# Maltese breeding



## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

Hi, everyone i have a quick question, i just wonderedhow can i breed malteses if i have a maltese dog? What i mean is, girls can find stud dogs to breed, is there anything like that for males? I am doing this purely because i want my dog to have kids, and continue his bloodline. Also if my dog has endorsements but his mate does not, can their kids be kc registered? Thank you, I live in uk.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

I'm not sure how things are done in the UK. Here in the US, maltese breeding usually falls into two categories.

Breeding to better the breed (show breeders, etc)
And
Breeding just to have puppies. (backyard breeders and puppymills)

If you aren't breeding to better the breed, honestly? I would just leave it to the people who are. Maybe some of our UK members can help you out. And I'll just warn you in advance, the members of this forum can be a little touchy on this particular subject, so try not to take it *too* personally. 

What are endorsements, btw? I'm not familiar with that term.


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## NIMaltese (May 24, 2009)

My advice - enjoy your dog and leave the breeding to the people who are experts.
I doubt he cares if he has kids or not.


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## elly (Sep 11, 2006)

QUOTE (NIMaltese @ Oct 3 2009, 08:20 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836412


> My advice - enjoy your dog and leave the breeding to the people who are experts.
> I doubt he cares if he has kids or not.[/B]


Great advice!!!


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

QUOTE (NIMaltese @ Oct 3 2009, 08:20 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836412


> My advice - enjoy your dog and leave the breeding to the people who are experts.
> I doubt he cares if he has kids or not.[/B]


Totally agree. :thumbsup:


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## 3Maltmom (May 23, 2005)

QUOTE (NIMaltese @ Oct 3 2009, 08:20 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836412


> My advice - enjoy your dog and leave the breeding to the people who are experts.
> *I doubt he cares if he has kids or not.
> *[/B]



I doubt it as well.


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## Starsmom (Jan 31, 2009)

I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.

Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.


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## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500


> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~


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## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

oh, im having loads of problems uploading pics and ive tried several times, and now ive gave up lol


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## lottapaws (Mar 29, 2006)

In the US, both parents must be registered and must be registered such that their offspring can be registered. In other words, according to the AKC (American Kennel Club) your dog's offspring could NOT be registered. I do not know if it is the same in the UK, but I would assume so or else why would you even bother to put endorsements on a male's papers?


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## lottapaws (Mar 29, 2006)

To try to answer your question, in the US, both parents must be registered and must be registered such that their offspring can be registered. In other words, according to the AKC (American Kennel Club) your dog's offspring could NOT be registered. I do not know if it is the same in the UK, but I would assume that is is or else why would they even bother to put endorsements on a male's papers? Just my opinion, though, which is worth about two cents on its best day,  

As for posting pictures, it is much easier to post them to your "album". Go to "My Albums" and you can upload directly from your computer. To add pics to your posts, you must have your pictures on the web (not your computer). In other words, you would need to have them put somewhere like photobucket or one of the other picture hosting sites. To post picturs in your gallery, in your albums, you can upload directly from yoru computer without using a host site on the tweb. Hope this helps. There is also a great step-by-step tutorial on here that will walk you through posting pics. Don't give up, we'd love to see pics of your boy!!! We love pictues!!! Oh, and welcome to Spoiled Maltese!!!!! Hope you hang around, we have all learned a wealth of information regarding our furkids and made wonderful friends on SM!!!


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## jude'n'jools (Apr 6, 2006)

QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545


> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?


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## theboyz (Jan 10, 2007)

Please don't breed your dog.

70,000 puppies are born each DAY. 4 to 6 million animals are euthanized because there are no homes for them.

Please rescue. Take a Maltese that is in a shelter and needs a home. That baby will be loving, grateful and YOU will have SAVED a life not made more. 
It would be better to rescue and foster and do something meaningful that will gratify and reward you for a lifetime.
You will love these dogs as much as your own baby and make a difference to one tiny soul.

We beg you to neuter your boy as it will save his life. Un-neutered males get prostrate at a great rate. You are subjecting your boy to health problems that he does not deserve.

Many genetic defects show up months or even years after an unsound breeding.

