# From the Breeder's Viewpoint



## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

As some of you know, I try to give things from the breeder's standpoint from time to time to let you see the other side of the story. 
Anytime I get an inquiry for a pup, I always send an email back stating that I find it best to talk by phone. I feel that those who are serious will have no problem with this, and we can start the process, which may go on for months before the pup is ready. I received responses today from two of those emails I replied to earlier in the week. Just thought I would let you see the replies.


Hi, my daughter has been looking for a puppy, and I wanted to get her one for her birthday.I think that a reasonal price to get the puppy for if I get her would be about $100 to $200 if I drove up there to get her.Please give me somemore information about the puppy as soon as possible.



And another....

I can't talk to you by phone because I have no time to talk ... but you can tell me the price of the female by phone it will just be great!! thank you 

jessy


I guess it's a good thing I don't have any females for sale and none expected in the near future. I will say that the price is a little lower than usual. Some think $300 for a female is a fair price (even though I have thousands in their parents). One even got mad at me recently and told me they would buy from an internet ad for $300, including shipping (I guess they didn't know about the scams there) because those folks were nicer than I was because I wouldn't take $300 for my pups.


Not everyone is as nice as SM members....


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## Bonnie's Mommie (Mar 2, 2006)

It's really sad to hear how cavalier people can be when deciding to add to their family. A puppy should be given thought and consideration - if someone is too busy to talk on the phone, who's to say he/she wouldn't be too busy to give love and attention to a puppy???


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> It's really sad to hear how cavalier people can be when deciding to add to their family. A puppy should be given thought and consideration - if someone is too busy to talk on the phone, who's to say he/she wouldn't be too busy to give love and attention to a puppy???
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My response back to that person was "good luck in finding the perfect pet". 

A couple weeks ago, I got a response from someone saying they couldn't give me their phone number to call because of security/trust. I told them that if they couldn't trust me with a phone number, then I didn't have a pup for them. Placing a pup should be a matter of trust on both sides. It's the same as with people who insist they have to come "investigate" the way I raise my dogs. I don't have a problem with that, but it needs to be my decision to invite them into my home. As a breeder, I think it may be just as important to do home visits of the prospective buyer because the dog will be in their home for years.

I find that many people are just price shopping. If that is their primary reason for choosing a certain pup, then I don't have one for them either. I also have a problem with people who try to talk one down on price.
What they don't know is that I have reduced the price by as much as $500 because I like the way the first interview goes. For instance, I recently placed a little male pup with an elementary school principal who will use him as a therapy dog. She got a real bargain and didn't even know I reduced the original price just for her/and the children she would help.


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## thinkpink (Sep 25, 2004)

If I were looking for a new puppy I would bend myself over backwards and they can't take the time for a phone call?







I think some people are so oblivious to the time and attention that a new puppy needs. Maybe they need something with a little less maintenance.....like a plant. Sorry ya'll, I'm gonna tuck my head now and apologize for being so mean.


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## kwaugh (May 8, 2006)

You think a large part of these responses are due to lack of education on the part of the PPO? Or are these people seriously just trying to take the cheap route even though they know how much a good quality maltese really costs? Although that last response you posted about sounds more like someone trying to get a maltese girl to breed and have no intentions of honoring your spay/neuter contract. 

Karyn


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## wagirl98665 (Jan 5, 2006)

> As some of you know, I try to give things from the breeder's standpoint from time to time to let you see the other side of the story.
> Anytime I get an inquiry for a pup, I always send an email back stating that I find it best to talk by phone. I feel that those who are serious will have no problem with this, and we can start the process, which may go on for months before the pup is ready. I received responses today from two of those emails I replied to earlier in the week. Just thought I would let you see the replies.
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The price these people expect to get a puppy for doesn't even cover the vet costs for 1st shots, dew claws, checkups etc. It's almost laugh-able!


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## kodie (Aug 24, 2004)

man... it must be annoying being a breeder at times... the people that must CALL you.. man...







When I was picking up Kelsie... I was at my breeders house for quite awhile.. and she got phone calls from people looking for available puppies... SO annoying! Mean while...she has 10 puppies running around and need to be tended to...







Sorry... I know i must have been annoying when I was calling around for a puppy... but thats why I was scared to call people... if that makes any sense.


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

Faye, thank you so very much for sharing with us your experiences as a breeder.

Yikes... there are some crazy people out there. It concerns me because these people don't know very much about Malts, apparently, and what will happen when a BYB or pet store sells to them What about the little puppy? Will the owners get frustrated and abuse him/her because they (owners) don't know how to potty train. Will they know about hypoglycemia. Will they know not to take the puppy away from its mother until at least 12 weeks. I worry about the little Malt babies.....


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## aea6574 (Feb 18, 2006)

Wow, thanks for the insight.

I find it funny the way folks are sometimes. I know I am not perfect. But I was more then happy to communicate with the breeder I got the hounds from anyway she liked. We emailed, we talked on the phone, we chatted in person at her residence. I also brought my entire family afterwards so the breeder could know more about our whole family.

On the pricing issue, well, I know that the little white hounds are expensive so I expected that. But when we decided to go from just one to adding Bacchus as well, I did ask if we got a quanity discount.







She was kind enough to give us a break as we were buying two. I think this was fair for both of us as I saved a bit and she had one less puppy to worry about finding a perfect home for.

But to be honest I thought it was great that she wanted to communicate with me as much as I wanted to communicate with her.

I know it might sound odd, well probably not to this group, but the maltese is really a special type of animal and should be a well thought out decision on everyone's part so that they are given the love and care they deserve.


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> I know it might sound odd, well probably not to this group, but the maltese is really a special type of animal and should be a well thought out decision on everyone's part so that they are given the love and care they deserve.[/B]


Not odd at all. You are soooo right!! Yes, yes, yes!!!


