with the foods. I was so afraid Tyler would back away from it and not eat it but to the contrary -- he's either not noticed or the supplements taste okay (that's what they said on the AE webinar I joined last month) and I'm just so happy with him eating fresh food, veggies and fruit.


Sue,

That is exactly what I do and thought the same thing. They love it.
I also started adding Animal Essentials kelp and fish oil, it stinks but
they love it. I can tell the difference in their coats since adding the oil.
It's a lot of work since I have more then one but so worth it!!


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

Snowbody said:


> I got Dr. Becker's book but was intimidated by the mixes to make the supplements so I just got a Animal Essentials Multi Vitamins, Calcium and Enzymes and Probiotics the other day to mix in with the foods.





mary-anderson said:


> Sue,
> That is exactly what I do and thought the same thing. They love it.


Animal Essentials multi-vitamin or any brand will not do the same thing Dr. Beckers mix does. 

Dr. Beckers supplement mix is specifically designed for use with her recipes. It is not an all purpose vitamin mix. If you are using her recipes you really need to use the vitamin mix she provides.

Please reconsider using her vitamin mix - I just priced it out for all the vitamins at $45 for the dog mix and that's enough to make 3 vitamin batches for 170 lbs of food each. That's over 500 lbs of food!

*Making Dr. Becker's recipes and using another supplement may not be nutritionally complete and this could be harmful for your pet. *


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

wooflife said:


> Animal Essentials multi-vitamin or any brand will not do the same thing Dr. Beckers mix does.
> 
> Dr. Beckers supplement mix is specifically designed for use with her recipes. It is not an all purpose vitamin mix. If you are using her recipes you really need to use the vitamin mix she provides.
> 
> ...


Leslie - I'm trying to give Tyler a well balanced mix of foods and basing some of it on Becker's recipes as well as other recipes I've been reading. I found the amounts for the mineral vitamin mix she wrote about overwhelming since I only have one 4.12oz dog. I guess i could cut down the amounts but I also worry when she wrote in the book "this is a dusty procedure." My DS has life threatening food allergies and asthma and churning up some of these vitamin mineral supplements worries me. I just started doing the AE a couple of days ago and might have to investigate more into what recipes to put it in but thought that Becker's sounded like such a well rounded plan.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Snowbody said:


> Leslie - I'm trying to give Tyler a well balanced mix of foods and basing some of it on Becker's recipes as well as other recipes I've been reading. I found the amounts for the mineral vitamin mix she wrote about overwhelming since I only have one 4.12oz dog. I guess i could cut down the amounts but I also worry when she wrote in the book "this is a dusty procedure." My DS has life threatening food allergies and asthma and churning up some of these vitamin mineral supplements worries me. I just started doing the AE a couple of days ago and might have to investigate more into what recipes to put it in but thought that Becker's sounded like such a well rounded plan.



Well, I changed my original recipe which I bought from a well-known holistic vet when Nikki was 9 months old. That recipe had Centrum vitamins and canola oil, along with some other vitamins and of course, calcium, which is vital. I just didn't feel comfortable giving Nikki Centrum vitamins and canola oil, so I stopped using those, and switched to Animal Essentials vitamins and kelp, and started using other oils. (I still use calcium, of course.) 

I've been doing it my own way for about 1.5 years and all is well with Nikki's health, and Keiko, too, so far. 

I am not suggesting that anyone follow my lead, but I wanted to share that the AE multivitamins, calcium and kelp seem like they are working for us in combination with the food that they eat and the coconut oil and omega 3 oils they are given.

If there are any doubts or questions about whether the AE multi, and AE calcium, in conjunction with the food one cooks is complete/balanced for your dog, you could always call Animal Essentials and speak to them about it. The staff will be glad to help. 

This is just *my opinion.* I am not a nutritionist. The best way is to follow a recipe exactly, when you are able to do so. Dr Becker's book is great, and easy to follow.

But of course there will always be exceptions to that rule due to other circumstances, like allergies, etc. Just my two cents.


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## mary-anderson (Jan 12, 2010)

I thought I share an email between me and the the co-author of 
Dr. Beckers book. As stated prior I use AE products which I really
like, all my fluffs are healthy. I'll revisit her supplemental advise
but not sure if I'll change.


Great that you're home cooking - and great that you're asking. We were very specific in our book in order to be sure that essential nutrients were included.