Is he superior in conformation, temperament and health to MOST of the males in his breed?
Has he and the bitch passed all the health screenings for that breed? In his pedigree are all of his ancestors tested and free from Life-threatening genetic conditions such a liver and heart diseases, autoimmune disorders and seizures, luxating patellas, behavior disorders.......

Please don't Breed for Greed, we beg you.

Rescue a baby that someone else "just wanted one like my baby" or BYB or Puppy Miller.

Be a hero.......please rayer:


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## angel's mom (Feb 14, 2007)

QUOTE (theboyz @ Oct 4 2009, 06:54 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836623


> Please don't breed your dog.
> 
> 70,000 puppies are born each DAY. 4 to 6 million animals are euthanized because there are no homes for them.
> 
> ...


 :goodpost:


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## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621


> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl


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## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

QUOTE (theboyz @ Oct 4 2009, 11:54 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836623


> Please don't breed your dog.
> 
> 70,000 puppies are born each DAY. 4 to 6 million animals are euthanized because there are no homes for them.
> 
> ...


If im breeding to keep the babies. then how is that breed for greed? 
If you dont have any kids but you would like one, would you go to a foster or adopt a child rather than have one of your own? if yes then theres clearly some difference between you and me. Yes i may love the adopted child, but clearly i would rather have one of my own.
I understand why you people would be so against breeding, but there are circumstances, and i think circumstances has to be taken into account. But ok if i was to save a puppy, i think it would be hard to find the exact breed, quality and age of a puppy that matches my criteria. There are hundreds of 'professional' breeders out there, then why dont you tell them not to breed? if what they are doing is ok then why cant i give my boy to a 'reputable' breeder to breed?


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## ilovemymaltese (Oct 9, 2008)

QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 02:42 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836778


> QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl
[/B][/QUOTE]

LOL this may be a silly question...but why are you asking us? This is a question for your breeder and the dam's breeder. I don't know about the UK but here, if a puppy is sold as a pet, than most of the time that puppy has a fault. Good breeders don't breed faults. So they sell the adorable puppy to a owner and the owner signs a spay/neutar contract. Breeding is a tricking thing and requires immense studying of "what's behind the dog" for both the sire and dam. It's not just putting a boy and girl dog together and puppies magically appear. Those puppies may not live long healthy lives. Breeding is NOT for "pet" owners. Period. FYI- if your baby was breeding quality, it would've stayed with the breeder to be bred and shown or been sold to another breeder. 
Just enjoy your baby as a baby.


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## jude'n'jools (Apr 6, 2006)

QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 06:42 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836778


> QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed, then your reputable breeder does not want that dog to produce offspring. Contact your breeder, ask her advice, she is the best person to help you here


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## princessre (Dec 23, 2008)

Alot of $$ and knowledge and research and work goes into breeding. It's not great to ask another breeder to provide a dame because they don't know your baby's lines and don't know if there is a health reason for not breeding him. Only your breeder would know for sure the reason that he was not bred. 

Even assuming that your baby does not have a fault (say, for some reason, your breeder has too many males and can't keep them all), you would have to convince your breeder to breed a litter for you. And then you'll probably have to buy all of the puppies, unless there is one show-worthy which she will probably want. I'm just guessing that the mating and whelping and everything will cost at least several thousand dollars. And then you would pay another several thousand to buy all the puppies. If the dog has to get an emergency C-section, the cost will go up even more. Do you want to pay $10,000 and up for a couple puppies, maybe even one? 

The genetic pool for Maltese is quite small! If you wanted to have a baby closely related to your dog, just ask your breeder to sell you one that is closely related. Most breeders will mate the males many times and females a few times, so you'll easily get a half brother or sister, or even a full sibling but from another litter. This is why I call every dog from my breeder Casanova's "coz." Actually, many of the dogs on this site are related even if they don't come from the same breeder.


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## camfan (Oct 30, 2006)

QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 02:53 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836779


> QUOTE (theboyz @ Oct 4 2009, 11:54 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836623





> Please don't breed your dog.
> 
> 70,000 puppies are born each DAY. 4 to 6 million animals are euthanized because there are no homes for them.
> 
> ...


