# Allergic Reaction



## BABYSNOWY (Jul 8, 2008)

My husband took Snowy and Icy to the vet today for their booster shots, and when he was about to leave he noticed Snowy's eye swelling up. The vet said she got an allergic reaction to the shot so had to stay a few hours. It made me so sad to leave her but im leaving work early to go pick her up.


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Poor dear! I'm glad the vet noticed right away. You may want to ask to have a note put on her file to give her benadryl before any future vaccines as a precaution.


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## momtoboo (Jan 30, 2006)

Poor baby.Hope the times flies for you both.


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## BABYSNOWY (Jul 8, 2008)

I just picked her up and she is not looking to good...she is dragging, itchy and is starting to sweel up again so I gave her some benadryl.....im so sad to see her like this


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## allheart (Oct 3, 2008)

Awww sweetie I am so sorry to hear this . 

What did the vet say, if she swelled up again? 

Aww, I know she will be okay...but can just imagine how you feel.


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## BABYSNOWY (Jul 8, 2008)

Thank you.

I have a question.....Snowy has her rabies shot in june of this yr, I think the dr didnt read her records and gave her another one today
Can this be a problem?


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## allheart (Oct 3, 2008)

Oh Gosh, I don't know. I think, now I am not 100% sure, but I think, the rabbies shot is good for 3 years?? 
What I would do, is call the vet, especially, is sweet baby girl is still having a reaction...and double check with them.

In my prayers and thoughts :wub: 

How is she now?


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## Dixie's Mama (Mar 19, 2008)

I hope little Snowy is ok now. I'll keep her and you in my prayers. Good thing your husband noticed her eye.


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## BABYSNOWY (Jul 8, 2008)

Thank you very much guys. :crying: 

I did call the vet when I read the papers and she was taken aback when I told her she had her rabies shot and then she sais she should be ok....she is very lethargic...I gave her benadryl and im waiting 30 mins to see how it works if not im taking her to the ER


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

QUOTE (BABYSNOWY @ Dec 4 2008, 06:41 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=682937


> I just picked her up and she is not looking to good...she is dragging, itchy and is starting to sweel up again so I gave her some benadryl.....im so sad to see her like this[/B]



I'm not sure about the doubling up on the shot but she should not give rabies with the boosters anyway. Next time wait 3 weeks between them.

My first Malt, Rosebud, was highly allergic to her shots. She had to have IV benedryl and cortisone. My vet said she was the worst case he's ever seen. 

I don't give the shots to K & C. After their one-year booster, I've had them titered each year and as long as their immunity is OK, I'm not doing the shots. We have to have rabies every three years by law and they won't accept titers, unfortunately.

I sure hope your little one feels better. The benedryl will make her drowsy. The swelling... that would worry me. If it were me, I'd take her back in.


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## jen_hedz (Mar 5, 2008)

My angelo had a bad allergic reaction once and I picked him up a few hours later, once we got home the swelling around his eyes was gone but he was still scratching like crazy so I gave him more benadryl after calling the vet and it made him really drowsy, he pretty much slept for the rest of the evening. If her eyes are still swollen after the benadryl I would call the vet, it's always better to be safe. I hope she's feeling better soon, it is a very scary experience :grouphug:


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

whoa i would go to another vet as that is not a good sign at all - they should be paying more attention to that as that is very important -- poor thing i would be furious as that is a 3 year vaccine and dd is exempt from it due to health issues allergies being the biggest and she has been titered and that vaccine is good now with titer for almost 4 years so dr dodds is trying to prove it is good for 5 years then 7 years - and the same vaccination is given to a small dog as a 90lb dog for that vaccine --- i am so upset right now for your baby  



QUOTE (BABYSNOWY @ Dec 4 2008, 10:07 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683017


> Thank you very much guys. :crying:
> 
> I did call the vet when I read the papers and she was taken aback when I told her she had her rabies shot and then she sais she should be ok....she is very lethargic...I gave her benadryl and im waiting 30 mins to see how it works if not im taking her to the ER[/B]


