# Traumatized



## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

Hey everyone

Sadie and I had her first puppy preschool class tonight. No surprise, she was the tiniest puppy (she's only 3.5pounds!) and was very nervous. The trainer has us do off-leash playtime at the beginning of class. Some of the other puppies wanted to play with her but ended up basically trampling her. The trainer told us specifically to let them play and she would take care of them. Sadie was SO upset about these big dogs running all over her that she started screeching. It was heart wrenching to the point that I was tearing up. The puppies had her backed into a corner and she was completely freaked out. It only lasted maybe a minute before the trainer came over and guided the bigger dogs away, but Sadie and I were both completely traumatized. 

I feel stupid for even admitting this, but I actually cried when I got home because I felt like such a bad mommy for letting my baby get so upset :-( 

She seems okay now and is napping. I just don't want her to think I'm a bad mom and that I don't love her :-( 

This is Sadie after the play time incident.. She was literally squishing herself into the fence as hard as she could. I picked her up right after. 

Any words of advice or encouragement would be greatly appreciated. I want her to be well socialized but I never want her to be that upset ever again :-/ the noise she made was just horrendous 










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## eiksaa (Jun 8, 2012)

That does not sound good. Gustave is also the smallest puppy and often backs away when others start playing rough. Our trainer always asks me to take him out and just observe. We try again in a few minutes and he participates sometimes. If he doesn't, our trainer again separates him from the pack. 

Your trainer's approach does not sound right to me. And there is NO way this makes you a bad mommy. 


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## Leila'sMommy (Oct 20, 2012)

Poor baby!! I would've been horrified myself! Leila just completed her puppy classes and the trainer we had was great. He never had us take our puppies off their leashes. I'm so glad your little fluff didn't get hurt! How did he know one of those bigger ones wasn't going to hurt her?


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## Furbabies mom (Jul 25, 2011)

I would of had a heart attack!!!! I worry about Dewey with my OWN three, let alone bigger strange dog's!


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

The trainer had me hold Sadie for the rest of play time, but we both were already upset at that point. Sadie is SO quiet so to hear her make any noise, never mind that horrible screeching, was just awful. I think next class I will speak to the trainer ahead of time and tell her that I really just don't feel comfortable letting her off leash with these dogs. 

Sadie doesn't seem too mad at me so that's good. She snuggled up next to me on the couch and took a nap when we got home. 

I didn't think I was capable of loving something so much as I love this dog


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## MoonDog (Jun 6, 2011)

Kaitlin, don't feel silly or stupid for crying. You love your baby and best of all, Sadie knows that you do, no matter what! You never want her to be hurt or upset so when this happened, it's only natural that you would feel bad for taking her there. Now, let yourself off the hook and just enjoy your baby. I don't have advice for you regarding puppy school, but I'm sure others will. You are a GREAT mommy!


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## MalteseJane (Nov 21, 2004)

My advice ? I would NOT go back to this class !! :smilie_tischkante: Scaring them to death will not socialize them.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

How horrible! Where did you take her for these classes? Was the trainer certified? It sounds like the trainer had no idea what she was doing.

I don't blame you for being upset! It is inexcusable for the trainer to allow this with a group of puppies she knew nothing about. Poor, poor Sadie.


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## eiksaa (Jun 8, 2012)

MalteseJane said:


> My advice ? I would NOT go back to this class !! :smilie_tischkante: Scaring them to death will not socialize them.


My thoughts exactly. 


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

That is horrible, i would not be going back to that class and possibly asking for a refund. Poor Sadie and poor you. Don't beat yourself up, your not a bad mommy, that is a really uneducated trainer. 

Kelly is in beginners obedience and she is the smallest one there, she is surrounded by dogs that are 50lbs and bigger. The trainer has us sit in a spot away from the other dogs and the ones the seem more aggressive she has the owner and dog sit behind a gated part of the training center, still part of the class, but the dog is away from other dogs that way there will be no fights and no one is off leash. One dog couldn't concentrate at all when she saw other dogs, she was in a gated part of the training center and the trainer put a blanket over the gate so the dog couldn't see the other dogs, the owners decided on private classes for the dog after the one class. I really love the trainer we have, well i should say both trainers (one works training dolphins, seals and otters at the Gulfarium) she works alot with me and Kelly and they both only use positive reinforcement.