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

Those of you who know me know that these little ones are my babies. I don't hire kennel help or nannies, and I don't shut my dogs in cages. They are a part of my family. I sleep with them, eat with them, and talk to them as I would a person. When someone gets one of my babies, they had best be prepared to convince me they can provide a loving home for them. It's not about the money. If people don't have time to talk with me and get to know me and my dogs and let me get to know them and their family, then they need to go elsewhere. 
I think any good breeder would want to talk a good bit with a prospective owner prior to selling them a pup. No one should be afraid to call a breeder. Because my schedule is hectic since I support my dog habit with a job, I am not always available to take phone calls. I prefer to call prospective buyers, but I do ask them to tell me a convenient time. 
Now about those pictures. Those are one of the things I treasure the most. I got the cutest one Monday of the little dog who is going to school with his principal owner. Prior to his coming into her life, she worked with a Golden Retriever. One of the pictures she sent me was the Golden Retriever and her new pup, both on their back, side by side. I get excited everytime I get pictures or reports on them.


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

Hi,

I am looking right now for a little girl, but I am going to take my time ,I am not going to rush into anything.

I know now what to look for and what not to. I know who are puppy-millers and who are not.

For me it will probably be a long process , cause I am picky and I know exactly what I want





Thanks, Andrea~


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> Hi,
> 
> I am looking right now for a little girl, but I am going to take my time ,I am not going to rush into anything.
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I think your way of going about it is great. I'm sure any breeder would look at it that way also. 

Just remember that some very nice females come available a little later because they may turn out to be too small for show, or they may not be what the breeder is looking for in other ways. I know of one beautiful little girl who was offered for sale because she just didn't have a real outgoing personality to compete in the ring.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

Oi, how annoying for you. That should be the telling factor right there, right from the start. If the attitude is that THEY (the potential buyer) are doing YOU a favor by inquiring about your puppies.

I personally feel like I'm the one who had the favor done for them, by having this amazing puppy placed with me. I almost did the whole internet sale thing too because I didn't want to spend as much as I did on Lucy (I was ignorant) But you know what I found?

I got what I paid for.

And that is what those buyers will find by purchasing $200 puppies! With each passing day, my respect for reputable breeders grows. You make me want to be just like you!


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## charmypoo (Sep 11, 2004)

When I was trying to place the little boy, I put up a classifieds ad for him on a local site. I got a taste of what the breeder's experience first hand!

I got sooo many emails asking for a free dog or some story which they feel merits them a free dog. Offers for $50, $100, $200. People lying and changing their stories from emails to emails.

I wrote up a generic email that I replied to everyone with. If they said price was too high or one thing or another ... I said .. good luck with your search but feel free to email me if you want to chat about the breed.

I should add - Selling puppies is no fun. I am glad I don't have to do it.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

Well, here is the follow up from the email I received yesterday concerning the fair price being $100 to $200. Actually, my first response to them was that I thought it was a joke. It wasn't ugly, I just said, you must be joking, my female pups start at $1500. Well I ruffled some feathers with that one because this is what I got back:

Thank you for being so kind to respond. I am not aware of the e-mail that you received, but it must have been from my 11 year old daughter. We have promised her a puppy and do not know much about the cost of some breeds. We do however have feelings and if she had opened your e-mail I'm sure that she would have been very upset. Whatever the question she was not joking, as you so kindly put it. You know the world needs more people like you. What kind of a world do we live in when people actually sell dogs for astronomical prices when people are starving every day in our own backyards?

Again thank you but I do not think that we will be doing business with you.

I will say that the email I sent him back wasn't as nice. I guess he is referring to all of us when he talks about us spending money on dogs and having all those starving people. I've attached my reply, which was written in anger. In fact, I'm still shaking from this email. I wonder how much he gives to the "starving people". Here is my reply:

Actually, I did think this was a joke.

The reference was that the email was from an adult. I have done a copy/paste so that you can see what I received. If your daughter wrote this, then I would hope that you get her professional help, as it is obvious that she is not being truthful with those she corresponds with. Here is the email I responded to:

You have received the following from :

Hi, my daughter has been looking for a puppy, and I wanted to get her one for her birthday.I think that a reasonal price to get the puppy for if I get her would be about $100 to $200 if I drove up there to get her.Please give me somemore information about the puppy as soon as possible.

thanks,
N.......
Now, as far as starving people, we could go into why do you drive a car when you could walk and save money for those starving people? Why do you eat a full portion of food when you could just eat 1/2 and save the other for those starving people.
I have as much as $10,000 each in some of my dogs. I work hard for my money, donate a good bit to charity, and do help those starving people. But, when I sell a pup, I expect to be paid a fair price for it.

Good luck with your daughter.


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> Well, here is the follow up from the email I received yesterday concerning the fair price being $100 to $200. Actually, my first response to them was that I thought it was a joke. It wasn't ugly, I just said, you must be joking, my female pups start at $1500. Well I ruffled some feathers with that one because this is what I got back:
> 
> Thank you for being so kind to respond. I am not aware of the e-mail that you received, but it must have been from my 11 year old daughter. We have promised her a puppy and do not know much about the cost of some breeds. We do however have feelings and if she had opened your e-mail I'm sure that she would have been very upset. Whatever the question she was not joking, as you so kindly put it. You know the world needs more people like you. What kind of a world do we live in when people actually sell dogs for astronomical prices when people are starving every day in our own backyards?
> 
> ...


I think your response to them was great!!!


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## Tanner's Mom (May 27, 2005)

What a wonderful response. What goofy people. But you know, I get a lot of "dog" questions since Tanner comes to work with me, and most of these people are just ignorant. I had a fellow ask me how much I paid for Tanner, and I told him I had seen dogs like him in the newspaper for $400. He thought that was really really high. I though, honey, you haven't seen high yet! While it amazes me sometimes, I've got admit that I was one of those ignorant people too. I thought Tanner was a good dog because he was AKC registered. Thank goodness for the education I have received here on SM! By the way, how is Vinnie doing? That baby has personality plus.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> What a wonderful response. What goofy people. But you know, I get a lot of "dog" questions since Tanner comes to work with me, and most of these people are just ignorant. I had a fellow ask me how much I paid for Tanner, and I told him I had seen dogs like him in the newspaper for $400. He thought that was really really high. I though, honey, you haven't seen high yet! While it amazes me sometimes, I've got admit that I was one of those ignorant people too. I thought Tanner was a good dog because he was AKC registered. Thank goodness for the education I have received here on SM! By the way, how is Vinnie doing? That baby has personality plus.[/B]



Vinnie is doing fine. Julie finished his championship quickly. She had surgery recently (nothing serious), and her sister has been helping her with her three females and the babies. I got to see Vinnie babies when I visited there a couple weeks ago. A nice lady from New Jersey flew down to get one of them the day before I got there, and she brought a big box of chocolate candy. My friends ate it all before I got there.