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

hopefully the benedryl will work because if you take her to emergency they will probably give her dexamothesone shot (steroid) shot to reduce the swelling and that with the rabies double up will do a double whammy on her immune system  I would recommend asking for temaril p as opposed to dexamothesone shot because it has antihistamine and prednisolone and the pill forms of steroids are not as strong and out of the system in about 48 hrs where as the shots last up to 30 days so in a small dog i would go for the lower dose as it will knock it out as when dd got canine hives the temaril p knocked it out - so sorry you are going through this - the more i think of this the more mad i get as to how they did not check her shot records before giving the shots and k/c is right the rabies should never be given at the same time it should be 3 weeks after as that is too much on their little systems 



QUOTE (BABYSNOWY @ Dec 4 2008, 10:07 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683017


> Thank you very much guys. :crying:
> 
> I did call the vet when I read the papers and she was taken aback when I told her she had her rabies shot and then she sais she should be ok....she is very lethargic...I gave her benadryl and im waiting 30 mins to see how it works if not im taking her to the ER[/B]


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Dexamethasone does not stay in the system for 30 days...if used regularly it is given every 3-4 days. An injection of dexamethasone is appropriate for a vaccine reaction. Oral Temaril-P is a medication to be used long-term for inhalent allergies.


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

the dexamothesone shot does not stay take 30 days to clear the system? hmmm that is what i have read that the shots are much more potent than the oral meds and best to give oral meds to small dogs as they clear the system sooner than shots and i read a ton on allergies as i have an allergy dog who has been on temaril p along with atopica and who has had a dexamothesone shot for allergies and have read the shots last much longer in a small dog 


QUOTE (JMM @ Dec 4 2008, 10:51 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683082


> Dexamethasone does not stay in the system for 30 days...if used regularly it is given every 3-4 days. An injection of dexamethasone is appropriate for a vaccine reaction. Oral Temaril-P is a medication to be used long-term for inhalent allergies.[/B]


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

http://www.allivet.com/Dexamethasone-Rx-p/10193.htm

here is info on dexamethasone stating it is 20 times more potent so it is much stronger than prednisolone so in a small dog i would not use unless necessary as i was not happy they gave it to dd after finding this out


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

also temaril p is an antihistamine like benedryl along with prednisolone and can be used for a short term allergic reaction like this as it worked for canine hives in dee dee. Many times benedryl does not work for dogs so going to a stronger thing like temaril p is faster acting. Prednisolone is safer than prednisone and why i opt for temaril p over dexamothesone pills and especially injections as the prednisolone is broken down more than prednisone so the liver does not have to work as hard to break it down like with prednisone. DD is mvd and has severe atopic dermatitis so i have to monitor her blood work every 6 months but dr jean dodds felt it was safest to put her on prednisolone vs prednisone and the added antihistamine helps. I read the book allergy solution for dogs by dr shawn messonier which is where i read that it is better to give a small dog a pill form of steroid than a shot as shots las much longer in the system than a pill does. This is why many big dogs who have allergies go in for one shot a month of steroids as it lasts that long and then their symptoms start to come back so imagine if it lasts that long in a big golden retriever how long it can last in a little maltese. DD was given this shot when she had a bad reaction to beef and her eye swelled shut and she had canine hives and the temaril p worked jus as well with the hives as the dex shot when she had the allergic reaction to the beef so this is why i recommended to go with the lower dose as it will probably work with less drugs in the system


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

I hope Snowy is doing better and that the swelling is going down. I would definitely be looking for another vet. 
The vet i use said that she feels comfortable enough for the kids to go 3 years without a vaccine except for Rabies (because of being required by law) and titering yearly after the 3 years is up from the time they had their last adult vaccine.


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## Maidto2Maltese (Oct 19, 2004)

QUOTE (BABYSNOWY @ Dec 4 2008, 01:50 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=682757


> My husband took Snowy and Icy to the vet today for their booster shots, and when he was about to leave he noticed Snowy's eye swelling up. The vet said she got an allergic reaction to the shot so had to stay a few hours. It made me so sad to leave her but im leaving work early to go pick her up.[/B]



Praying Baby Snowy is doing ok! Please update us and let us know how she is!