If im breeding to keep the babies. then how is that breed for greed? 
If you dont have any kids but you would like one, would you go to a foster or adopt a child rather than have one of your own? if yes then theres clearly some difference between you and me. Yes i may love the adopted child, but clearly i would rather have one of my own.
I understand why you people would be so against breeding, but there are circumstances, and i think circumstances has to be taken into account. But ok if i was to save a puppy, i think it would be hard to find the exact breed, quality and age of a puppy that matches my criteria. There are hundreds of 'professional' breeders out there, then why dont you tell them not to breed? if what they are doing is ok then why cant i give my boy to a 'reputable' breeder to breed?
[/B][/QUOTE]

I just had to say--your comparison to skin kids is slightly off. If I didn't have kids and wanted one, yes, i would have one of my own. HOWEVER, I would not have several more just as back-ups in case something happened to child #1. (this message brought to you by a mom with skin kids  )

A wise man once told me "don't live your life based on 'what-if' scenarios." Why? Because it's futile. We know you love your dog--we love our dogs too. If something were to happen to one of them, there are others out there that need homes. But I can't live my life wondering "What if...." Enjoy every day with your pup and BUY/adopt another one if you want more. No need to replicate the one you already have. 

You asked a question and the folks who have been in and around the business for many, many years are giving you good answers! Best of luck.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

QUOTE (ilovemymaltese @ Oct 4 2009, 11:54 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836780


> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 02:42 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836778





> QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl
[/B][/QUOTE]

LOL this may be a silly question...but why are you asking us? This is a question for your breeder and the dam's breeder. I don't know about the UK but here, if a puppy is sold as a pet, than most of the time that puppy has a fault. Good breeders don't breed faults. So they sell the adorable puppy to a owner and the owner signs a spay/neutar contract. Breeding is a tricking thing and requires immense studying of "what's behind the dog" for both the sire and dam. It's not just putting a boy and girl dog together and puppies magically appear. Those puppies may not live long healthy lives. Breeding is NOT for "pet" owners. Period. FYI- if your baby was breeding quality, it would've stayed with the breeder to be bred and shown or been sold to another breeder. 
Just enjoy your baby as a baby. 
[/B][/QUOTE]

I agree, why are you asking us? Personally, I think your logic is a bit flawed, especially since there is no guarantee your dog would throw 'exactly' what you are looking. The majority of genetics comes from the dam, not the sire. You aren't going to find a good show breeder who will say SURE! I'd love to help you out, since they prefer males that have been shown and proven to sire their puppies. And that leaves the backyard breeders, who often times don't have maltese that entirely fit the standard. But if that is what you'd like to do, well, that's your decision.

I also wanted to correct this phrase '_good breeders don't breed faults_.' That is not entirely true. Every dog has faults, even the top show dogs. Good breeders try to _correct_ those faults in future generations. Bad/backyard breeders breed without regard to faults. Genetics are unavoidable (just look at the coat color post) and any breeder who says 'I don't breed dogs with faults' is most likely delusional, LOL. I have heard it said that is easier to breed out one major fault than multiple small ones, so that is what i try to keep in mind. When you think of all that has to come together to breed an outstanding show dog, it is kind of mind boggling! Structure, coat, temperament, head, pigment, etc etc. 

So to the OP, I would talk to the breeder you got your dog from. Maybe you can get a sibling from another litter that would be closer to your idea of 'perfection' than trying to breed you own. I understand why you are asking what you are, but the reality is - it's just not a good idea.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

You got good advice here. I hope you take it.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 11:53 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836779


> QUOTE (theboyz @ Oct 4 2009, 11:54 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836623





> Please don't breed your dog.
> 
> 70,000 puppies are born each DAY. 4 to 6 million animals are euthanized because there are no homes for them.
> 
> ...


If im breeding to keep the babies. then how is that breed for greed? 
If you dont have any kids but you would like one, would you go to a foster or adopt a child rather than have one of your own? if yes then theres clearly some difference between you and me. Yes i may love the adopted child, but clearly i would rather have one of my own.
I understand why you people would be so against breeding, but there are circumstances, and i think circumstances has to be taken into account. But ok if i was to save a puppy, i think it would be hard to find the exact breed, quality and age of a puppy that matches my criteria. *There are hundreds of 'professional' breeders out there, then why dont you tell them not to breed? if what they are doing is ok then why cant i give my boy to a 'reputable' breeder to breed?*
[/B][/QUOTE]


i also wanted to address this statement. 