Hopefully, there will be little "Vinnies" in the show ring soon.


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## RexsMom (Jun 8, 2005)

I can't believe people would try to buy a dog via email. I spent hours on the phone wanting everything from the family history, health history, to....yes you are reading correctly...I also asked for Rex's measurements. How can you add someone to your family based on "I only want to pay $100 to $200?" You do get what you pay for.


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## kwaugh (May 8, 2006)

I didn't think your responses were mean at all!! Honestly, $100 to $200 will get you a dog from a shelther. If he's really concerned about helping those "starving people in the world" then why not help a pet in need and save an unwanted dog from a shelter since he's got such a low price he wants to spend on a dog for his 11 year old daughter. 

Karyn


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## RexsMom (Jun 8, 2005)

> I didn't think your responses were mean at all!! Honestly, $100 to $200 will get you a dog from a shelther. If he's really concerned about helping those "starving people in the world" then why not help a pet in need and save an unwanted dog from a shelter since he's got such a low price he wants to spend on a dog for his 11 year old daughter.
> 
> Karyn[/B]


EXACTLY!!!!


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## mmo (Sep 4, 2004)

Why would someone feel they have the right to "judge" what you should charge for your work? for your puppies or even for a service that someone can offer? I think it`s insulting to say the least. 
Some of us may not have the budget to afford a puppy but that doesn`t mean they are expensive or that they should be free just because we want them to be ours. In my opinion, it is the breeders`prerrogative to price their pups as much or as little as they like or as they consider it`s fair for the work and the money they have invested.
I think it`s just frustrating for breeders to have to deal with people like these guys.







bringing the issue of starving people to this is just out of line.


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## charmypoo (Sep 11, 2004)

> I can't believe people would try to buy a dog via email. I spent hours on the phone wanting everything from the family history, health history, to....yes you are reading correctly...I also asked for Rex's measurements. How can you add someone to your family based on "I only want to pay $100 to $200?" You do get what you pay for.[/B]


I don't think it's wrong to purchase a dog by email. I enjoy corresponding by emails and I find that we aren't intruding into each other's time. I always do have a conversation by phone as well but email is very helpful. For example, I purchased 3 Maltese from 1 breeder - we have written about 500 emails over the years but only spoke on the phone about 5 times.


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## wagirl98665 (Jan 5, 2006)

QUOTE(HappyB @ Jun 22 2006, 11:52 AM) 

Well, here is the follow up from the email I received yesterday concerning the fair price being $100 to $200. Actually, my first response to them was that I thought it was a joke. It wasn't ugly, I just said, you must be joking, my female pups start at $1500. Well I ruffled some feathers with that one because this is what I got back:

Thank you for being so kind to respond. I am not aware of the e-mail that you received, but it must have been from my 11 year old daughter. We have promised her a puppy and do not know much about the cost of some breeds. We do however have feelings and if she had opened your e-mail I'm sure that she would have been very upset. Whatever the question she was not joking, as you so kindly put it. You know the world needs more people like you. What kind of a world do we live in when people actually sell dogs for astronomical prices when people are starving every day in our own backyards?

Again thank you but I do not think that we will be doing business with you.

I will say that the email I sent him back wasn't as nice. I guess he is referring to all of us when he talks about us spending money on dogs and having all those starving people. I've attached my reply, which was written in anger. In fact, I'm still shaking from this email. I wonder how much he gives to the "starving people". Here is my reply:

Actually, I did think this was a joke.

The reference was that the email was from an adult. I have done a copy/paste so that you can see what I received. If your daughter wrote this, then I would hope that you get her professional help, as it is obvious that she is not being truthful with those she corresponds with. Here is the email I responded to:

You have received the following from :

Hi, my daughter has been looking for a puppy, and I wanted to get her one for her birthday.I think that a reasonal price to get the puppy for if I get her would be about $100 to $200 if I drove up there to get her.Please give me somemore information about the puppy as soon as possible.

thanks,
N.......
Now, as far as starving people, we could go into why do you drive a car when you could walk and save money for those starving people? Why do you eat a full portion of food when you could just eat 1/2 and save the other for those starving people.
I have as much as $10,000 each in some of my dogs. I work hard for my money, donate a good bit to charity, and do help those starving people. But, when I sell a pup, I expect to be paid a fair price for it.

Good luck with your daughter.


Great response!


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## thelittlepet (Apr 18, 2006)

People out there are nuts. We have alot of people aske what we paid for our dogs and my response is, "Why do you want to know?". I am all for discussing my breeder with them, I love her and her husband, because she has let us have the gift of living with these two wonderful babies. But I am not about to defend myself and what we chose to spend because of someone's ignorance. We knew they would be $$$ but that is what we choose to spend our money on and we knew that our breeder has high overhead if these PPB want to look at it as a buisness. They should understand how much work malt babies are when they are first born, the number of miscarriages a breeder may have before she has a litter, and the vet care required to all dogs in her home. Not to mention time. 

Some people just want things because... and don't care about others hard work or time. I talked to our breeder, as did my husband, more times than I can count. I still continue to, as does he. Like I said, we are grateful to be able to have these kids. We consider it a blessing regardless of the fact that money changed hands. She felt we would make good parents, we do. And I am eternally grateful for her trust in us. 

There are good PPO just so many bad apples before you come across a good one.
Sorry, I am all ramble and no point, just ticks me off that people expect something for nothing and then turn to insults when they can't have what they want. Sounds like the parents of the 11 year old may need to grow up too!
Keep being picky. anyone decent will respect that.
Aimee


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## RexsMom (Jun 8, 2005)

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In my opinion, if I were a breeder I would just really want to know that the dog was going to a good home. I couldnt be a breeder though, because I probably couldnt bare to part with any of them.








It is fine to chat by email and get the details sorted out but definately have a conversation by phone at least before closing the deal as you do. From what it sounded like HappyB thought she was getting an email from a parent, who later said it was a child, which was still probably the parent. I wouldnt think the conversation could have escalated to "starving people" if it had been a phone conversation. People tend to say a lot more in email that maybe they wouldnt say if on the phone.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

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All of this was done through email. I wonder what that man thought when I did the copy/paste of the email I received about the price. Either it was from his wife, or his daugher was posing as his wife. 