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

You are talking about treating atopy, NOT AN ACUTE ALLERGIC REACTION. If a dog has an acute allergic reaction, steroids are part of the treatment and you do not want to wait a few days to see relief by using oral medication. A single injection of dexamethasone is not going to cause long-term side effects. Please do not equate treatment for inhalent allergies to an allergic reaction to a vaccine. 

The half life of dexamethasone in a dog is 36-54 hours as far as I can find in any of my books...



QUOTE (dwerten @ Dec 4 2008, 11:29 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683142


> also temaril p is an antihistamine like benedryl along with prednisolone and can be used for a short term allergic reaction like this as it worked for canine hives in dee dee. Many times benedryl does not work for dogs so going to a stronger thing like temaril p is faster acting. Prednisolone is safer than prednisone and why i opt for temaril p over dexamothesone pills and especially injections as the prednisolone is broken down more than prednisone so the liver does not have to work as hard to break it down like with prednisone. DD is mvd and has severe atopic dermatitis so i have to monitor her blood work every 6 months but dr jean dodds felt it was safest to put her on prednisolone vs prednisone and the added antihistamine helps. I read the book allergy solution for dogs by dr shawn messonier which is where i read that it is better to give a small dog a pill form of steroid than a shot as shots las much longer in the system than a pill does. This is why many big dogs who have allergies go in for one shot a month of steroids as it lasts that long and then their symptoms start to come back so imagine if it lasts that long in a big golden retriever how long it can last in a little maltese. DD was given this shot when she had a bad reaction to beef and her eye swelled shut and she had canine hives and the temaril p worked jus as well with the hives as the dex shot when she had the allergic reaction to the beef so this is why i recommended to go with the lower dose as it will probably work with less drugs in the system[/B]


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## BABYSNOWY (Jul 8, 2008)

Thank you everybody for all your prayers...

Snowy woke up much better but still a little groggy.....the swelling did go down after the benadryl.....it was so scary not knowing how to help her feel better, but at least the benadryl helped her...I will be calling the vet today and finding out exactly what happened.....will keep you guys updated


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

so why do the do only benedryl before giving shots when a dog has a previous reaction to subside the reaction. Canine hives is an immediate allergic reaction as well just like a shot and the temaril p worked immediately and hives went down asap from a small dose of temaril p - same thing an allergic reaction and swelling and dee dee had hives and i saw it work without taking her in for a dexamothesone shot so I am not confusing atopy with an allergic reaction and it does not take a few days for temaril p to work it works immediately i saw it in my dog and it is a lower dose of meds that work 



QUOTE (JMM @ Dec 5 2008, 08:56 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683285


> You are talking about treating atopy, NOT AN ACUTE ALLERGIC REACTION. If a dog has an acute allergic reaction, steroids are part of the treatment and you do not want to wait a few days to see relief by using oral medication. A single injection of dexamethasone is not going to cause long-term side effects. Please do not equate treatment for inhalent allergies to an allergic reaction to a vaccine.
> 
> The half life of dexamethasone in a dog is 36-54 hours as far as I can find in any of my books...
> 
> ...





> also temaril p is an antihistamine like benedryl along with prednisolone and can be used for a short term allergic reaction like this as it worked for canine hives in dee dee. Many times benedryl does not work for dogs so going to a stronger thing like temaril p is faster acting. Prednisolone is safer than prednisone and why i opt for temaril p over dexamothesone pills and especially injections as the prednisolone is broken down more than prednisone so the liver does not have to work as hard to break it down like with prednisone. DD is mvd and has severe atopic dermatitis so i have to monitor her blood work every 6 months but dr jean dodds felt it was safest to put her on prednisolone vs prednisone and the added antihistamine helps. I read the book allergy solution for dogs by dr shawn messonier which is where i read that it is better to give a small dog a pill form of steroid than a shot as shots las much longer in the system than a pill does. This is why many big dogs who have allergies go in for one shot a month of steroids as it lasts that long and then their symptoms start to come back so imagine if it lasts that long in a big golden retriever how long it can last in a little maltese. DD was given this shot when she had a bad reaction to beef and her eye swelled shut and she had canine hives and the temaril p worked jus as well with the hives as the dex shot when she had the allergic reaction to the beef so this is why i recommended to go with the lower dose as it will probably work with less drugs in the system[/B]