Again i'm not sure how things are done in the UK, but here in the US, a 'reputable' breder would most likely not _want_ to use your male. I've had people come up to me at shows or in email and say 'oh I have a male if you need a stud. I don't show or anything but he's really a sweet dog' My answer? No thank you. And what I wouldn't actually say but think in my head is - why would I want to use a pet quality male when I can use quality champion males who throw amazing puppies? Why would I want to take that chance? For me, that would just be breeding to have puppies to sell, not to produce my next show dog. 

Here in the US, i'm pretty sure there isn't any 'service' that hooks up studs and bitches for breeding. Reputable breeders usually have studs, but will only do outside breeding with approved champion bitches and with breeders they can trust to not exploit their lines. You could look at the breeder websites where you are and send them emails explaining your situation etc. Maybe you'll get lucky! But please, don't just jump at the first offer. Check them out first. Especially if you are asking for a puppy back in exchange for stud service. Not so reputable breeders could tell you the puppies died so they don't have to honor that agreement. 

Good luck and please do post some pics of your boy!


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## NIMaltese (May 24, 2009)

Indeed - great advice that you should take.
Your reasoning for breeding your dog is totally off - it's not you giving birth to the puppies, so having "your own kids as opposed to fostering / adopting" makes no sense whatsoever. There are no guarantees you could clone your dog, and seriously - why would you want to? I love my tobi to bits but if I got another dog - I would want him or her to be unique to themselves, not a carbon copy of him.


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Has your dog finished his Ch?

Has your dog passes its health clearances? 

If so, your breeder is the person you should be speaking with. Having bought multiple show quality males, they were all on contract that I could not offer them at public stud without the breeder's approval. You don't want to be violating a verbal or written contract.


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## camfan (Oct 30, 2006)

QUOTE (JMM @ Oct 5 2009, 03:03 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836889


> If so, your breeder is the person you should be speaking with. Having bought multiple show quality males, they were all on contract that I could not offer them at public stud without the breeder's approval. You don't want to be violating a verbal or written contract.[/B]


Come to think of it Ollie's breeder had me sign papers as well saying that I was not allowed to breed Ollie...


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## notori (Mar 21, 2005)

QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 01:42 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836778


> QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl
[/B][/QUOTE]
I would go back to the breeder and buy another from her/him if you like that line so much. I'm sure they will have more pet maltese to sell and it will be the same look that you lke so much.
Char


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## mi_ku_5 (Jun 2, 2008)

This is exactly why breeders should include a clause that includes punitive damages in their puppy contracts. I would be livid if I were a breeder who sold a pup on limited registration and then someone violated my trust by breeding that dog anyway. If I were a breeder, I would include punitive damages and sue for them! Either your breeder sold you this pup w/ the understanding that you wouldn't breed and he/she would be upset if she knew what you were planning, or the breeder isn't reputable and probably isn't producing quality dogs. If you have your heart set on breeding then contact your breeder about a puppy from the same line or about showing your dog! Most dogs make great pets (including those sitting in shelters all over the world) so that not a valid reason for breeding.


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## ilovemymaltese (Oct 9, 2008)

QUOTE (notori @ Oct 5 2009, 04:37 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836921


> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 01:42 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836778





> QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl
[/B][/QUOTE]
I would go back to the breeder and buy another from her/him if you like that line so much. I'm sure they will have more pet maltese to sell and it will be the same look that you lke so much.
Char
[/B][/QUOTE]

:goodpost: *Great idea! You could let your breeder know what temperment you like as well!*


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## Orla (Jul 5, 2009)

why breed him?
I know you said about having a pup related to him or whatever but I don't think thats a good enough reason!

I have a male maltese and at only 5 months old I have already had 2 people ask me could they use him as a stud for their bitch(one wasn't even a maltese!!  ) and they is no way in heck I would ever ever let any random person use him as a stud!


