# Products to prevent matting and stinky tear stains help please!



## Purple-peep (May 14, 2009)

I've got Libby cut down pretty short with the exception of her tail and ears. The long ear hair is contantly getting matted because she likes to play rough and rub on things. Is there any products out there, to prevent the matts? 

Also, she has dark brown eye stains. It smells pretty bad:w00t: Does a odor indicate what kind of staining it is like yeast or a bacteria?

Thanks in advance!


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

If the stains smell your dealing with yeast. IMO I would wash her face every day and remove all grains and sugars from her diet. Grains and sugars feed yeast. You can also add coconut oil to her diet it takes a month or so but this will reduce tear stains and yeast. 

How old is Libby? If she is teething this is a stage we all go through and it should end on it's own when she gets all her adult teeth in. 

As for the matting. I comb in the morning and at night and use Pure Paws products. This has reduced matting for me. However if Libby is getting her adult coat this another one of those stages that you have to work through.


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## Purple-peep (May 14, 2009)

Thank you very much for your help! She turned 1 in March so it's not teething. I'm wondering if it's allergies. She was on meds for honking a few months ago. I stopped giving her the meds when the honking was gone. Maybe I should put her back on it?

I wash her face everynight but it's still stinky.

I'm going to try some new conditioners. I just ran out of Pet Head. We've been using that for a while.

How do you add the coconut oil and where can I find it?

Thanks again!


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## kayleygryder (Aug 8, 2010)

Thought I would share with you what we do. 
1: no tinned or dried food. It's not so good for maltese as they do tend to have lots of allergies (vets say dried food, but I believe it's so they make money from the sales of the food which is why they recommend it) 
2: only raw food. For breakfast our puppies get raw snow peas, pears and carrots. 
lunch is apples, + raw bones - chick necks, wings, legs, or carcass. or lamb necks
Dinner is raw meat only. We have our butcher mince chicken carcass for us and I mix that with chicken stock that I make myself by slow cooking the carcasses with water, herbs and veges like celery, carrots, snowpeas, pumpkin and sweet potato. + offal atleast twice a week. 

Our puppy has stained eyes and last time we were at the vet she said more Vitamin A by feeding liver or alfalfa sprouts raw. 

The smell might be from an infection. Our puppies ears had that smell from an infection, which was caused by us washing her head and getting water in her ears and instead of using meds to clear it up, we used 1 part vinegar 2 parts water and used cotton balls to clean them out and scraping the wax out with my nails. It worked and now they are clear. 

Try using plain water each day to clean the gunk and change your dogs diet to raw.


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## iheartbisou (Feb 13, 2007)

You can buy coconut oil (Organic or "virgin" organic is what you need to buy) from somewhere like Whole Foods or a health food store. Maybe add a teaspoon poured over the kibble once a day or so. She'll probably really like the taste.

What are you feeding? I would use a grain free food (if you aren't already doing that). Also, maybe give her water not from the faucet.. Maybe that could tribute if there are things in the water? I don't know.

Also, once you've stopped the actual cause of staining, I've used Eye Envy on the existing stains and that worked for us..both the liquid and the powder together. 

For matting, I've used and liked: OMG by Plush Puppy and also Maltese secret detangler (although this comes in a very small bottle but it has worked for us). 
Good luck!


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## Cosy (Feb 9, 2006)

When the eyes tear consistently it causes wetness on the mustache thus setting up favorable conditions for yeast. 
Keeping eyes soothed and free of debris helps. A good eye wash (Fresh Eyes Collyrium ...human product) twice a day keeps irritation at a minimum. I would try eliminating poultry if you feed that. Many dogs are sensitive to it.


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## glamourdog (Apr 17, 2004)

I've had excellent success with Angel Eyes for Tearstains, and have known a ton of people that love it. There is no daily cleaning in my experience, the tearstains just stop forming right away so they are gone as soon as you cut out or clean out the stains that are already there. 

Regarding the smelly discharge, I fed my girls Honest Kitchen Force for a very long time, coincidentally, my girls faces got very gunky and stinky. I took one of them to the Vet twice, got some antibiotics, but it always came back. It stayed like this for almost a year, I had suspicions it was their food but thought I must be wrong because HK is a dehydrated Raw. 