Commercial mixes (minerals) are not made to complete diets but to be supplements. We have found none that include the nutrients needed. That's why we included the recipe for a mineral supplement. 
All homemade diets we analyzed were short in zinc, manganese, iron, iodine, etc. 

Animal Essentials is a great company but these supplements are not the same as what is called for.
The calcium is only calcium, no phosphorus. The phosphorus of a bone product is needed unless your animal is on a phosphorus restricted diet.

If you are not using organs your minerals will be additionally skewed (which they are already) since there are many more minerals and specific amino acids in the organs that are included. Even if you used organs from a different animal that would be better than none. You can use freeze dried liver and heart but this is pretty pricey. I know there are ethnic markets in HI that have organs. Just takes a bit of looking.

If you do not use a standardized kelp product that provides the amount of iodine stated, you won't have the amount of iodine needed. You may have way too much or way too little. Kelp products vary a lot. That's why we specified the kind of product required. 

FIsh oils can be varied a lot, as long as they have been tested for heavy metals. Use the amount specified in our recipes (in grams or milligram equivalent. 

We hope to include to include a recipe for a diet without organs in our revision of the book - but it would not be our first choice. Real food is always better than a supplement. 
If you continued to feed a diet with no organs, you'd need a revised supplement recipe. We do analysis for people who have specific needs, but it's really better to stick to the recipe. We made the mineral supplement as simple as we could. It takes 15 minutes to order the stuff (I like luckyvitamin.com and iherb) and 15 minutes to make enough for almost 200# of food.

Hope this helps!

Beth

Beth Taylor and Karen Shaw Becker DVM
naturalpetproductions.com

On Aug 6, 2010, at 12:28 PM, Anderson, Mary E CIV CSP, N62 wrote:

> Aloha,
> 
> I follow your book to home cook for my dogs and they love it!! I do have a few questions since I'm unable to follow it exactly.I live in Hawaii and I'm unable to get the organ parts you call for so I just ensure I have the totally poundage. Is that ok? Also I use a different vitamin mix. I use all Animal Essential products calcium, probiotics, multivitamin, kelp, and fish oil. I give the amount as per directions. Is this ok? I have 4 wonderful dogs Reginald a 16 year old cocker spaniel, Alvin a 2 1/5 year multi-poo, Chloe a 1 year maltese and my newest adoption Libby a 9 year maltese. I only want the best for my fluffs!! I would appreciate any advice.
> 
> 
> Thank,
> Mary Anderson


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

Mary - Thank you so much for contacting Beth directly. She conveyed exactly what I was thinking but could not have communicated as effectively and completely.

As far as making the vitamin mix I don't see a reason why it couldn't be ground up outside or in a garage and then stored in a container for use. Once it's ground up it's not messy.


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## Tiger's Mom (Jan 9, 2008)

wooflife said:


> I'm sure the kids are loving their first home cooked breakfast. What recipe are you using?


Sophia and Suzan's recipe's are my fav's so am going with theirs:wub: .

I already have all of the AI essentials and have been ready for a long time.


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## Tiger's Mom (Jan 9, 2008)

Snowbody said:


> Des -- :aktion033::aktion033: I applaud your going with home cooking too. The recalls really freak me out and the smell of some of the wet foods for dogs really turns me off and Tyler never has liked kibble.
> I've gone to the home cooking route too since I cook most nights at home for us anyway. I got Dr. Becker's book but was intimidated by the mixes to make the supplements so I just got a Animal Essentials Multi Vitamins, Calcium and Enzymes and Probiotics the other day to mix in with the foods. I was so afraid Tyler would back away from it and not eat it but to the contrary -- he's either not noticed or the supplements taste okay (that's what they said on the AE webinar I joined last month) and I'm just so happy with him eating fresh food, veggies and fruit.


my switching too longer than I wanted to because all my babies are such piggies and they are not picky at all :HistericalSmiley: my concern has been that once I have switched and can't consistently home cook for them, then my babies my not want to go back to kibble :blush: then that would worry me the most :wub:


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

mary-anderson said:


> I thought I share an email between me and the the co-author of
> Dr. Beckers book. As stated prior I use AE products which I really
> like, all my fluffs are healthy. I'll revisit her supplemental advise
> but not sure if I'll change.
> ...



BTW, there is a small amount of phosphorus in the AE Calcium. Phosphorus is also found in meat and dairy products.

