# Post Nasal Bordetella COLD?



## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Poor Sammie, last Wednesday he had to have his first bordetella (nasal) vaccine. All tech said about it was some dogs develop a small cold after. Sue mentioned Tyler had rev sneezing after his nasal vac. I'm not sure this is that (?). 

SO---Sammie is having side effects all week. He is normal otherwise. When he gets excited he starts sneezing and makes some snorting (poss reverse sneeze, but I can't tell) Almost sounds like human head congestion with no runny nose. And then he is fine. So I can't play or get him roused or it starts. :w00t:
At bedtime when he lays down he is restless for a while (changing positions several times and either does that cough or snort??) before he falls asleep. I called the vet tonight and he Said since he is eating and all else fine, should clear up --- but bring him Monday if not improved. But I might take him sat. I trust my vet-but I'd like your opinions please. 

Is this common? Does anyone know how long it might last. I was told by the vet that the nasal is preferred as far as adverse reactions to a shot and most tolerate it, so he wanted to try it first. Has anyone had experience that they can pass on? I guess I'm not too worried just can't help wondering. I had puppy years ago with kennel cough (much worse symptoms) and the sounds Sammie makes kinda sound same except Sammie has none of the drainage or watery eyes and he doesn't do it constantly like the puppy from a pet store did. It lasted for long time too. 
I just wonder does he have a cold, or nasal reaction :blink:
Sorry this is so long, thanks!!!


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Did Sammie get the bordatella when he got his dental? 

I personally never do a couple of procedures at the same time, especially not if anesthesia is involved. Sammie's body/immune system had to work hard to get the anesthesia out of his system so it may have made him more susceptible to side effects from the intranasal vaccine.

Just watch him as your vet said and bring him in if he doesn't improve.


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## Zoe's Mom88 (Apr 25, 2011)

I would bring him in on Saturday if he isn't any better tomorrow. I do hope he feels better ASAP.


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

The way you describe it is exactly what happened with Dominic. For three nights I had to get up and hold him up against my chest like when you hold s baby after breast feed, you know? That was the only way for him to stop coughing and snoring like he was suffocating... After three nights ( Friday through Sunday) I could barely sleep and was so worried about him and on Monday the vet checked on him but he was fine, no fever, no nothing so she said they wont do nasal vaccines for him anymore. Monday night he slept all night but those were hard days. 
Poor baby... It will pass. I'll keep you in my thoughts. 


Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App


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## Rocky's Mom (Apr 10, 2010)

Sorry to hear Sammie is having a reaction of some sort. Rocky just had his last week and no reaction at all. I hope little Sammie is ok. Rocky does a little cough like he has a hair ball stuck in his throat after playing tug of war with his rope. He used to do a reverse sneeze too, but that stopped. Hope Sammie is feeling great now!:wub:


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

Kandis - I just get the feeling that the nasal shot of bordatella is a real irritant to the nasal passages and probably drips into the throat as well. Tyler was very uncomfortable with it and as I said, had never reverse sneezed before. I just don't like putting him through that (I have a lot of nasal issues and they're a pain) so I switched to the shot.


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

I would get Sammie checked....

He may have a cold, or a cold from the nasal vaccine. Esp. since he's never had it before.... It wouldn't surprise me.

You can try some saline drops (unmedicated) for his nose.... and a steam treatment - Just like with a baby - run the shower hot and sit with him in the bathroom so he breathes that good steam....

Make sure to bundle him in a blanket when you get done so he doesn't get chilled.

I had cats who got colds from the vaccine a long time ago... remember doing that with them.

Hope he feels better soon


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## bratsuzao (Jan 11, 2013)

I would bring him in on Saturday if he isn't any better tomorrow.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Pat's Ava had this Kandis, a year or 2 ago---I remember it clearly. 
We can only get the nasal here so if I travel to the US it is what I give before going w/the pups---otherwise I just leave it. It seems to me I read there is an oral vaccine now for this that also lasts longer. I will see if I can find the site & post it. In the mean time have a look at this site for good information:
http://www.dogs4dogs.com/blog/2012/...h4dogs+(Truth4Dogs)&utm_content=Google+Reader


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> Pat's Ava had this Kandis, a year or 2 ago---I remember it clearly.
> We can only get the nasal here so if I travel to the US it is what I give before going w/the pups---otherwise I just leave it. It seems to me I read there is an oral vaccine now for this that also lasts longer. I will see if I can find the site & post it. In the mean time have a look at this site for good information:
> Should Your Dog Get Bordetella, the Kennel Cough Vaccine? | Truth4Dogs