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## joyomom (Jan 13, 2008)

Ladysmom said:


> How horrible! Where did you take her for these classes? Was the trainer certified? It sounds like the trainer had no idea what she was doing.
> 
> I don't blame you for being upset! It is inexcusable for the trainer to allow this with a group of puppies she knew nothing about. Poor, poor Sadie.



I totally agree with Marge!!! And I would have cried too!!


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## Zoe's Mom88 (Apr 25, 2011)

Please don't take your baby back to this class. It sounds horrifying to you and I can just imagine what Sadie was feeling. It's okay don't blame yourself as you thought you were doing the right thing. She is fine and will soon forget what happened. Hugs to you and Sadie.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

None of this was your fault. I place the blame on the trainer. It reminds me of when I first took Tyler to a puppy play group. Well all the other "puppies" were really large and pretty out of control and Tyler was petrified just like Sadie. It really wasn't a good facility and they didn't seem to care what the dogs did. Tyler sat between my legs and then insisted on me picking her up. After that I decided I really wanted to socialize him with dogs that were somewhat his size and we attended a Maltese Meet Up. Tyler was afraid the first one but then was perfectly fine after that. We then signed up for Puppy obedience and I asked about the size of the dogs. The trainer worked with me to make sure that Tyler was in a class of small to medium dogs. Most all the time was spent learning with a little socializing at the end after the pups had been familiar with seeing each other and a little tired from class. Like others I would suggest you get your money back from that class (that photo is enough to say it was a bad idea) and find another and make sure she or he is APDT certified. Also look for toy/small dog or Maltese meet ups in your area.


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

Here are a link to hopefully help you find a trainer if and when you decide to enroll her in a class, to search for a trainer in your area just go to the left and click 'Dog Trainer Search', for some reason when i try to link it here it takes you to the page on 'How to Chose a Dog Trainer'. I'm just so sorry that you and your baby had to go through that. :grouphug:



How to Choose a Dog Trainer


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

How big were the other puppies? I agree with everyone else - this is the TRAINER'S fault, not yours. If it was someplace like Petsmart or Petco, I would complain to the manager. That does not sound right.


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## yukki (Aug 22, 2007)

I totally agree with all the others and would definitely NOT take her back. I KNOW I would have cried so don't feel bad about feeling sad, mad and upset for your baby. We love our babies and hate to see them upset or hurting. In fact, I was even near tears reading this!! These little ones are so precious and do not need to be subjected to rough treatment of any kind. I think I might have been so mad that I would have gone and picked her up and jsut LEFT!!!!!!!!!! And to be honest, I am curious to know what that trainer was trying to accomplish with such harsh treatment.


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

I will definitely look into small dog meet ups in my area. I have a few friends in the area with dogs and we've had many successful puppy play dates, so maybe I will just keep doing that for now. Sadie has played with two yellow labs and was totally fine. She was actually bullying them and stealing all of their toys! I don't think it was even the size of these dogs tonight so much as the fact that they were stepping on her and squishing her.

I am going to email the trainer tomorrow about what happened. I did check out the link and the trainer I am going to is the only one that was listed in my area :-/ she is apparently certified and had amazing reviews online, which is why I signed up in the first place. 

If I do end up going back, Sadie will NOT be participating in the play time, regardless of what anyone says. She can watch safely from my arms on the other side of the fence. 

Thanks for the kind words and advice. I definitely need them tonight! This is my first dog that is completely my own so I just want to make sure I take the best care of her that I possibly can. And I want to make up for her rough start to life. Thanks again everyone. 

I'm so happy I joined this forum 


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

There was a chocolate lab puppy, a German Shepard puppy and some stupid mean spotted puppy (not Dalmatian though) that were trampling her. They were all 30+ pounds at least. I felt uncomfortable from the second they started playing but I figured that the trainer knew what she was doing.