I, too, thought it was a pretty low blow to bring up starving people. I wonder how much he cuts his lifestyle to save and help those same starving people.

Hey, I promised to have a good attitude for the rest of the day. I think it's the heat that has gotten to me.







I'm not usually as consistently nasty as I've been today. In my own defense, I was nice to the ten patients I saw.


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## bellaratamaltese (May 24, 2006)

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In my opinion, if I were a breeder I would just really want to know that the dog was going to a good home. I couldnt be a breeder though, because I probably couldnt bare to part with any of them.








It is fine to chat by email and get the details sorted out but definately have a conversation by phone at least before closing the deal as you do. From what it sounded like HappyB thought she was getting an email from a parent, who later said it was a child, which was still probably the parent. I wouldnt think the conversation could have escalated to "starving people" if it had been a phone conversation. People tend to say a lot more in email that maybe they wouldnt say if on the phone.
[/B][/QUOTE]

All of this was done through email. I wonder what that man thought when I did the copy/paste of the email I received about the price. Either it was from his wife, or his daugher was posing as his wife. 

I, too, thought it was a pretty low blow to bring up starving people. I wonder how much he cuts his lifestyle to save and help those same starving people.

Hey, I promised to have a good attitude for the rest of the day. I think it's the heat that has gotten to me.







I'm not usually as consistently nasty as I've been today. In my own defense, I was nice to the ten patients I saw.
[/B][/QUOTE]

*hugs you* You handled it well and don't apologize for being nasty! You're disgusted, big difference!


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## RexsMom (Jun 8, 2005)

> Hey, I promised to have a good attitude for the rest of the day. I think it's the heat that has gotten to me.
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I promise myself that frequently, but hey...the heat gets to us all once in awhile! Or for me, my excuse and it is a good one...pms! LOL


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## Maidto2Maltese (Oct 19, 2004)

Oh My goodness... I had to laugh when someone was talking of pups the range of $50-$100-$200









I paid $250 for my rescue ,Naddie, for heavens sake and felt that was a bargain!! The rescue group paid out a lot of money for vet visits,wound treatments, vaccinations, tests, heartworm treatment, deworming, spaying etc!.. and Naddie is either a badly bred maltese or a mix... and I still had no qualms that was a good price, understanding the vet bills alone. Many of which I'd have to lay out anyway once I got her had they not already done it.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> Oh My goodness... I had to laugh when someone was talking of pups the range of $50-$100-$200
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I can tell you from a personal standpoint that the vet bills can run up fast. I think the only pup I ever paid for from a shelter was one I paid $75, which was to include the spay. I ended up taking her to my own vet and paid for it there. Shelters will often just give them to reliable rescue people because they know they will follow through with the care.
One of the worst situtaions I got involved with was three adult standard poodles and a litter of five week old pups. I actually bought them to get them out of their bad situation. The adults ranged in weight from 27 to 36 pounds when I got them. The pups were from 1.7 to 2.4 pounds. I spent a fortune getting them healthy before I found them homes. I ended up charging for those to recover some of my money. Usually, I'm just so glad to find a home for one of the rescues that I pay for the care, then give it away. ANYONE WANT A RESCUE? Let me know, and I'll fix you up.


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

I still do not think the daughter wrote it!!!











Andrea~


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## charmypoo (Sep 11, 2004)

I have found that animal shelters always offload the tougher cases to the rescues. I am absolutely amazed at the dedication of the people in my rescue group. I must admit .. it's not very well organized .. but people are trying and giving it 150%.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> I have found that animal shelters always offload the tougher cases to the rescues. I am absolutely amazed at the dedication of the people in my rescue group. I must admit .. it's not very well organized .. but people are trying and giving it 150%.[/B]



One of the things with doing rescue is that you have to be prepared to keep that dog for life. You are right about the hard ones. I can't imagine anyone wanting old, almost blind poodles, or a crippled almost blind Yorkie who poops yukky stools every so often right in the middle of the floor. I look at them and I think of how sad it is that I'm the only one who wants them. 
It took me two years to find a home for one of the Labs (she is now a loved house pet), but she almost killed me in the process. She is the one who would play with the others and I would get caught in the middle. One time I got knocked flat on my back, and I had problems walking for three week. She is also the one who brought me presents of dead rats and snakes.
Because of the ones who came and didn't leave, I can't take anymore for short term. I now just volunteer for transport or things that don't mean another animal will come here to live.


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## izzysmom (Nov 6, 2005)

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Hi,

Please don't hate me but... I am one of those people who emailed a whole bunch of breeders a stock email, which included a question about the price. The ones that wrote back and said "please call" annoyed me - it's not that I didn't have the time to call, it's that you never know what whack-job you're going to end up talking to, if they're going to pressure you into buying a puppy, etc. I just don't feel comfortable talking to strangers on the phone unless definite boundaries are set ahead of time. 

Re: price questions, it frustrates me that breeders find it "tacky" to be asked about price. You don't know the reason the person is asking - for instance, anything $2000 or less was fine for me, but some people wanted $3000 or more for their dogs, so what's the point of having an extended conversation if there is no way I could afford their dog? Yes, I agree it would be tacky if someone was nickel-and-diming you over a reasonably priced puppy, but everyone has different ideas of what a reasonable price is. 

The breeder who I ultimately selected had what I think is a great approach - she provided an email address on her website, and all incoming emails were automatically sent a reply with a standard set of information, including the typical range of prices she asks for her puppies. It then said if you are still interested, to please call this number. 

I hope this isn't sounding hostile, I know you are a great person and have the puppies' best interests at heart... 

-A


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

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I can see your point of view, and I certainly wouldn't have a problem giving the price to someone who sent me a nice email telling me about themself and their interest in my dogs. The ones I have a problem with are those who just send an email and ask the price. Some of the emails can be a short as "How much?".


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## Cary (Jun 11, 2006)

I think many (myself included) are ignorant when first looking
into a new venture. Some (myself included) are willing to do at
least some investigation or research before reaching out to someone
and asking questions. Some people know the meaning of tact and 
decorum and others just blurt out "how much?". Wrong? Maybe.
Not my choice or method certainly.....
I think that the internet is a fine way to research and make initial
contact with a breeder (though I would not look for a wife on the internet).
Sometimes you just don't know where to look. If you meet someone
with a Malti you admire you certainly can ask about the breeder but that's
not always the way it works out.
I researched the breed online, found the "other" site first then found this
one.