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## lottapaws (Mar 29, 2006)

Just cursious, but why do papers matter if you are only wanting to keep the pups as pets?


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## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

QUOTE (BellarataMaltese @ Oct 5 2009, 04:41 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836832


> QUOTE (ilovemymaltese @ Oct 4 2009, 11:54 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836780





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 5 2009, 02:42 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836778





> QUOTE (jude'n'jools @ Oct 4 2009, 11:04 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836621





> QUOTE (samuel802 @ Oct 4 2009, 01:17 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836545





> QUOTE (Starsmom @ Oct 3 2009, 09:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=836500





> I found you in chat the first night you joined SM. You asked me the same question, and I told you to leave the breeding to the professionals. If you wanted the same bloodline as your fluff, be content with nieces, and nephews and not become a backyard breeder. You are very young (20) and may not have a real grasp of what you could be putting into motion. Any of the breeders here can tell you things can go horribly wrong quickly during whelping even for a seasoned breeder.
> 
> Please be content with the fluff you have, and later purchase another from a _reputable breeder_ there in the UK.[/B]


Im not saying the dog would care, i would care!!! purely because if one day my baby leaves me, then i would have nothing....if he has kids then at least it doesnt feel as devistating. I am not intending or even thinking about breeding so i could make money or the kind of backyard breeding you guys are talking about. I am just wondering if there are any service where i can let a reputable breeder help me breed, i am even willing to only keep the boys if there are any suspicion on me trying to breed to sell. 
I love my baby boy too much thats why im thinking about these things....btw i'll post my baby ( he's called scooby btw lol) pics on here so you guys can see~

p.s endorsement means the dog or bitch is registered but their kids cannot be~
[/B][/QUOTE]

If your dog is endorsed then puppies cannot be registered, no matter who he is mated too.

Can i ask who your dog if from?
[/B][/QUOTE]
My dog is from a reputable breeder in UK and my babys mum is a show girl
[/B][/QUOTE]

LOL this may be a silly question...but why are you asking us? This is a question for your breeder and the dam's breeder. I don't know about the UK but here, if a puppy is sold as a pet, than most of the time that puppy has a fault. Good breeders don't breed faults. So they sell the adorable puppy to a owner and the owner signs a spay/neutar contract. Breeding is a tricking thing and requires immense studying of "what's behind the dog" for both the sire and dam. It's not just putting a boy and girl dog together and puppies magically appear. Those puppies may not live long healthy lives. Breeding is NOT for "pet" owners. Period. FYI- if your baby was breeding quality, it would've stayed with the breeder to be bred and shown or been sold to another breeder. 
Just enjoy your baby as a baby. 
[/B][/QUOTE]

I agree, why are you asking us? Personally, I think your logic is a bit flawed, especially since there is no guarantee your dog would throw 'exactly' what you are looking. The majority of genetics comes from the dam, not the sire. You aren't going to find a good show breeder who will say SURE! I'd love to help you out, since they prefer males that have been shown and proven to sire their puppies. And that leaves the backyard breeders, who often times don't have maltese that entirely fit the standard. But if that is what you'd like to do, well, that's your decision.

I also wanted to correct this phrase '_good breeders don't breed faults_.' That is not entirely true. Every dog has faults, even the top show dogs. Good breeders try to _correct_ those faults in future generations. Bad/backyard breeders breed without regard to faults. Genetics are unavoidable (just look at the coat color post) and any breeder who says 'I don't breed dogs with faults' is most likely delusional, LOL. I have heard it said that is easier to breed out one major fault than multiple small ones, so that is what i try to keep in mind. When you think of all that has to come together to breed an outstanding show dog, it is kind of mind boggling! Structure, coat, temperament, head, pigment, etc etc. 