The actual training part went well though. Sadie caught on to a few things once we got home (too distracted during class wondering where the big mean dogs were)


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

Your photo of Sadie ripped my heart out  I would have been crying *in* class! I want to scoop her up and hug her :hugging:

Grace didn't get to do puppy class. But Gus did. He was the smallest in the class. The trainer there did the same thing. But since I knew Gus was going to be my SD, I watched the other puppies first before putting him down. The trainer glared at me and kept saying, "They are puppies, they will work it out". The other puppies were so rough! So I didn't put him down. I didn't want that experience.

Later in his next class the trainer had him do an exercise (she took him to "show the class") and the other dog she was using was reactive! He almost bit Gus. I left immediately and asked for my money back. It took me weeks to get Gus over that.

Don't feel bad about crying. And I agree 200% with the others - RUN from that trainer. Run very very far! If she can't properly supervise safe socialization between puppies on the first class - what is she going to do later on when people have issues they want addressed with those puppies?

Someone here suggested to me back when Grace was going to go to puppy class... to look at my local ASPCA for classes. I was really impressed. I was ready to sign her up for the next round.

I had also found another local group that does agility but they have great puppy classes. I also found a center that has weekly puppy "play dates" where they do just safe play time and separate the puppies by size AND temperament.

Before you decide on a class for her - make sure to ask the trainer how they do socialization in the class, AND how they handle size differences within class. When you decide on one - let the new trainer know about her scary first experience to puppy class. Maybe the trainer has her own well trained dogs (as they should!) and Sadie could go in for a positive "introduction" to the class space while meeting the safe well socialized dogs.

Hugs for your baby ..... Hugs for you. Get her back around her safe big friend for some healing play time....


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

If I remember correctly, in our puppy class, all of the dogs were either on leash or in owners' arms - no one was allowed off leash to play. The pups were allowed to greet each other and sniff each other but it was very carefully controlled.


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

I agree with everyone else. I would NEVER go back to that class and I would sure as heck be letting the trainer know why I wasn't coming back. There is no way those bigger dogs should have been allowed near Sadie. Don't feel bad for crying, my eyes teared up when I saw her picture by the fence.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Is it possible to lodge a formal complaint against this "trainer"?


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## aprilb (Jul 9, 2010)

I also agree that the trainer was at fault and I would never take her back..just seeing your pic of how terrified she looks made me cry. If it was Petco or Petsmart, I would demand my money back..I am glad she is okay..I never get my Malts around larger dogs...never have and never will..


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## spookiesmom (Mar 28, 2010)

I ran into the same type situation. It was supposed to be a small dog puppy class. Well, a 4 month old lab pup is NOT small. Young and uncontrolled paws flying all over. Spookie was 5# or so. This was at a highly respected dog training facility in my area. We did not go back, I let my feelings be known, still do. I did my own thing with her, she is fine anywhere now.


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

I am probably the least confrontational person ever so I don't want to get into some argument with this lady about getting my money back. However, I am definitely going to write her an email today and let her know that I was very very upset by what happened and reluctant to come back to class. Maybe she will realize how wrong it was? She did seem distracted by the little Boston Terrier puppy, who admittedly was very cute. I mean if I were her and there was a little tiny puppy in the same class as big stupid 50 pound dogs, I would watch the little one very carefully!!

I'm also reluctant to completely pull her out of this class because there aren't many options in my area and price range. There are plently of one on one trainers in my area, but they charge upwards of $90 for one session! I absolutely cannot afford that even if it would be a great option for her. There is also a puppy "boot camp" where they take the puppies for a week and train them for you, but I have ZERO interest in that. It's hard enough leaving for work in the morning, never mind shipping her off for a whole week. 

I think Sadie will be fine in the class if we just don't participate in the off leash play time. The trainer can say whatever she wants about "learning to socialize," but I'd much rather my dog not be horribly traumatized every Wednesday night. We can watch from the other side of the fence until its time to learn on leashes. 

Sadie has a vet appointment tomorrow afternoon to get her last round of shots, so maybe I can ask the vet about it as well. She would probably have a good recommendation for me.


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

Barb, how did you address this with the trainer?? Like what did you say? I am trying to figure out how to make my feelings known, but I am always (stupidly and unnecessarily) worried about being confrontational / rude. 