Nikki has never had a phosphorus imbalance or any other mineral/vitamin imbalance in 1.5 years of using AE products. She doesn't eat any organ meats, either. I'm not trying to push AE or any other company, or my way of doing things. I'm just relating my own personal experiences. 

I have a lot of respect for Dr. Becker and Beth Taylor, and I still think it's best to follow their recipes to the letter.


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## mary-anderson (Jan 12, 2010)

Suzan,

It's so funny because I just went to there website and
saw that. I really like what I do now for my babies.
I'm at work right now :innocent: when I get home I look at the
book but something tells me I'm going to stick with
what I'm currently doing.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

wooflife said:


> Mary - Thank you so much for contacting Beth directly. She conveyed exactly what I was thinking but could not have communicated as effectively and completely.
> 
> As far as making the vitamin mix I don't see a reason why it couldn't be ground up outside or in a garage and then stored in a container for use. Once it's ground up it's not messy.


Leslie - I live in a NYC apartment - no garage, no outside to make things. :mellow: I'm just trying to do the best I can with my DS and my Tyler. I have been thinking of adding organ meats for Tyler but I don't feed them to my family because I'm afraid toxins end up there in the animals they come from. However I figured if she recommends them so highly I should use them. I briefly spoke to a nutritionist from a well know animal medical center and she thought I was doing a good job. I think we all have to find our comfort level.
I just this minute heard a news report on WCBS-TV on foods during the summer that can be toxic to pets, and part of it said: 
_“‘Can I give them watermelon? Can I give them cantaloupe? Can I give them … ’ Don’t give them any of that stuff,” veterinarian Dr. Mike Hutchinson said.Believe it or not Dr. Hutchinson says these foods can literally ferment inside a dog’s stomach, creating alcohol and a potentially fatal reaction_
So I hear this but in Dr. Beckers book she has watermelon and cantaloupe in the recipes. I'm sooo confused. I think I just have to follow what I call my mommy gut, which I followed for my own DS. My own mom home cooked for our dogs for a period over 30 years and they all lived really long lives (including Yorkies and Chi's) and never had any health issues except old, old age.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Snowbody said:


> Leslie - I live in a NYC apartment - no garage, no outside to make things. :mellow: I'm just trying to do the best I can with my DS and my Tyler. I have been thinking of adding organ meats for Tyler but I don't feed them to my family because I'm afraid toxins end up there in the animals they come from. However I figured if she recommends them so highly I should use them. I briefly spoke to a nutritionist from a well know animal medical center and she thought I was doing a good job. I think we all have to find our comfort level.
> I just this minute heard a news report on WCBS-TV on foods during the summer that can be toxic to pets, and part of it said:
> _“‘Can I give them watermelon? Can I give them cantaloupe? Can I give them … ’ Don’t give them any of that stuff,” veterinarian Dr. Mike Hutchinson said.Believe it or not Dr. Hutchinson says these foods can literally ferment inside a dog’s stomach, creating alcohol and a potentially fatal reaction_
> So I hear this but in Dr. Beckers book she has watermelon and cantaloupe in the recipes. I'm sooo confused. I think I just have to follow what I call my mommy gut, which I followed for my own DS. My own mom home cooked for our dogs for a period over 30 years and they all lived really long lives (including Yorkies and Chi's) and never had any health issues except old, old age.



Oh dear. If fruit fermented that quickly into toxic alcohols, then my dogs should have been dead a long time ago. I feed them fruits almost every day and haven't had any problems. Dogs digestive tracts are pretty short, and I don't think food stays in them for too long unless they have GI issues.

Regarding organ meats, I think that they are fine ONLY IF they come from a trusted source and are grass FINISHED beef/lamb, or totally pastured, free-roaming chickens. I can't get that kind of good-quality organ meat locally. I'd have to drive a few hours to a farm. So I skip the organ meats for now, until my local store starts carrying the good stuff. 

Everyone has to do what works for them. Like I've said many times before, I cannot advise anyone on nutrition. I can only tell you what works for me.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

I use KAL bone meal in Lady's recipe. It has 540 mg of phosphorus to 1620 mg of calcium. AE only has 24 mg of phosphorus to 100 mg of calcium.