[/B][/QUOTE]


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

Great news so glad the benedryl worked 


QUOTE (BABYSNOWY @ Dec 5 2008, 09:00 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683289


> Thank you everybody for all your prayers...
> 
> Snowy woke up much better but still a little groggy.....the swelling did go down after the benadryl.....it was so scary not knowing how to help her feel better, but at least the benadryl helped her...I will be calling the vet today and finding out exactly what happened.....will keep you guys updated[/B]


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## BABYSNOWY (Jul 8, 2008)

When they called me yesterday to tell me she had a reaction I was surprised because she has never has a reaction...but when I get home and see the little heart shaped rabies ID on my table my mouth dropped and I immediately called the vet...the reason she reacted is basically getting a shot to immune something she is immuned to already....all I know is that I told my husband is the last time he taked them to the vet (he thought it was a great idea)...I always ask everything they are doing and he doesnt....as soon as she wouldve said rabies shot i wouldve stopped her but thank God she is ok cause I would be devastated if something happened to my baby

P.S I did feel bad after because I can see my husband wanted to cry when he got home and saw they way she was and every hour on the hour was waking up to check on her, this morning apologized profusely to her lol


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

yeah i would not go back to that vet as that was very careless and especially since rabies can trigger reactions in dogs -- we work with dr jean dodds who is doing the rabies challenge and have read alot on that so I am so upset your vet did this and in such a small dog on top of it - just not acceptable in my book. This is why i do not let dh do anything with mine as he does not think to ask the questions and not as up on things as i am with their health and diet. My dh would have done the same thing I am afraid so don't feel bad.


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

here is some information on the rabies challenge


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

It depends on the vet and the dog's case. For more severe reactions, most vets will pretreat with steroids and benadryl or avoid giving the vaccination. 
When you give an oral medication, it has to be processed by the digestive tract and then "do the magic" on the body. An injection is very quick acting. In addition, many dogs who have more severe vaccine reactions also vomit. So giving oral medication would not be a good plan. 
Oral medications are great, especially for long term use. My only complaint is please to not advise people to refuse appropriate treatments. The standard treatment for a vaccine reaction is an injection of benadryl +/- an injection of steroids. For very severe reactions, further hospitalization and care will be recommended by the veterinarian. 


QUOTE (dwerten @ Dec 5 2008, 10:35 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683363


> so why do the do only benedryl before giving shots when a dog has a previous reaction to subside the reaction. Canine hives is an immediate allergic reaction as well just like a shot and the temaril p worked immediately and hives went down asap from a small dose of temaril p - same thing an allergic reaction and swelling and dee dee had hives and i saw it work without taking her in for a dexamothesone shot so I am not confusing atopy with an allergic reaction and it does not take a few days for temaril p to work it works immediately i saw it in my dog and it is a lower dose of meds that work[/B]


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

QUOTE (JMM @ Dec 5 2008, 01:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683424


> It depends on the vet and the dog's case. For more severe reactions, most vets will pretreat with steroids and benadryl or avoid giving the vaccination.
> When you give an oral medication, it has to be processed by the digestive tract and then "do the magic" on the body. An injection is very quick acting. In addition, many dogs who have more severe vaccine reactions also vomit. So giving oral medication would not be a good plan.
> Oral medications are great, especially for long term use. My only complaint is please to not advise people to refuse appropriate treatments. The standard treatment for a vaccine reaction is an injection of benadryl +/- an injection of steroids. For very severe reactions, further hospitalization and care will be recommended by the veterinarian.
> 
> QUOTE (dwerten @ Dec 5 2008, 10:35 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683363





> so why do the do only benedryl before giving shots when a dog has a previous reaction to subside the reaction. Canine hives is an immediate allergic reaction as well just like a shot and the temaril p worked immediately and hives went down asap from a small dose of temaril p - same thing an allergic reaction and swelling and dee dee had hives and i saw it work without taking her in for a dexamothesone shot so I am not confusing atopy with an allergic reaction and it does not take a few days for temaril p to work it works immediately i saw it in my dog and it is a lower dose of meds that work[/B]


[/B][/QUOTE]

As mentioned, my first Malt Rosebud had acute reactions to vaccines and she was given both benedryl and steriods before her vaccines. I believe they were IV. When she had her first reaction she had welts on her head and was acting really hyper. At that time (not the vet I use now) he gave her a shot of epinephrene and monitored her heart rate for about an hour afterward. 