The whole point of going to the class was to have Sadie learn to be social. She is so shy around new dogs / new experiences, so I was hoping that this would help her come out of her shell.


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## spookiesmom (Mar 28, 2010)

Long story, I had been on the board of directors at USDTC. And an agility trainer. This guy had been in my class. I just told him what I thought. That this class was advertised as being for small puppies. Not all size puppies. And that I did not appreciate 2 lab pups, a golden pup, and a 5 yo Aussie in this class. The Aussie had major issues. I still have friends there and keep up. I hear stuff at the dog park too. I will not recommend this place anymore, some things haven't changed.
I wasn't nasty, just the facts.


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## Kathleen (Aug 4, 2011)

I am so sorry you and Sadie went through this. How scary. The whole point of puppy class is socialization, and negative experiences are just not good. Not to mention that she could really get hurt by the larger dogs.
This happened to me and Daisy too. She was the only little one and the trainer thought it was a good idea to let the group of big dogs gang up on her. She hid under a chair for the whole class and I was terrified that she would truly be hurt. She is such a happy outgoing little dog and to see she so scared was heartbreaking. The trainer was more concerned about letting the big dogs get to interact with a little one than about Daisy's safety. We never went back.
We found a great class through our SPCA (the MSPCA- Conn. must have one too). I explained to the trainer what had happened and she was horrified. She was very sensitive to keeping Daisy safe and making sure she was not scared. When we had off leash play time, Daisy would be in a large pen so the big dogs could run by and say hi, but she was safe. Some weeks there would be another little dog, and they would get to play together in the pen. She ended up having a great time, and we went back for obedience classes too.
I think is is hard to find classes with other small dogs in New England. Everyone seems to have Labs or Retrievers! But I would definitely try to find a trainer who is sensitive. I would call and speak with the trainer before signing up for a different class. I think it is important to find a good class for Sadie to overcome the negative experience. They are such sensitive little dogs. It is so fun to see them have a great time with the other dogs.


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

Kaitlin,

It is your choice, of course....

But I really would not go back to that class, even if the trainer "realizes" what happened was a mistake.

With my experience with trainers who allow that to happen in the first place - she won't. She will tell you she has handled hundreds of puppies and that you are coddling Sadie too much and THAT is why she is so traumatized.

She will put it on you.

And if you pull Sadie from the play part of session, she will basically ignore you and not give you two the full attention.

If she does say, "Oh I never knew..." Then she is way too inexperienced and I wouldn't trust her to train my puppy. Because if she allowed that to happen and you have GSD (and similar size) puppies in your class - Sadie could get hurt with certain exercises you do in class. All because she is an inexperienced trainer.

Years ago I had a rescue lab mix. I had her in puppy class. She had a traumatic background. This was back when the penny can (horrible penny can!) was still in use. I told the trainer I did NOT want her to use it around my puppy or with my puppy. She was skittish and we were there for the socialization.

But the moment my girl jumped up on her to greet her (which was HUGE because she was so scared of strangers!) the trainer shook that dang penny can and scared the pee right out of her  She cowered every time we went to class. So I stopped going.

Finding a good trainer takes time. Sadly.

I'd really suggest if it is limited - training her on your own. It isn't worth risking her socialization or temperament for a class.

Because this is her crucial age where things like this MATTER. If she has another bad experience it could traumatize her to the point that it becomes an ingrained fear that lasts her whole life time.

And you will be anxious and on alert every class, and she will pick up on that.

I am not a confrontational person either. But I am the voice for my dogs. Sometimes that means just leaving and finding something else that works.

Maybe instead of puppy class - you could find a dog daycare that separates toy breeds from the others (Camp Bow Wow is one).... and take her there for socialization 

hugs to you and Sadie...


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## maltese manica (Nov 6, 2012)

Oh my gosh! I feel so bad for you and sadie. Dont go back there..... mabey see if you can private lessons??????


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## Katya (Nov 14, 2012)

MalteseJane said:


> My advice ? I would NOT go back to this class !! :smilie_tischkante: Scaring them to death will not socialize them.