I stopped giving them HK about 2 months ago and it has cleared up. I still don't know for sure that it was the food but, that was just my experience. 

I'm actively looking for a new food for them. 

I'm trying out Sojos, and Addiction right now. but I'm definitely open to suggestions.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Unfortunately there is no "one cure" fix for every dog. Certain dogs may react differently to different foods or even protein sources. The Honest Kitchen is an excellent food and I know of others whose babies faces cleared up after switching to that food...as just an example. Others may have seasonal allergies. Tear ducts could be clogged. There could be a bad tooth or an infection of the gums. Or some may even have eyelashes growing under the eye lid. All you can do is eliminate the 'known problems' for excessive tearing and then experiment to find the right combo for you. Don't use plastic dishes. Stay away from food and treats with corn, wheat and soy and artificial colors. Use purified water, or better yet reverse osmosis. DO wash their face daily...even twice a day during times when they are tearing more. Make sure to always comb out the dark eye goobers. Not removing them will add to the staining really quickly.

Personally, I would *NOT* use Angel Eyes. It's banned in other countries and I hope the US follows. There is an undisclosed amount of Tylan in it and giving your baby an antibiotic on a daily basis can cause other problems. I hate the stuff and refuse to sell it even though I could make a nice little profit on it. If your vet has ruled out any physical problem and you have tried all the homeopathic things to get the staining under control, have the vet prescribe a course of Tylan. This way you know how much she is getting and for only a 10 day course. Your vet will have record of how often this is happening as well which may enlighten you both as to a pattern and possibly help diagnose the root of the excessive tearing. Just be sure to give Probiotics after the course of antibiotics is finished to build up the good bacteria. You have to separate the Probiotics and the Antibiotics for the Probiotic to be effective so it's easiest to just wait until the antibiotics are finished.

For matting, the best things I've found so far is using a 50/50 mixture of PurePaws Ultra Moisturizing Conditioner and PurePaws Silk Cream. For daily brushing the PurePaws Ultra Conditioning Spray is phenomenal at getting out any matts. Remember that the PurePaws conditioners are heat activated.

This is the routine that seems to work well for my 3. Jett is the one who has a tendency to tear more often during certain times of the year.



Wash face every morning with PurePaws No Rinse Shampoo (I rinse out but I don't have to be super careful to get it thoroughly rinsed since it's a no rinse.
During times of heavy tearing, I use the No Rinse Shampoo at night and I don't rinse it out, just comb it through.
During times of heavy tearing I use a human grade eyewash like Fresh Eyes with Collyrium in the morning and evening. If I'm able, I may even use it during the day.
I add Probiotics to their meals to build up the good bacteria in their digestive systems to help promote a super healthy digestive system. If Libby was recently on an antibiotic, the antibiotic killed off the bad bacteria, but also all the good. You need to rebuild that back up and get her body back in balance. That could be why you are having an issue with yeast. Probiotics is a must. Dogs can get Candida and it's extremely hard to diagnose. I don't really think feeding them Yogurt is the same because you don't get nearly as many strains of the Probiotic family in yogurt as you do in a high quality Probiotic Supplement. Also, most dogs won't eat plain yogurt and feeding one that's flavored is sweetened which is adding sugar to their diet and is also bad for their teeth.
Feed the highest quality, freshest food you can afford and can physically manage. Try to avoid kibble if at all possible, canned is better. If you can manage to home cook, try one of the pre-mixes to make it easier on you. I use Dr. Harvey's. Or you can follow a recipe from a veterinary nutritionist. Dr. Becker just put out a book with recipes. Please don't make up your own because you won't know what vitamins and minerals and calcium you need to add to make it balanced. Just a tiny bit too much calcium or not enough can through off their phospherous level. If unchecked, it can do real damage. Once settled on a brand of food, make sure to alternate the protein sources. We would not be the healthiest if all we ate was chicken. We get other things we need from beef, lamb, fish, etc. So one week feed lamb and sweet potato formula and the next week feed the venison formula. When home cooking alternate the protein sources as well.
Adding EFA's (Essential Fatty Acids...the good Omega 3's) to a dog's diet is the most common first step when dealing with a dog that you think may have allergies. Often excessive tearing is due to allergies.
Add some Coconut Oil. This is not an Omega 3 and should not be used as a replacement but in addition. I use Coco Therapy because of they way it's processed. You can also get it from your health food store. Do NOT use Coconut Oil from the grocery store. It's our bedtime 'snack'. lol I put a little in the palm of my hand and they lick it up. Any residual coconut oil I feel on my hand I rub into whatever area feels dry on myself...usually my legs. :blush:


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## glamourdog (Apr 17, 2004)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> Personally, I would *NOT* use Angel Eyes. It's banned in other countries and I hope the US follows. There is an undisclosed amount of Tylan in it and giving your baby an antibiotic on a daily basis can cause other problems. I hate the stuff and refuse to sell it even though I could make a nice little profit on it.


You absolutely have some excellent advice regarding diet, I'm trying to read everything I can from you! 

Regarding Angel Eyes, have you heard any recent news about it that brought you to this conclusion? From my understanding all angel eyes, is not banned in other countries. I think what you are referring to is that certain countries in Europe do not allow the import of "meat" the meat content is what's banned, not the Tylosin. 

Because of that they created the sweet potoato brand with no meat. One of their biggest reasons for making it was so that they could ship it overseas. That is shipped overseas all the time.

I totally understand your concern about it, but I haven't heard anythigng negative about it other than opinion. They have done toxicology reports on it and there have been no reports of toxicity with long term use, or overdoses. I'm wondering if you've heard different?

And on a personal note, my vet reccomends it. but I'm sure you could find some that don't. 

All that said, personally I don't keep my girls on it very long, I don't see the need, and no use having them take anything in they don't need. When the tearstains go away they come off of it. They stay off for months at a time, sometimes years. Also in my experience, it only helps tearstains, it *doesn't* do anything for gunky stinky eyes. At least not for my girls. 

Also there's no money to be made in selling Angel Eyes unless you are way overpricing it, or your a Big Box Store. Most sites / boutiques I know offer it as a convenience, but Amazon sells it for basically the same price stores get it for wholesale, with free shipping, and no minimum orders.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

VMDiva | Tear Stain Products: More than Meets the Eye

Dog Tear Stains: Everything You've Heard is Wrong!

These are just 2 links. I have more if you would like. It's banned in the UK and Australia for sure. I'll have to go back through my other links to let you know which other countries it's been banned in. It is banned due to the Tylan, not the beef flavor. Maybe those here on SM from outside the US will volunteer if it's banned in their country or not. Just do a search here on this forum and you'll see many threads discussing the fact that there is an undisclosed amount of Tylan in Angel Eyes. The only vet that I've spoken to that was ok with the use of Angel Eyes was a vet who did not do any research into it. All the other vets I've spoken with have done research and they say there are too many antibiotic resistant strains of bacteria now and don't want people to be able to indiscriminately use an antibiotic. And again, it is an undisclosed amount. Too many people use it on a daily basis for life since once they stop the staining returns. Studies show Tylan raises the ALT level so you know it's stressing the liver.

I know what my cost is on Angel Eyes and I know what most boutiques sell it for. There is a profit to be made on the product because not everyone goes to Amazon.com. Many people won't buy things on line at all.


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## kayleygryder (Aug 8, 2010)

My preference is not to feed any mixes to my dogs at all, unless they are completely raw. Whenever you feed cooked meat to dogs you are denaturing the proteins in the meat which means that your dogs aren't getting the protein requirements they need and most canned, tinned or premade food is cooked. + dogs don't need any grains.

We have a naturopathic vet and she is highly recommending a complete raw diet for our dogs and I agree with Crystal, that if you feed to much of one type of food they don't get their vitamin levels correct which is why we feed chicken bones, lamb meat and offal + raw fresh fruit and veg to ensure they are getting a complete mix of essential vitamins and minerals and we also add Olive oil and Cod liver oil to our dogs as well. 