I was able to look at a variety of breeders and perhaps without
enough info I commited to my pups. (only a few more weeks







) 
I of course wanted a pet not a show dog and now am more educated than 
I was before. I choose to learn more about the breed and their needs and training.
It's a shame when anyone acts as shamelessly, deceitfully or stupidly as
the one looking for a dog for their daughter. Certainly they didn't do their
research beforehand as to small children and the breed or even the ballpark
range for prices on the precious little balls of white fluff.
I appreciate those of you setting a higher standard for us all and I also hope
that you can appreciate and encourage those of us that can't, don't or won't
spend the big bucks on one of these jewels. After all we want them for the love
enrichment and acceptance they provide and can only hope we can give it back to them.


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## bek74 (Jun 26, 2006)

I to am one of those people that ask for the price. When I was looking for my beautiful Sammy maree I sent emails explaining who I am that I am married and have 3 young children, I am a house wife/mother. And I was looking for a little girl malt and was wondering how much there girls were. You can email me or contact me via phone on the followig number.
I got a couple of respones, very similar to each other, and they went kind of like this. I don't see why the price would be your number one concern, you are more than welcome to contact me by phone and talk about the breed. How ever at this time I don't feel I will have a puppy available for you.
I was so hurt by these emails. Price does play a big part. We are a one income family, have 3 young children to support, and bills as everyone else does. But that by No way means, I would love my little furbaby anyless, and wouldn't give her a loving home.
Well I did manage to find my sammy Maree, One lady didn't reply to my email she rung me. I told her how I never got my skin daughter and this girl would be my baby girl/daughter. She got me, she understood me, having been a mother herself, she understood why I had a budget and had to stick with in it.
My family and I went out to meet her, and meet her babies, we were there for hours talking and she got to see how my boys were around the pup/ Sammy Maree, and she was soooo happy.
I send her photos of Sammy maree and have gone over and had lunch with her a few times now, and we email each other all the time. She is truley a wonderful lady. When my husband was still in hospital( had serious motorbike accident) Sammy was due to go in and get spayed, she offered to pick sammy up from my vet(1 1/2 hour each way for her) for me and keep her for however long I needed, even Max as well (not from her), It worked out that my husband was released 2days before sammy's op, so my baby didn't have to leave me.
Anyway I just wanted to add my point. I am a responsible malt mummy and love my babies very much, I have pet insurance for both of them, incase something was to ever happen, and I have put a little money away into a seperate account since I got sammy to cover any of the extras and luxuries my babies may need or want.
Just my experience when looking for my furdaughter.
BEK,SAMMY MAREE & MAX


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## msmagnolia (Sep 8, 2004)

Bek, I can understand that you got your feelings hurt. It sounds like you did try to explain a bit about yourself and your family situation. I think it is perfectly reasonable to try and determine if a breeders prices would even be in the ballpark for your family's budget. 

Regarding the other posts on this thread, I like the idea of the breeders having a nicely worded autoresponse to email that gives a general price range. I also like the breeders that give an approximate price on their website. Those interested in Maltese (or any other breed) have a wide variety of price ranges that they are willing to pay and this is just the reality of the situation. In my opinion taking some small steps could save the breeders a lot of time and aggravation, and save the buyer from confusion and hurt feelings.

I still don't understand why anyone would confront a breeder about their prices, though. The breeder has the right to charge whatever they want, and I, the buyer, have the right to say "No thanks". I don't think I have the right to tell them that their prices are too high.


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## Cary (Jun 11, 2006)

> I still don't understand why anyone would confront a breeder about their prices, though. The breeder has the right to charge whatever they want, and I, the buyer, have the right to say "No thanks". I don't think I have the right to tell them that their prices are too high.[/B]






Exactly.


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## kab (Apr 11, 2005)

> As some of you know, I try to give things from the breeder's standpoint from time to time to let you see the other side of the story.
> Anytime I get an inquiry for a pup, I always send an email back stating that I find it best to talk by phone. I feel that those who are serious will have no problem with this, and we can start the process, which may go on for months before the pup is ready. I received responses today from two of those emails I replied to earlier in the week. Just thought I would let you see the replies.
> 
> 
> ...



This is why time and time again I end up with maltese as rescues. Pets are disposable to people like these.


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## Cary (Jun 11, 2006)

> Pets are disposable to people like these.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Unfortunately....true.


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## dogloverx3 (Apr 14, 2006)

In Australia the shelters do not dump problem cases on rescues . No dog can be rescued from any shelter UNLESS it has been temperament tested FIRST . I am horrified that someone would suggest the only dogs in rescue have PROBLEMS - I think comments like that have a negative impact on people adopting rescues . Maltese have the highest dumping rate of any pure bred in Australia - I am certain that the problem with these delightful dogs lies with the irresponsible OWNER , NOT THE INNOCENT DOG !!!! Every single member of my family has a rescue - and you know what , they're all PERFECT !!! In Australia rescues desex , microchip and vaccinate - meaning the $250.00 dog is in reality FREE . Sarah


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## felicity (Jun 19, 2006)

i was also one of those people who emailed and called around for prices but i never just emailed and said how much? i always told the breeder a little about myself, why i wanted a maltese and what it would mean to me, i told them he/she would be indoors and part of the family and generally just started a conversation with them, for me, i had to find out prices, as you all know, my husband isn't helping me with this one so it's up to me to pay for the malt and as an artist i don't make a whole lot, i have seen many maltese that don't cost a fortune and they are lovely pups, some even enter shows. if a breeder told me they didn't have pup for me just because i asked a price then i wouldn't want one of their pups, just because someone can't spend $2000 plus on a malt doesn't mean they don't deserve a puppy.

i was recomended to the breeder by a woman whos been showing for 43 years, the lady who has the pups has been showing for 17 years, she's a lovely older woman and she still shows the mother, she said the boys are wonderful, healthy, cute and playful and honestly that's all i need to know, so they don't cost $2000, they will still be as cute and sweet as any other pup, she's a registered breeder too and obviously that is the most important thing.

i do understand that a lot of people emailing are rude and obviously don't deserve a puppy but some people really do need to stick to a budget and how will they know if they can't ask prices?


felicity


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## lorraine (Jun 24, 2006)

A view from the other side of The Pond.