Ditto! There is a fine line, and this trainer seems to have crossed it!


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## eiksaa (Jun 8, 2012)

Here's the thing. It's not about that one isolated incident. This reflects on the trainer's technique and philosophy. Are you confident this trainer won't harm your baby again with her bad technique again?


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## Summergirl73 (Sep 18, 2011)

I really do want to encourage you to stand your ground on this one. You are Sadie's voice and that picture of her said it all. No trainer with any degree of wisdom would have allowed this. It is unhealthy and unacceptable. Poor little baby she was so scared. I bet you were incredibly upset also. I would fire that trainer without blinking an eye.


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

I am working on an email to the trainer right now to ask for my money back. There is a local doggy daycare that does separate the little dogs from the big dogs, and my friend's dog goes there (Zorro). Zorro and Sadie are good friends. I would rather spend the money on taking her there for socialization and just try to train her on my own. 

I can't wait to go home and give her a big hug and a kiss


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## Zoe's Mom88 (Apr 25, 2011)

kaeco510 said:


> I am working on an email to the trainer right now to ask for my money back. There is a local doggy daycare that does separate the little dogs from the big dogs, and my friend's dog goes there (Zorro). Zorro and Sadie are good friends. I would rather spend the money on taking her there for socialization and just try to train her on my own.
> 
> I can't wait to go home and give her a big hug and a kiss


I don't blame you for demanding your money back. Give her a hug and kiss from me and Zoe. :smootch:


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## Kathleen (Aug 4, 2011)

That sounds like a great alternative. From what I learned in puppy kindergarten, the important thing is to expose them to other dogs (in a safe way) and people, and noises and objects when they are young so that they are not scared later. The focus was really socialization initially instead of training. I think just being out in the word, and traveling in the car to class, was a big part of it.

I don't like confrontation either, so when I had to send an email cancelling the initial scary class, I focused on how upset Daisy was, and how concerned I was for her, and that it was not a good fit. They tried to convince me to go back and give it another try, but I stood my ground.

I am sure you will have a great time seeing Sadie play with other little dogs in doggie daycare!



kaeco510 said:


> I am working on an email to the trainer right now to ask for my money back. There is a local doggy daycare that does separate the little dogs from the big dogs, and my friend's dog goes there (Zorro). Zorro and Sadie are good friends. I would rather spend the money on taking her there for socialization and just try to train her on my own.
> 
> I can't wait to go home and give her a big hug and a kiss


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## maltese manica (Nov 6, 2012)

I wouldve bitten the instructor like I did to my swimming instructer when I was three! If I was there and saw that............. :-(


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## kaeco510 (Sep 28, 2012)

She called me and left a voicemail where she said that there are serious fear issues (no kidding!) and that she is a trained professional and would never allow my puppy to get hurt. She wants to discuss this with me further. Ugh.


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## maltese manica (Nov 6, 2012)

Tell her that Sadie says shove it where the moon dont shine!!!! You are a good mommy kaitlin!!!!


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## eiksaa (Jun 8, 2012)

It's not about her being physically hurt. How could a trainer allow a puppy she knows has 'serious fear issues' be further traumatized? Her logic fails. 

Your pup being mad at you or being physically hurt is not even a concern right now. I read in a book if a puppy is scared of something you make him like it slowly. Like start treating when he sees the vacuum cleaner. Shoving a vacuum cleaner on full power in his face is NOT helping him get over that fear. 


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## StevieB (Feb 2, 2012)

kaeco510 said:


> She called me and left a voicemail where she said that there are serious fear issues (no kidding!) and that she is a trained professional and would never allow my puppy to get hurt. She wants to discuss this with me further. Ugh.


Well, just hear what she has to say. You can decide then if you want to go back, but don't feel pressured if it doesn't feel right. If Sadie is scared I don't think forcing her to interact with much larger rambunctious puppies is beneficial, maybe the trainer didn't know she had fear issues. Anyway, if you know anyone who has smaller pups/ or gentle small dogs for Sadie to play with that would help her a lot for socialization. It just needs to be positive, especially if she does have fear issues! Keep us posted!