+ depending on where you live you can choose kangaroo, crocodile buffalo, deer, beef, so many meat choices for your animals. 

I look at it from this perspective, your dogs isn't sitting in the wild with their cooker cooking their food or opening tins of cans with a can opener so why feed your dog that type of food. 

Alot of people have different beliefs around what to feed dogs and each as emotionally charged as the other. Go with what you feel is the best type of food for your dog and also what is easiest for you. 

We like raw because it takes a minute to prepare the vegs, we just take them out of the fridge and deseed them. 
The meat gets put straight into their bowls as do the bones. 

And it's cost effective because the have healthier teeth and coats + they are generally healthier animals.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

kayleygryder said:


> My preference is not to feed any mixes to my dogs at all, unless they are completely raw. Whenever you feed cooked meat to dogs you are denaturing the proteins in the meat which means that your dogs aren't getting the protein requirements they need and most canned, tinned or premade food is cooked. + dogs don't need any grains.
> 
> We have a naturopathic vet and she is highly recommending a complete raw diet for our dogs and I agree with Crystal, that if you feed to much of one type of food they don't get their vitamin levels correct which is why we feed chicken bones, lamb meat and offal + raw fresh fruit and veg to ensure they are getting a complete mix of essential vitamins and minerals and we also add Olive oil and Cod liver oil to our dogs as well.
> 
> ...


Just to make sure everyone knows, a dog with a compromised liver should not be on a raw diet so please have a CBC done prior to transitioning to a raw diet. And unfortunately, not every dog's system can tolerate raw. Or a true grain free diet. My Jett can't do a raw diet and does better with a little of the really good grains. I'm suspecting Jett is an asymptomatic MVD dog but Bile Acid Testing was not done when he was younger. So even though his ALT and AST levels are perfect, I'm betting if we did a bile acid test, it would be high. 

Just thought I'd mention this because I know I felt like I was 'failing' Jett by not being able to get him to a point where he could do raw, or even totally grain free. It wasn't until I spoke with 2 different holistic vets who simply told me that in truth not all dogs can do raw and grain free and I should be proud of where I've gotten Jett. So I don't want anyone to feel badly if they aren't doing raw or even home cooked. Dr. Harvey put it best. Are we killing our dogs by feeding them a commercial kibble? Are they dying in the streets? The answer is no and we would be doing a disservice to people if we told them they were killing their dogs. There are many dogs who have lived a very long and healthy life on commercial kibble. Even really poor quality kibble. Are there more health problems in dogs since the introduction of commercial dog food in the past 30 years? Yes. So if someone has a dog with a health problem, I then will say maybe we should look at their diet. But if a dog is healthy and thriving, I've learned to keep my mouth shut at the store so I don't make anyone feel bad. You just do the best that you can.


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## glamourdog (Apr 17, 2004)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> The Honest Kitchen is an excellent food and I know of others whose babies faces cleared up after switching to that food...as just an example.


 
I'm with you. I still have a hard time believing that Honest Kitchen was what was causing my girls stinky gunky eye problems, but it was just so coincidental that they got that way while I was feeding them almost exclusively HK and it went away when I stopped. 

I'm going to give it another try. I love the stuff, and they do too. Also a big plus is it keeps them very regular. LOL. Hopefully their gunky stuff doesn't come back. 

I'll probably try another type instead of Force, need to figure out which one is best.


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## wooflife (Aug 8, 2007)

glamourdog said:


> I'm with you. I still have a hard time believing that Honest Kitchen was what was causing my girls stinky gunky eye problems, but it was just so coincidental that they got that way while I was feeding them almost exclusively HK and it went away when I stopped.
> 
> I'm going to give it another try. I love the stuff, and they do too. Also a big plus is it keeps them very regular. LOL. Hopefully their gunky stuff doesn't come back.
> 
> I'll probably try another type instead of Force, need to figure out which one is best.



I use the preference for my home mix. Honestly my maltese has more eye boogers in the morning on that food but no staining. I just comb the little boogers out every morning and she is good to go.


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