Maltese do not seem to be as "popular" in the UK - which is a GOOD THING - far fewer rescues. Breeders are few and KC Registered Maltese breeders are as rare as hen's teeth.









I spent over a year researching and another 2 years searching once I had worked out who the "good" breeders were, imo of course. They all use Puppy Application Forms or Questionnaires. They are long forms and you are encouraged to make your answers as comprehensive as possible. This applies for any puppy not just those that may have "potential". If the breeder likes what you have to say, h/she will make further contact, usually by phone - there is a lot of two-way contact and quite often the breeder will want to visit you at home. The purchase contracts nearly always have a spay/neuter clause. You are required to give the contact details of your Vet, particularly if there is another animal in the household. It seems very much as if a brand new Malt owner is unlikely to be offered a puppy with "potential" although that is not ruled out for a second pupppy - quite some time later, though. 

I was on two breeders' waiting lists for what seemed like a life-time until I was fortunate enough to be offered my little boy - and I do count myself very fortunate. He is a pure pet dog, lemon ears, seems like he's going to be above standard weight, loves life, the great outdoors and jumping in puddles (he's a very mucky pup







) and that's fine by me









Oh yes - the price was just a bit above the average for England because I wanted a breeder who did not live hundreds of miles away which would have meant a very long first car journey for the puppy. I paid the sterling equivalent of nearly $2,800 - there's a good comparison for those whose buyers are looking for a bargain.


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## MissMelanie (Feb 13, 2006)

*This all has been very interesting reading, thank you Fay for getting it going.

Ok let's see... In my seach for a puppy I contacted people by phone and e-mail. I had a ton of questions to ask and many times, as I was asking, I was told on the phone by a breeder, here is my email address, just email the questions to me. Ok then! Or I was told how much the breeder charged right up front... as soon as I asked for a girl, before they even found out much about me at all. That really was odd to me. Yes I "THOUGHT" I only wanted a female. Silly me.

Mr Wookie's breeder also has an auto responce email that asks her to call with her phone number. This turned me off, at first, because I have awful hearing loss. I HATE being on the phone! However I did call her and left my phone number and email address and asked her to get in touch with me if she had a smaller dog available. Well, MONTHS later, out of the blue, guess who emailed me. HOW lucky am I that she recalled me asking for a small dog. VERY blessed for sure!

Fay... please you didn't get the truth that NUT pointed out to you...

*Thank you for being so kind to respond. I am not aware of the e-mail that you received, but it must have been from my 11 year old daughter. We have promised her a puppy and do not know much about the cost of some breeds. We do however have feelings and if she had opened your e-mail I'm sure that she would have been very upset. Whatever the question she was not joking, as you so kindly put it. *You know the world needs more people like you.* What kind of a world do we live in when people actually sell dogs for astronomical prices when people are starving every day in our own backyards?

*Ok so I admitted my weakness, or one of them... I can't HEAR... so IF You call me ever please speak loudly and make sure I know who you are. HAHAHAHHAA Right Fay?! 

enJOY!
Melanie
*


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

> i was also one of those people who emailed and called around for prices but i never just emailed and said how much? i always told the breeder a little about myself, why i wanted a maltese and what it would mean to me, i told them he/she would be indoors and part of the family and generally just started a conversation with them, for me, i had to find out prices, as you all know, my husband isn't helping me with this one so it's up to me to pay for the malt and as an artist i don't make a whole lot, i have seen many maltese that don't cost a fortune and they are lovely pups, some even enter shows. if a breeder told me they didn't have pup for me just because i asked a price then i wouldn't want one of their pups, just because someone can't spend $2000 plus on a malt doesn't mean they don't deserve a puppy.
> 
> i was recomended to the breeder by a woman whos been showing for 43 years, the lady who has the pups has been showing for 17 years, she's a lovely older woman and she still shows the mother, she said the boys are wonderful, healthy, cute and playful and honestly that's all i need to know, so they don't cost $2000, they will still be as cute and sweet as any other pup, she's a registered breeder too and obviously that is the most important thing.
> 
> ...


I'm not sure what you mean by "registered breeder". Do you mean her dogs are registered?


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## lorraine (Jun 24, 2006)

> I'm not sure what you mean by "registered breeder". Do you mean her dogs are registered?[/B]


Marj
I know your question was not directed at me, but, if I may, I would like to say the UK KC has an accredited breeder scheme as well as dog registration. The scheme members are often referred to as registered breeders. It's a more formal (and gently policed) way of ensuring the good breeding, screening, placing and advisory practices that *most* breeders follow but *many* do not. I found it very useful to know what to expect of breeders when I was looking for a puppy.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Too bad they don't have anything like that in the US!


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## Char-Luv-4-Maltese (Feb 26, 2005)

I am a small breeder not in the Show End of the breeding though. I try to look at it from both sides as a breeder and a buyer's standpoint. I don't forget where I came from when I was looking for my babies. Yes I would ask the price what they wanted and think nothing of it when others shopping for one ask me my prices face it we all have a budget on how much we can spend when we go shopping for a maltese. I do I know that I sure did. I don't have any problem communicating by email but will also say feel free to call me anytime and be glad to talk about maltese cause they are my life and want to get to know you better and you get to know me and how I raise my dogs. I like a little notice in advance if somebody is coming to look at my fur kidz how I raise them and keep them but I also have had drop in and didn't bother me a bit I am a stay at home mommy to my fur kidz so it is not like I shouln't have my P's and Q's dotted all day that I don't want others to see how I raise them. If I worked out and had somebody drop by with a short notice and I have they just have to realize I also had a job I just left and came home to and if they tore up paper or had there toys strung all out they just have to realize I walked into a mess they decided to have a party while I was away. AGain it don't take me very long to clean up there messes do to the fact I have ceramic floors and a mop bucket and broom ready at all times. I strive very hard to make sure my fur kidz live in a very clean invirement I don't want no body getting sick from not being clean. I also could not ever take Rescue's in afraid that I might bring something in my line that is just not worth taking that risk. I am very happy for the ones that can and do this but have to understand I can't afford to take that risk might bring in Parvo or something else that would go through my whole line.I also don't breed any other breed just Maltese that way I can give them my full attention. NOne of my fluffs live in cages or are crated at no time. NOw I do have fenced in yard they get to go out and play and do there potty thing but not a small pen it is very large for them to run. I do have I don't like to call it a kennel (I don't like that name)cause it isn't I guess really ,have my quilting machine in there right out our back door that I keep three fluffs in. ONe male is retired one is not and of course my long time Pom that I have had her before I went maltese crazy they stay out there from time to time but have free run of quilting shop and flip door to go out in a large area to play and are shut in at night when they stay out there can't take the risk since we live in the country a critter getting them. 
I try to look at it from both sides of it buyers view and a breeders view cause I won't ever forget where I started from how I was when I shopped for maltese how breeders treated me some I will never forget good always out weighed the bad. It is just not one sided it is two sides you need to look at it. I always try to help others looking if I can't help them what they are looking for I am honest to them if I can't reach there needs what they are looking for I have nothing to hide what I have is what I have plain trueth. I remember when I would dream about owning a maltese saving the money to get my first one it was not easy and I don't forget that. But let me tell you when I got the money saved up and bought my first little girl boy did it change my life forever and look at me I couldn't stop at one. I never intended to be a breeder it just happen was a gift God layed on me and I didn't realize it till later. Maltese was like a potato chip I couldn't settle with one. LOL