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

StevieB said:


> Well, just hear what she has to say. You can decide then if you want to go back, but don't feel pressured if it doesn't feel right. If Sadie is scared I don't think forcing her to interact with much larger rambunctious puppies is beneficial, maybe the trainer didn't know she had fear issues. Anyway, if you know anyone who has smaller pups/ or gentle small dogs for Sadie to play with that would help her a lot for socialization. It just needs to be positive, especially if she does have fear issues! Keep us posted!


:goodpost:


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## Rocky's Mom (Apr 10, 2010)

There would be no way I would take my Rocky back there. That was inexcusable. She should have known better than that. I would take your baby for more classes but with other small dogs to become more comfortable with other dogs. Sometimes they just aren't no matter what. I took Rocky to six weeks of puppy classes with other dogs. I could see then that he wasn't too happy to be with other dogs but I thought it would get better. He doesn't bark at other dogs now...just tries to tolerate them. He does go up to other dogs on walks to say hello, but that's as far as he wants it to go, LOL. It used to bother me, but now I just accept my Rockstar for who he is and that's it. If no one else likes it...too bad.


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

I reversed your posts because I watned to respond to the last one first 



kaeco510 said:


> She called me and left a voicemail where she said that there are serious fear issues (no kidding!) and that she is a trained professional and would never allow my puppy to get hurt. She wants to discuss this with me further. Ugh.


I expected that kind of response. A trainer that allows that to happen will often come back with "It is you and your dog, not me!". The fact is: Even if Sadie is fearful - she should have never allowed any of the puppies to corner or scare Sadie in that way. Period.



kaeco510 said:


> I am working on an email to the trainer right now to ask for my money back. There is a local doggy daycare that does separate the little dogs from the big dogs, and my friend's dog goes there (Zorro). Zorro and Sadie are good friends. I would rather spend the money on taking her there for socialization and just try to train her on my own.
> 
> I can't wait to go home and give her a big hug and a kiss


I think this is a WONDERFUL idea.

A friend of mine had suggested a daycare near me. She had a toy puppy who was a little shy and fearful. They put her in day care - the staff supervised 24/7 (the dogs weren't alone for one second).... and her dog is actually really social and no longer fearful 

So it is a great way to socialize a puppy! I'm glad you found one that is safe for her


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## Rocky's Mom (Apr 10, 2010)

Great idea:thumbsup:...I kind of knew she would blame it on you and your fluff! You are doing the right thing. Don't think twice about it. It's not your fault and you are a good mommy!


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## MalteseJane (Nov 21, 2004)

maltese manica said:


> Tell her that Sadie says shove it where the moon dont shine!!!! You are a good mommy kaitlin!!!!


:HistericalSmiley::HistericalSmiley:


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## MalteseJane (Nov 21, 2004)

I don't think she has fear issues. Put you in the place of that little one and being surrounded by giants who want to walk all over her. If she was not fearful before, now she is. 

I went to a class with my dear Alex when he was a puppy. I didn't go there for training just for socializing. It was a mistake. I was lucky, because all the dogs where leashed, so they could not walk all over him. But he was the smallest one even tho he was already 1 year old. All the other ones where puppies (but bigger) and people were looking for training, leash, potty, come, stay, sit. We did not need that. He was already potty trained, walked on a leash, knew come, stay and sit but only did it when he wanted too. All the time we were there he was watching his back. I still remember today after all those years the way he looked at me at one time and I got this voice in my head saying : "mom, what in the h e l l are we doing here, let's go home". This dog was not scared of anything, he would stand on top of the vacuum cleaner but he was not friendly to people he did not know and I thought by socializing he would be better. It did not work. And by the way he was fine with my daughter's shi tzu. I did not make the same mistake with Charlie.