Snowy's mom the allergic reaction doesn't show up with the first shot. It is later that they develop an allergy to the shot.


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

I am aware that oral medication should not be given in a dog that is vomitting as my dexter almost died of pancreatitis so no oral meds were given in this instance due to vomitting but this dog was just having hive like reaction not vomitting so why go with the strongest medication why not start with an oral steroid and it only takes at most an hour for medication to get in the system and why many meds have to be given an hour before food or 3 hrs after food because the oral medication is absorbed into the system within one hour. I think based on the situation it was a hive like reaction and she did not need to go for the stronger steroid is all I was saying and too many times the strongest dose is given when not necessary to small dogs. Just like a rabies vaccine is given for up to a 90lb dog on a 4lb dog. Why is that the case? I tend to go the safest route with mine because i have seen how horrible pancreatitis can be and steroids can trigger pancreatitis so if her dog is not having a severe reaction which she was not vomitting but had hives is why i suggested this route but luckily the benedryl worked which also confirmed her reaction was not as severe as some can have. 

am I not correct in the fact that oral meds do not last as long in the system as a steroid shot and that the shots are not a much stronger dose of steroid than the oral medication? I agree if it is really severe then you go the most severe route but when not severe shouldn't you take a less approach as to not trigger another problem like pancreatitis?


QUOTE (JMM @ Dec 5 2008, 02:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=683424


> It depends on the vet and the dog's case. For more severe reactions, most vets will pretreat with steroids and benadryl or avoid giving the vaccination.
> When you give an oral medication, it has to be processed by the digestive tract and then "do the magic" on the body. An injection is very quick acting. In addition, many dogs who have more severe vaccine reactions also vomit. So giving oral medication would not be a good plan.
> Oral medications are great, especially for long term use. My only complaint is please to not advise people to refuse appropriate treatments. The standard treatment for a vaccine reaction is an injection of benadryl +/- an injection of steroids. For very severe reactions, further hospitalization and care will be recommended by the veterinarian.
> 
> ...





> so why do the do only benedryl before giving shots when a dog has a previous reaction to subside the reaction. Canine hives is an immediate allergic reaction as well just like a shot and the temaril p worked immediately and hives went down asap from a small dose of temaril p - same thing an allergic reaction and swelling and dee dee had hives and i saw it work without taking her in for a dexamothesone shot so I am not confusing atopy with an allergic reaction and it does not take a few days for temaril p to work it works immediately i saw it in my dog and it is a lower dose of meds that work[/B]


[/B][/QUOTE]


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

http://www.b-naturals.com/newsletter/pancreatitis/

information showing that steroids can trigger pancreatitis


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

I would not compare oral vs. injectible in length of time it stays in the system or strength. Some oral medications are made to be long-lasting, many injectibles are only good for a short time. There are many types of steroids both in oral and in injectible form. Some last longer than others. The strength or concentration of a medication does not mean the dose you give is massively more. Injectible benadryl is usually 50 mg/ml. That doesn't mean you still give the equivalent amount you would of oral liquid benadryl. Most often when we are using an injectible steroid for something like a reaction, you do want a good-sized dose that will take effect VERY quickly. If given IV you can sit there with the dog for 30 minutes and see the symptoms resolve almost completely. 