Ok this is my view as a small breeder how I look at it.


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## malteseandme (Mar 21, 2006)

[attachment=10760:attachment]
I maybe considered odd by some but when I was breeding a e-mail might have been okay to begin with but unless the person wanting one of my babies came for an interview before any agreement to allow them to have a baby it wouldn't have mattered how much money they had. If I didn't feel completely secure after meeting and get to know the person I had no problem saying sorry, not one of my babies. If I felt the person wanted a cherished angel to love for the babies lifetime then I would work with them so they could have one of my angels. I always took in consideration the fact if the person wasn't able to pay a reasonable amount that they probably wouldn't be able to give one proper care either. 
E-mails are not enough to truly tell you about the person. Anyone can say whatever they think you want to hear. Even spending the time to to do your best to get to know the person would still take some serious thought on my part. I didn't have but a couple of litters a year and knew I'd never net a profit and didn't care about making money from my babies anyway. Seeing the joy and love of being able to share such a wonderful gift from God with the right people was my reward. I would never have shipped one of my tiny angels to a stranger for a million dollars. It is beyond my understanding how somebody could ever ship a baby. 
I can honestly say there was more people by far that I wouldn't allow my angels to go to than ever came and saw my babies and left without wanting my babies. For me it became to hard to trust people with an innocent, helpless angel, I just can't do it. It is to much to take a chance.
PJ malteseandme

[attachment=10761:attachment]


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

Well, here is a good one I got today. I am too tired right now to write an answer, but you can bet I will try to educate them in my reply.

I would like to adopt a tiny female Maltese as a baby pet only. I would like one that will weigh under 2 pounds at maturity. 

You may call me at or e-mail me at work at

Thanks,


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## Char-Luv-4-Maltese (Feb 26, 2005)

> [attachment=10760:attachment]
> I maybe considered odd by some but when I was breeding a e-mail might have been okay to begin with but unless the person wanting one of my babies came for an interview before any agreement to allow them to have a baby it wouldn't have mattered how much money they had. If I didn't feel completely secure after meeting and get to know the person I had no problem saying sorry, not one of my babies. If I felt the person wanted a cherished angel to love for the babies lifetime then I would work with them so they could have one of my angels. I always took in consideration the fact if the person wasn't able to pay a reasonable amount that they probably wouldn't be able to give one proper care either.
> E-mails are not enough to truly tell you about the person. Anyone can say whatever they think you want to hear. Even spending the time to to do your best to get to know the person would still take some serious thought on my part. I didn't have but a couple of litters a year and knew I'd never net a profit and didn't care about making money from my babies anyway. Seeing the joy and love of being able to share such a wonderful gift from God with the right people was my reward. I would never have shipped one of my tiny angels to a stranger for a million dollars. It is beyond my understanding how somebody could ever ship a baby.
> I can honestly say there was more people by far that I wouldn't allow my angels to go to than ever came and saw my babies and left without wanting my babies. For me it became to hard to trust people with an innocent, helpless angel, I just can't do it. It is to much to take a chance.
> ...


I fully agree email can't be trusted people will tell you anything you are right I also know face to face they will tell you anything as well to get you to buy one of there pups it happened to me. Guess my true meaning 
of when I meant to say is I had no problem communicating by emails sending pictures to them and as the process got
further on if they was still interested then I would have to meet them see if my fur kidz except them before 
I made the decision if one of my fur kidz was fit for them. My main concern was my babies to make sure they was placed in loving caring arms and if I didn't feel that way with the impressions they left me my pups didn't go. Again I do very very little advertising most of my pups are sold by word of mouth.I am on one site advertising and that is way more then I need as small as I am. I do not ship my puppies ither I just don't have the heart to do that to them. I admire others that do if they didn't I would of never got my Pretty Boy. I have allot of week points being a small breeder but that is just me. I am sure all breeders has there week points and there strong points. 
Char


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

I couldn't rest until I sent a reply. I probably left some things out, but this is what I sent the person who wanted one under two pounds. 


I do not know of any reputable breeder who would try to breed pups who will be two pounds at maturity. The standard is three to seven, with four to six pounds preferred, and that is what I strive for. The ideal dog for me is five to six pounds. If I ever did get a very small one, I would not sell it, for fear that it had serious health problems. Many of the tiny dogs have liver shunt, and they will die early, or they may have other missing parts. These dogs are prone to have more than one opening in their skull that may or may not close. 
My advice to you is that, if you find a breeder who offers you a pup that would be under two pounds at maturity, run in the opposite direction. Either they are giving you an under estimate of adult weight, or they are trying to sell you something that could bring you much heartache. As I said, I don't know of any reputable breeder who would have or try to sell such a puppy.
It saddens me that you would put size as your primary criteria. What if the pup got larger? Would you still love it? Many breeders, including myself, feel uncomfortable placing pups when size is the most important thing.
Please do further research before selecting your pet. 
Good luck in your search.
Bella Maltese


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## dolcevita (Aug 3, 2005)

Great response! I hope they take your words to heart.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> Great response! I hope they take your words to heart.[/B]



I'm happy to say this person wrote me back this morning, saying they were not aware of the problems with the tiny ones. I used this opportunity to make other suggestions (such as health testing) to aide them in their search. 
Hopefully, they will find a nice, healthy pup to love.