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## poochie2 (Jan 14, 2010)

Oh wow that was scary ! I remember taking mine to those classes and she was the smallest one too. I would sit her in my lap a lot or just keep her close by. She could of got severely injured by the larger dog even if they were just trying to be nice to her. The trainer should know this. She doesn't seem very bright. I wouldn't let her off leash to play with the bigger dogs. Also , those screeches could also mean not only was she afraid but they could of hurt her. I am still puzzled that the "trainer" would allow a 3.5 pound puppy to play with the larger ones.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

The fact that your puppy was outweighed by every dog there by at least twenty lbs and was put in that situation by a trained 'professional' is outrageous. Don't let her turn this around on you and make it be about you enabling her to be scared. 

And how could she possibly know that each of those puppies was not aggressive? That is a huge liability on her part.

I never ever let my dogs 'met' large breed dogs that I do not know, no matter how many times the owner says 'they're friendly' And you know what? They are socialized just fine without that interaction. I know what you mean about not being a confrontational person but this is something you need to stand your ground about and get your b*tch on. She was wrong and she can try to justify it all she wants but she scared your puppy unnecessarily. 

So sorry you are going through this!


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## nicolen412 (Jun 8, 2012)

My gosh I am so sorry about your little puppy!! That trainer does sound super horrible.

To offer some alternative advice though, I disagree with most people about letting your little one about being near big dogs. I take Arthur to the dog park and the big dogs are VERY GOOD with him. I think it is because they are all a bit older. The only issue I had was with a lab puppy but he was only being rough cos he too was young and Didnt know how to be gentle. But he had an EXTREMELY good owner who always kept him under control and leashes him whenever he got too rough. I think overall your pup needs to be introduced to both types of dogs just so he is aware of what Is round him? 

Before I took Arthur to the dog park a trainer I hired Brought his exceptionally well trained Rottweilers to play with Arthur. They were super massive but it taught him to get used to another dog more importantly a big one  


Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App


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## revakb2 (Sep 8, 2006)

Bogie started Basic Obedience at Petsmart at 6 months old. There were three other dogs in the class, all big and from shelters. Believe it or not, it was a great class. The trainer had all of the big dogs held by their owners on a very short leash and let Bogie run free and interact with the big dogs at his own pace. Because of the size difference, Bogie was the only dog ever off leash. Using common sense seems to be lacking in a lot of trained professionals. I have worked with great trainers and some very bad ones. 

The end line is you have to be your dog's advocate. Many trainers do not understand the needs of small dogs, just as many vets do not understand that toy dogs may need to be treated differently. Good luck with the training class.


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## Summergirl73 (Sep 18, 2011)

I'd tell her there is absolutely nothing to discuss. If she pushes you, simply tell her you disagree with the training methods used in the class and that you have a picture to show that your pet was not in an appropriate setting that would best meet her needs.


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

nicolen412 said:


> My gosh I am so sorry about your little puppy!! That trainer does sound super horrible.
> 
> To offer some alternative advice though, I disagree with most people about letting your little one about being near big dogs. I take Arthur to the dog park and the big dogs are VERY GOOD with him. I think it is because they are all a bit older. The only issue I had was with a lab puppy but he was only being rough cos he too was young and Didnt know how to be gentle. But he had an EXTREMELY good owner who always kept him under control and leashes him whenever he got too rough. I think overall your pup needs to be introduced to both types of dogs just so he is aware of what Is round him?
> 
> ...


Please be careful with Arthur.

Every year in my state alone we have at least 5 news reports about a small dog getting mauled by a larger breed.

NOT because the dog was aggressive at all! They were friendly and social dogs!

But because the little dog ran off to play and in just one instant it looked like a "rabbit" or other prey animal and the big dog shot off and killed the little dog. I remember one story where the lady was actually standing near her little dog playing with him and a large dog from the other side saw it as a rabbit.... it wasn't good.

It's always sad and so heartbreaking because the little dogs die and the large dogs have to be put down as well 

It's just not a good idea. It just takes 1 second.

Grace and Gus are both socialized with large dogs. But in a one on one type situation. And highly supervised and contained. They are not allowed to play together. Just calmly coexist.


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## zooeysmom (Aug 1, 2011)

bellaratamaltese said:


> The fact that your puppy was outweighed by every dog there by at least twenty lbs and was put in that situation by a trained 'professional' is outrageous. Don't let her turn this around on you and make it be about you enabling her to be scared.
> 
> And how could she possibly know that each of those puppies was not aggressive? That is a huge liability on her part.
> 
> ...