OK, here it is: I would love to know if anyone has tried this???
Welcome to Bronchi-Shield


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> Pat's Ava had this Kandis, a year or 2 ago---I remember it clearly.
> We can only get the nasal here so if I travel to the US it is what I give before going w/the pups---otherwise I just leave it. It seems to me I read there is an oral vaccine now for this that also lasts longer. I will see if I can find the site & post it. In the mean time have a look at this site for good information:
> Should Your Dog Get Bordetella, the Kennel Cough Vaccine? | Truth4Dogs


Pay SPECIAL attention to the last paragraph!


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Morning..is it morning yet...:smstarz: well we had very restless night again, But he may be better this AM. (I think?) :chili: We will see. whew--I am so tired, Penny too. Well they can sleep all day while mom works..:angry: at least it's Friday. 

Oh, Thank you all so much for sharing, I want to reply bit later when I can see...:HistericalSmiley:


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## Furbabies mom (Jul 25, 2011)

All of my dogs have had the nasal vaccine and did fine with it except Dewey... He hasn't been to the groomers yet so I didn't get it for him yet. Now I'm concerned. I was going to get it for him next week and make an appt. at the groomers to clean up his belly and trim his nails. Now I don't know what to do?? Shot, nasal, or none??


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Furbabies mom said:


> All of my dogs have had the nasal vaccine and did fine with it except Dewey... He hasn't been to the groomers yet so I didn't get it for him yet. Now I'm concerned. I was going to get it for him next week and make an appt. at the groomers to clean up his belly and trim his nails. Now I don't know what to do?? Shot, nasal, or none??


. . . or the new Bronchi-Shield (I think it is supposed to last longer?)
Edit: here is another page that says it is safe for puppies and answers questions:
http://bronchi-shieldoral.com/Home/ProductQuestions

Edit#2: I have written the company to question the duration of the oral & will post when I hear.


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## Furbabies mom (Jul 25, 2011)

edelweiss said:


> . . . or the new Bronchi-Shield (I think it is supposed to last longer?)
> Edit: here is another page that says it is safe for puppies and answers questions:
> Welcome to Bronchi-Shield
> 
> Edit#2: I have written the company to question the duration of the oral & will post when I hear.


Thanks Sandi. I'm going to talk to my vet about it also.


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## TLR (Nov 13, 2011)

Poor Sammie. I will not give bordetella. Ben had a similar reaction when he went through his puppy shots so never again. That's why if he is ever groomed professionally they will have to come to the house and use my table. I have talked to a couple people that have a grooming business and they will do that for me. My vet always pushes vaccines on me and he is due now so I am ready for the fight. She thinks that titer testing isn't based on solid studies so her recommendation is to do the puppy series and then booster at one year and be done with it (except rabies which is state required). I'm going to have the titer done and see what it shows as I am comfortable with the data out there.
Hope Sammie continues to improve.


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## revakb2 (Sep 8, 2006)

Bogie was sick with cold like symptoms for over a week with the nasal bordetella vaccine. I no longer give it him.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

TLR said:


> Poor Sammie. I will not give bordetella. Ben had a similar reaction when he went through his puppy shots so never again. That's why if he is ever groomed professionally they will have to come to the house and use my table. I have talked to a couple people that have a grooming business and they will do that for me. My vet always pushes vaccines on me and he is due now so I am ready for the fight. She thinks that titer testing isn't based on solid studies so her recommendation is to do the puppy series and then booster at one year and be done with it (except rabies which is state required). I'm going to have the titer done and see what it shows as I am comfortable with the data out there.
> Hope Sammie continues to improve.


Normally I would go through the puppy series (one at a time) & do the booster starting at date of the last puppy series injection (usually more than a yr) except for the rabies also (sort of what she suggests ), but Lisi can't have any more injections--not even rabies. We are getting at that time (for the boosters) so I only hope & pray she is covered. They don't do titers here. My big issue is the Lepto since it is so common here!


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

Furbabies mom said:


> All of my dogs have had the nasal vaccine and did fine with it except Dewey... He hasn't been to the groomers yet so I didn't get it for him yet. Now I'm concerned. I was going to get it for him next week and make an appt. at the groomers to clean up his belly and trim his nails. Now I don't know what to do?? Shot, nasal, or none??