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## CandicePK (Nov 11, 2004)

> > index.php?act=findpost&pid=236021
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## josymir (Aug 23, 2006)

I don't think most breeders mind when people call or email asking to talk about available puppies what most of them mind is when people waste their time. Time is precious.

I never mind talking to someone and answering their questions. My dogs are my babies and I spend a lot of time with them. I am very proud of my breeding program and I breed quality dogs therefore when people email me asking me for a free dog it bothers me. Yes, people email me telling me they can't afford to buy a dog but if I have a cute little 5 pound maltese femal puppy free they would be happy to take her. Oh well! 

I spend a lot of time with people and most of them are very good about knowing what they want, how much dogs go for and what questions to ask. I am always happy to answer questions and emails. I like to give preliminary information over an email and if the person likes to persue it further then I would be glad to talk to them.

There are a lot of breeders out there, some better than others. You have to find the right breeder for you. A good one is hard to find and when you do find them you will know.
Josy


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## izzysmom (Nov 6, 2005)

> > index.php?act=findpost&pid=236021
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It was very good of you to write such a thoughtful response to that person - I think most breeders sharing your point of view would have just deleted the email.


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## Laceys mom (Nov 12, 2004)

My Lacey and Izzy from this site are from the same breeder. I too emailed the breeder from her site, a reply was sent. The breeder ended up calling me and we spoke for almost 3 hours the first time. I still email her about once a week and let her know how Lacey is doing. She has offered all kinds of advice, support and has even gone to the vet with me. She was kind enough to let me come and visit Lacey before I could bring her home. Even her husband was very nice and talkative to me and my husband. 

It took me about a year to find a breeder. Lots of work. I had some that were out of my price range, some had no puppies available and a I even had one that would not let my have one of her puppies because I live in a cold climate. I live in Ohio, not the South Pole!

But I have to admit I could never be a breeder. The people who contact breeders would drive me up the wall. I have a hard enough time with people who want to purchase a dog but only want to spend a few hundred dollars. These people think I'm nuts for paying what I did for Lacey.

Josy - welcome!!!

Love you lots - Jami and Lacey (Lacey who is being a good girl tonight since her dad is in West Virginia)


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## josymir (Aug 23, 2006)

Thanks for the welcome, I thought I wouldl join the group since it seems to be a very popular group. I am also happy to share some thoughts from the breeders point of view.

I will be honest with all of you being a good, caring breeder is hard and it does take a lot of work and it is hard. I do it because I love the breed. I don't think most people realize how much work goes into breeding and rasing a good litter. Sleepless nights, midnight feedings, emergency C-sections, plus daily care. I often joke and tell my husband "thank goodness I don't get paid by the hour". 

I had a little girl last Novemeber that I had to raise from day #1, She wasn't able to nurse off her mother because she was premature and for 2 1/2 months I got up every 2 hours to feed her. After that I decided to cook for her and she was on a special diet and did very well. I stuck with her through the hard times and helped her pull through and now she is my little love. 


I could give you a breakdown of the money most of us spend on parents, showing, stud fees, then breeding, whelping and raising a litter and in the end you would say wow you are nuts! The breeders who show their dogs have the biggest expenses, since showing is very expensive and on the rise. That is probably why a lot of breeeders feel hurt when some people take what they do for granted and request a inexpensive dogs. I think most breeders just want to feel valued for the hard work they have put into it.

As far as size, most show breeders will aim to breed towards the AKC standard each with a preference. I like the 5 1/2 to 6 pound dogs. I think they are overall better for breeding and showing. I rescued a 2 lb girl a long time ago and she had a lot of preblems. After having her I equate small with having problems so I avoid the little ones. I would rather have a bigger one than a tiny one. This of course is personal preference. People request under 3 pounds all the time and I wonder why. 

If you do your research and find a good breeder you will be much happier in the end. I get a lot of emails from people requesting help because the person who they bought their dog from can't be bothered with them anymore and won't return their emails or calls. That is a shame. The relationship with your breeder should last a lifetime, that is for the lifetime of the dog.
Wow, did it get long.


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## HappyB (Feb 28, 2005)

> Thanks for the welcome, I thought I wouldl join the group since it seems to be a very popular group. I am also happy to share some thoughts from the breeders point of view.
> 
> I will be honest with all of you being a good, caring breeder is hard and it does take a lot of work and it is hard. I do it because I love the breed. I don't think most people realize how much work goes into breeding and rasing a good litter. Sleepless nights, midnight feedings, emergency C-sections, plus daily care. I often joke and tell my husband "thank goodness I don't get paid by the hour".
> 
> ...



Josy,
I'm glad to see you posting on SM. While we have a number of well known breeders who are lurkers, posting is rare.
If you do reading of past posts, you will see that I can be quite verbal about what it takes to be a breeder. I often give a different point from other posters, but I am doing it from experience, rather than theory.
I can well identify with you on all you said about what it takes to raise a healthy litter. I have a profession, but I limited the hours I work, based on the needs of my dogs. Many don't realize that the hours I put in staying home and caring for a litter actually costs me more than I would make if I were seeing patients. My goal is to have nice five to six pound dogs too, but when nature sends a tiny one, I get to recall the hours I spent staying up with premature twins. Sometime I think raising a litter is much like being a new mom again. Hey, I'm too old for this. Must be a little senile because I sure do enjoy it. The reward is not only knowing I'm going to have a new dog for my program/show, but the joy of getting to know a special family who will get one of my babies. The anticipation of a breeding and what it can bring is akin to a kid waiting for Santa. My vet questioned me when I was trying to stack a pup while he was completing the c-section. I guess I was just like a kid who had to stop and play with her toy as soon as it was "unwrapped".
There are many wonderful members here who are appreciative of their breeder. We still have a little education to do with some, as they do not really have any concept of what is involved. Maybe with more sharing, they can learn and have more of an appreciation for breeders.
Again, welcome to the site. I look forward to hearing more from you.
Faye / Bella Maltese


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