ALL medications have risks and benefits. I would suggest each person discuss the risks and benefits with their vet based on their individual dog. While you may not want your dog with chronic pancreatitis to have steroids, that does not mean every other dog who gets an injection will have pancreatitis because of it. I know we are all very passionate about the issues out dogs have, but there is a point at which it can sound alarmist. When it comes to whether or not a dog needs a medication, do your research and than talk to your vet about your individual dog. I am certainly glad Snowy's reaction was not severe, but we also do not want to alarm people to refuse proper treatment if that was the case with their dog. 

Steroids have received a bad reputation with many owners because of the side effects. That does not mean they are a bad drug when used properly. Sometimes they do need to be used long term and can be life-saving...again, the risks and benefits for the individual situation should be discussed and an educated decision made with the guidance of your vet. I have a dog who takes steroids ALL OF THE TIME. I would NEVER discontinue them. The dog has Addison's disease and would be very ill without the medication. 

You have some great information...but please be careful how you apply it with others.


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## Harley & Dakotas Mum (Jun 11, 2005)

Thank you Jackie (JMM), for sharing your knowledge here, it is invaluable, and I for one certainly appreciate all that you offer us here at SM! :aktion033: :smilie_daumenpos:


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## dwerten (Oct 6, 2007)

I understand what you are saying and am aware of addisons as I am on an auto immune group and a sebaceous addentitis addison group as addisons is an auto immune disease just as hypothyroidism so i am aware they have to take steroids for life but also aware that dogs with addisons do not have adrenal function so steroids do not affect them as they would a normal dog with normal adrenal function. My dee dee is on temaril p as atopica did not work after a year and fully aware of steroids and she is a yorkie and without them she would be a very miserable dog. I am not trying to deter treatment but to let people know there are other options to discuss with vet and in this case the reaction was not severe enough as the vet did prescribe benedryl only. 

Just curious as it sounds like you are a vet or a vet tech is that the case? 

I checked on petvetcafe which is a group of vets and the vet stated they use the dex shot as it gives a big dose to stop a very bad reaction and then use pred or temaril p for continued dose afterwards 

I just have to say when dee dee had a horrible reaction to beef and her eye did swell and she did have a dex shot I remember calling the vet 2 hrs later saying why is she still itching like crazy after that shot and she said it does take time to kick in so it was not an immediate fix even with that shot for dee dee. 

I have just learned sadly and the hard way you have to educate yourself and ask questions as on yorkietalk over thanksgiving weekend a yorkie almost died of kidney failure due to a vet not doing xray or bloodwork on her yorkie and it was clearly pancreatitis and due to us telling her to get her 3lb yorkie back to vet and go to a different vet her yorkie lived and probably would not have as her bun and creatinine levels were extremely high when we sent her back to vet as her dog kept vomitting after vet gave flagyl to go home with without doing the two most important tests in a vomitting dog xrays and bloodwork. Also the dog being so small was extremely dehydrated and due to those kidney values almost did not make it. I understand people make mistakes but these were basics just like on this one how do you vaccinate a dog twice in 6 mos with rabies vaccination - just unbelievable. 




QUOTE (JMM @ Dec 6 2008, 02:14 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=684170


> I would not compare oral vs. injectible in length of time it stays in the system or strength. Some oral medications are made to be long-lasting, many injectibles are only good for a short time. There are many types of steroids both in oral and in injectible form. Some last longer than others. The strength or concentration of a medication does not mean the dose you give is massively more. Injectible benadryl is usually 50 mg/ml. That doesn't mean you still give the equivalent amount you would of oral liquid benadryl. Most often when we are using an injectible steroid for something like a reaction, you do want a good-sized dose that will take effect VERY quickly. If given IV you can sit there with the dog for 30 minutes and see the symptoms resolve almost completely.
> 
> ALL medications have risks and benefits. I would suggest each person discuss the risks and benefits with their vet based on their individual dog. While you may not want your dog with chronic pancreatitis to have steroids, that does not mean every other dog who gets an injection will have pancreatitis because of it. I know we are all very passionate about the issues out dogs have, but there is a point at which it can sound alarmist. When it comes to whether or not a dog needs a medication, do your research and than talk to your vet about your individual dog. I am certainly glad Snowy's reaction was not severe, but we also do not want to alarm people to refuse proper treatment if that was the case with their dog.
> 
> ...


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