Buy Kal - Bone Meal Powder 1000 mg. - 16 oz. at LuckyVitamin.com

Animal Essentials - Premium quality supplements for dogs and cats

Dogs need 1.2 parts of calcium for each 1 part of phosphorus (1.2:1). Getting this ratio right when homecooking is very important to your dogs cardiac, skeletal and neurological health.

Calcium & Phosphorous in Dogs* - Chinaroad Lowchens of Australia -

It's recommended that you get complete bloodwork done six months after starting a homecooked diet to make sure all your dogs' nutritional requirements are being met.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Ladysmom said:


> I use KAL bone meal in Lady's recipe. It has 540 mg of phosphorus to 1620 mg of calcium. AE only has 24 mg of phosphorus to 100 mg of calcium.
> 
> Buy Kal - Bone Meal Powder 1000 mg. - 16 oz. at LuckyVitamin.com
> 
> ...



Yes, but how much calcium/phosphorus is in the proteins that we feed along with the supplement? If the meat we are feeding has calcium/phosphorus, isn't that counted toward the 1.2:1 ratio? Meat has much more phosphorus than it does calcium, unless you feed ground up bones. 

BTW, KAL is a good brand of bone meal. I wouldn't buy bone meal unless I knew it had been tested for lead and other toxic metals, as well as mad cow disease.


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

Snowbody said:


> Leslie - I live in a NYC apartment - no garage, no outside to make things. :mellow: I'm just trying to do the best I can with my DS and my Tyler. I have been thinking of adding organ meats for Tyler but I don't feed them to my family because I'm afraid toxins end up there in the animals they come from. However I figured if she recommends them so highly I should use them. I briefly spoke to a nutritionist from a well know animal medical center and she thought I was doing a good job. I think we all have to find our comfort level.
> I just this minute heard a news report on WCBS-TV on foods during the summer that can be toxic to pets, and part of it said:
> _“‘Can I give them watermelon? Can I give them cantaloupe? Can I give them … ’ Don’t give them any of that stuff,” veterinarian Dr. Mike Hutchinson said.Believe it or not Dr. Hutchinson says these foods can literally ferment inside a dog’s stomach, creating alcohol and a potentially fatal reaction_
> So I hear this but in Dr. Beckers book she has watermelon and cantaloupe in the recipes. I'm sooo confused. I think I just have to follow what I call my mommy gut, which I followed for my own DS. My own mom home cooked for our dogs for a period over 30 years and they all lived really long lives (including Yorkies and Chi's) and never had any health issues except old, old age.


Susan,

Yes everyone has to do the best they can and I certainly don't fault you if you can't mix up the vitamin mixture due to your circumstances. I didn't think my statement through enough to consider you might not have an outside area to mix the vitamins and I apologize. :blush:

I know how much you love Tyler and want to do the best for him. You would never do anything that you thought would harm him.

As for the fruit - I don't have enough information to pick a side on that one so I'm pleading the fifth until I learn more about it. :brownbag:


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Nikki's Mom said:


> Yes, but how much calcium/phosphorus is in the proteins that we feed along with the supplement? If the meat we are feeding has calcium/phosphorus, isn't that counted toward the 1.2:1 ratio? Meat has much more phosphorus than it does calcium, unless you feed ground up bones.
> 
> BTW, KAL is a good brand of bone meal. I wouldn't buy bone meal unless I knew it had been tested for lead and other toxic metals, as well as mad cow disease.


I follow an exact recipe for Lady and add the amount of bone meal specified in the recipe. I know you have to be very careful about bone meal. I would never buy one specifically for pets, only a high quality human grade bone meal like KAL.


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## Tiger's Mom (Jan 9, 2008)

Nikki's Mom said:


> Oh dear. If fruit fermented that quickly into toxic alcohols, then my dogs should have been dead a long time ago. I feed them fruits almost every day and haven't had any problems. Dogs digestive tracts are pretty short, and I don't think food stays in them for too long unless they have GI issues.
> 
> Regarding organ meats, I think that they are fine ONLY IF they come from a trusted source and are grass FINISHED beef/lamb, or totally pastured, free-roaming chickens. I can't get that kind of good-quality organ meat locally. I'd have to drive a few hours to a farm. So I skip the organ meats for now, until my local store starts carrying the good stuff.
> 
> Everyone has to do what works for them. Like I've said many times before, I cannot advise anyone on nutrition. I can only tell you what works for me.


oh my goodness, same here . .all my babies LOVE fruits so I give them as much as can when they are available . . .


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