So to the OP, I would talk to the breeder you got your dog from. Maybe you can get a sibling from another litter that would be closer to your idea of 'perfection' than trying to breed you own. I understand why you are asking what you are, but the reality is - it's just not a good idea.
[/B][/QUOTE]
ok thank you for your advice, this is the kind of advice i would like, instead of the all of a sudden jumping to conclusion ones. Plus i will try again uploading the pics, he just had a haircut today and he looks so tiny hahaha


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## samuel802 (Sep 23, 2009)

Ah i finally managed to upload pics lol


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## myfairlacy (Dec 28, 2007)

I would first recommend talking to the breeder you got your dog from. I'm not familiar with the UK lingo so I don't quite understand if you do or don't have breeding rights to your dog. So speak to the breeder first to see if they are okay with you wanting to breed your dog or not. If you signed a contract to not breed your dog, you really should abide by it.

Second, if your breeder is a show breeder they probably have several dogs within the same line as your dog and you could probably get a half sibling (or even a full sibling) to your dog or a cousin. I'm sure you could get a dog from the same breeder that is very closely related to the dog you have now...that would moreso guarantee that you are going to get one that will look similar and act similar to the dog you have now. If you want another dog like you're dog, you have a much better chance of getting that if you get another puppy out of your dog's parents (even if only a half sibling) than you do by breeding your dog. By breeding your boy with another dog to get offspring, you have to know that the chance of getting puppies that will look or act just like the dog you have now are very slim. They could be dramatically different than the dog you have.

Third, there are so many people breeding their dogs either on purpose or on accident right now that really ought not to be breeding, and unfortunately there are a ton of homeless dogs that are euthanized every year because there are no where near enough homes for them. This includes purebred maltese. I only believe in breeding if you have a dog that is exceptional conformationally, health-wise and temperment-wise. If your dog comes from show lines and your breeder feels he is exceptional and worth breeding to an exceptional female then that is one thing...but if he was placed as a pet, it's probably best to not breed him. Just please don't rush into breeding him...really think about this..listen to the advice being given and please speak to your breeder about this.


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## Lacie's Mom (Oct 11, 2006)

QUOTE (lottapaws @ Oct 6 2009, 06:16 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837320


> Just cursious, but why do papers matter if you are only wanting to keep the pups as pets?[/B]


I agree with everything else that has been posted -- but this was the first thing that I asked myself too.


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## angel's mom (Feb 14, 2007)

QUOTE (Lacie's Mom @ Oct 7 2009, 06:10 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837674


> QUOTE (lottapaws @ Oct 6 2009, 06:16 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837320





> Just cursious, but why do papers matter if you are only wanting to keep the pups as pets?[/B]


I agree with everything else that has been posted -- but this was the first thing that I asked myself too.
[/B][/QUOTE]

I never registered Angel; her registration is written all over my heart. :wub:


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## mi_ku_5 (Jun 2, 2008)

There are plenty of "just pets" sitting in shelters all over the world. "Just pets" is probably the worst reason to breed, IMO.

One of my favorite webpages


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## Orla (Jul 5, 2009)

QUOTE (Lacie's Mom @ Oct 8 2009, 12:10 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837674


> QUOTE (lottapaws @ Oct 6 2009, 06:16 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837320





> Just cursious, but why do papers matter if you are only wanting to keep the pups as pets?[/B]


I agree with everything else that has been posted -- but this was the first thing that I asked myself too.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Just want to say, I don't agree with breeding just for a pet but over here in Ireland and UK - no papers means not pure bred  
If pups aren't reg'd that basically means puppy farmer/back yard breeder!


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## lorraine (Jun 24, 2006)

A few years ago, I spoke to several reputable Maltese breeders/exhibitors here in the UK and not one of them had a spay/neuter contract (either written or verbal) in place for the puppies they sold as of "pet quality". Only a few sold pet puppies with an endorsement for what that may be worth to an owner who is determined to breed just because they can. I'm was rather hoping that had changed by now... ummmmm!  

Pip was neutered voluntarily - although he didn't volunteer himself, you understand


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## setell (Oct 10, 2009)

QUOTE (Amby @ Oct 9 2009, 04:15 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=838145


> QUOTE (Lacie's Mom @ Oct 8 2009, 12:10 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837674





> QUOTE (lottapaws @ Oct 6 2009, 06:16 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837320





> Just cursious, but why do papers matter if you are only wanting to keep the pups as pets?[/B]


I agree with everything else that has been posted -- but this was the first thing that I asked myself too.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Just want to say, I don't agree with breeding just for a pet but over here in Ireland and UK - no papers means not pure bred  
If pups aren't reg'd that basically means puppy farmer/back yard breeder!
[/B][/QUOTE]
um...does it matter?