Good post :thumbsup: 

I would NEVER listen to another word of this wannabe trainer. She is a quack. I never let Zooey meet a large dog I don't know well. Accidents can happen, not only by big dogs who are aggressive, but also by their size/energy. So sorry you had this horrible experience. Try not to learn from it and move on so your baby won't pick up on your upset feelings.


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## Peetle's Mom (Sep 1, 2012)

My Peetle was also 3.5 lbs when she first went to Puppy class. She cowered behind my leg for the first seven weeks of the total eight weeks of class; on the eighth week, she decided she wasn't going to get trampled, and jumped out to play with the other dogs..on her leash, as ALL the dogs were, all the time.
I wouldn't take my dog back to a class like what you describe; a puppy cowering in the corner is clearly terrified and that benefits her in NO way anyone can see. Also, I saw nothing from that trainer explaining how she would handle it if one of those larger puppies 'playfully' decided your baby stimulated its prey drive and it decided to bite her and shake her like a squeak toy or bite her leg in half, Was this expert trainer going to pay your vet bills if your puppy's leg was broken by an overly rough bigger dog? Maltese pups are notoriously delicate little things, especially at THREE AND A HALF POUNDS...grrrrrr. That trainer really is getting under my skin and that photo you took...double grrr. What she wants to say to you other than 'OMG I am so sorry about that all and no big dogs will be around your teensy pup off the leash again' is just beyond me, although the idea of her putting it on you and your pup is probably the safest bet, as others have pointed out.
I really like the idea of you socializing her at the dog daycare where the big and small dogs are separated; it's just safer and when Peetle used to get groomed, that's what they did there. (They were also a dog daycare--small dogs were kept with the small dogs who had grooming appts, big dogs with big dogs, it all was simple as could be). She would play with the other Malts, Yorkies, Shi Tzus and Chins and the GSDs, Labs and whatever giant dogs that thought she was a tiny stuffed toy were kept far from her. I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you what I hope you do, and that's keep that little sweetiehead away from people willing to traumatize her into a cowering ball in the corner. No puppy needs that.


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## CorkieYorkie (Apr 10, 2012)

I'm guessing this trainer wants to "discuss this further" with you in hopes that you will return and give her more $$$!!! Stand your ground, girl! I would NOT take my puppy back there!!! I would write reviews on her so other small dog owners will beware to take their small pup to this trainer. I am spiteful like that :innocent:

Honestly, I would be hesitant to take my Maltese (or other toy breed) to a puppy class if they were puppies just because they will be SO MUCH smaller than the other pups... and I am paranoid! I worry about large breeds ALL THE TIME for what was mentioned already, that they could be aggressive or just see my white fluffs as bunnies...my worst fear. I even get nervous when my Lisa gets too rough with Ozzie...he is so gentle and he truly owns my heart :wub:


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## MyMalteseLovesMe (Aug 5, 2011)

This is ABSOLUTELY unacceptable! It FAR TO DANGEROUS to let a tiny dog be in the same area as much larger dogs. ALL respectable trainers know this and make accomidations for small dogs. I would absolutely demand my money back and find a trainer that has either small dog classes or a seperate area for small dogs. Unfortunately not all trainers are created equal. But by all means dont go back there! She does need to be socialized perhaps having a doggie party with small dogs that are already social is a good idea.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

kaeco510 said:


> She called me and left a voicemail where she said that there are serious fear issues (no kidding!) and that she is a trained professional and would never allow my puppy to get hurt. She wants to discuss this with me further. Ugh.


Be your puppy's advocate. You know what is best for her. Don't take her back to that class. It is non-negotiable. 

Your poor puppy was horribly traumatized by this experience. You were lucky she wasn't physically hurt, but who knows how much she was hurt mentally? If she had fear issues before the class, that idiot just showed her that she has a right to be afraid. :exploding:
Be firm about not returning to the class and ask for a refund. If she is not willing to refund your money, get tough. Dispute the credit card charge or file a complaint with your Attorney General's Office. File a complaint with your Better Business Bureau.


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