I bought my puppy from a non-registered breeder off kijiji (like craig's list) and he's a sweety. I love his tempermant and to me that is what's important. Also I couldn't afford the $3000 CAD the registered reputable breeders were asking for either. Honestly, in Canada if the registered breeders would lower their price I wouldn't buy a non-registered dog. I found the best non-registered breeder I could though as she feeds him the expensive prescription formula food, fully vaccinated, de-wormed, puppy starter kit, he had already gone to the groomers and geninuely loves her dogs. I am wondering why she isn't registering herself as the way she raises her dogs shows how much passion and love she has for it. She is new though so maybe that is why she isn't registered yet. 

I know some of you guys will say "if you can't afford to pay for the dog then don't get one" but I want a dog and it is selfish of me to do so. I technically can afford to pay the $3000 for the dog but it's awefully expensive if you ask me BUT I couldn't justify what is more special about the registered one vs my current dog. I will save the difference in the bank and put it towards future vet bills in the event my baby does get sick etc. It's a risk I am willing to take now that I know what type of personality he has.


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## almitra (Apr 24, 2009)

Many of the dggies here are from similar circumstances, though not all, so you are not aone in that arena. Just read some of the stories about how some have acquired their little angels on this and other maltese forums. Each case is an individual one, so don't let anyone here beat you up for it, (figuratively speaking ). I am certain there are magnificently healthy dogs that are perfect pets with lovable dispositions regardless of their origins, though I imagine the main issue people take is with patronizing breeders that aren't universally recognized as such. In some cases, wich may certainly be yours, the breeder may indeed become one of these in ime. Whether she does or whether she doesn't, I am delighted that you are delighted with your precious family addition. And anyone who gets bent outta shape over it can get glad in the same pants they get mad in. 

Welcome to the forum and hope to see you here often. :Welcome 1:


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## Cosy (Feb 9, 2006)

QUOTE (setell @ Oct 19 2009, 09:38 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=841492


> QUOTE (Amby @ Oct 9 2009, 04:15 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=838145





> QUOTE (Lacie's Mom @ Oct 8 2009, 12:10 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837674





> QUOTE (lottapaws @ Oct 6 2009, 06:16 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=837320





> Just cursious, but why do papers matter if you are only wanting to keep the pups as pets?[/B]


I agree with everything else that has been posted -- but this was the first thing that I asked myself too.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Just want to say, I don't agree with breeding just for a pet but over here in Ireland and UK - no papers means not pure bred  
If pups aren't reg'd that basically means puppy farmer/back yard breeder!
[/B][/QUOTE]
um...does it matter?

I bought my puppy from a non-registered breeder off kijiji (like craig's list) and he's a sweety. I love his tempermant and to me that is what's important. Also I couldn't afford the $3000 CAD the registered reputable breeders were asking for either. Honestly, in Canada if the registered breeders would lower their price I wouldn't buy a non-registered dog. I found the best non-registered breeder I could though as she feeds him the expensive prescription formula food, fully vaccinated, de-wormed, puppy starter kit, he had already gone to the groomers and geninuely loves her dogs. I am wondering why she isn't registering herself as the way she raises her dogs shows how much passion and love she has for it. She is new though so maybe that is why she isn't registered yet. 

I know some of you guys will say "if you can't afford to pay for the dog then don't get one" but I want a dog and it is selfish of me to do so. I technically can afford to pay the $3000 for the dog but it's awefully expensive if you ask me BUT I couldn't justify what is more special about the registered one vs my current dog. I will save the difference in the bank and put it towards future vet bills in the event my baby does get sick etc. It's a risk I am willing to take now that I know what type of personality he has.
[/B][/QUOTE]

I'm glad you are putting that money away in case, however, did you know that when buying a byb or mill dog you perpetuate the misery for the dogs that were bred to create your dog? This is the main reason for NOT buying from disreputable breeders. The suffering. Now that you know, I hope you won't do it again. Just trying to educate for the betterment of the breed.


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