I don't know anything about the oral.... hadn't even heard about it until now.

But if you have to choose between the nasal and the injection - I'd do the nasal.


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## aprilb (Jul 9, 2010)

Awe..poor Sammie..I hope he feels better...has he gotten the bordatella before? This vaccine is not necessary unless Sammie goes to the groomer. I'm with Tracey on this..if I couldn't do my own grooming, I would have someone come to the house...keep us posted..hope you get some good sleep. My vets push vaccines, too...I have one vet who wants me to give lepto..I mean c'mon!:HistericalSmiley::angry: Vaccines are their bread n' butter. All I vaccinate for now is rabies..except for my Lily..no more shots for her ever...due to anaphylactic reaction and a compromised immune system...keep us posted, dear Kandis.:wub:


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

aprilb said:


> Awe..poor Sammie..I hope he feels better...has he gotten the bordatella before? This vaccine is not necessary unless Sammie goes to the groomer. I'm with Tracey on this..if I couldn't do my own grooming, I would have someone come to the house...keep us posted..hope you get some good sleep. My vets push vaccines, too...I have one vet who wants me to give lepto..I mean c'mon!:HistericalSmiley::angry: Vaccines are their bread n' butter. All I vaccinate for now is rabies..except for my Lily..no more shots for her ever...due to anaphylactic reaction and a compromised immune system...keep us posted, dear Kandis.:wub:


April, did you get a statement about not taking Rabies shot from your vet in regard to Lily---is your state one that allows this?


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Update:
Heard from the company that produces Bronchi-Shield already. This is what they had to say about the oral:
"Thank you for your inquiry and interest in BronchiShield Oral. This product
is labeled for 1 year (12 mos) duration of immunity."


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Ladysmom said:


> Did Sammie get the bordatella when he got his dental?
> 
> I personally never do a couple of procedures at the same time, especially not if anesthesia is involved. Sammie's body/immune system had to work hard to get the anesthesia out of his system so it may have made him more susceptible to side effects from the intranasal vaccine.
> 
> Just watch him as your vet said and bring him in if he doesn't improve.


Could be right. We talked about this and he said the nasal is not like a rabies vac, any after cold from the nasal he would get with or without a dental. You know he knows how I feel about any vac. 
I actually forgot he needed it to go into hosp so I had to decide that day. Vet said its harmless we give them all time for hosp visits. If he gets a little sick it will just pass and he won't get the REAL sickness out there he sees all time coming in (groomers, ect).
But I know I will get it before next time.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Zoe's Mom88 said:


> I would bring him in on Saturday if he isn't any better tomorrow. I do hope he feels better ASAP.


Thank you Barbra. Hopefully he will feel better tonight. I been slammed at work-but I'm heading home.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Dominic said:


> The way you describe it is exactly what happened with Dominic. For three nights I had to get up and hold him up against my chest like when you hold s baby after breast feed, you know? That was the only way for him to stop coughing and snoring like he was suffocating... After three nights ( Friday through Sunday) I could barely sleep and was so worried about him and on Monday the vet checked on him but he was fine, no fever, no nothing so she said they wont do nasal vaccines for him anymore. Monday night he slept all night but those were hard days.
> Poor baby... It will pass. I'll keep you in my thoughts.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App


Thanks for your reply. My Vet did say that it would prob pass soon but it's scary when they are sick.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Rocky's Mom said:


> Sorry to hear Sammie is having a reaction of some sort. Rocky just had his last week and no reaction at all. I hope little Sammie is ok. Rocky does a little cough like he has a hair ball stuck in his throat after playing tug of war with his rope. He used to do a reverse sneeze too, but that stopped. Hope Sammie is feeling great now!:wub:


Thanks Diane-Sammie started with his issues about 5 days or so afterwards. So glad Rocky is like my Penny- as most do fine. :thumbsup:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Snowbody said:


> Kandis - I just get the feeling that the nasal shot of bordatella is a real irritant to the nasal passages and probably drips into the throat as well. Tyler was very uncomfortable with it and as I said, had never reverse sneezed before. I just don't like putting him through that (I have a lot of nasal issues and they're a pain) so I switched to the shot.


Sue-after watching him closer last night I think your right on the money with your description. We don't have reverse sneezing problem before either. Nasal irritation sounds right. Just a dry cough/sneeze. If he goes into cooler area or like when he could smell the grass being mowed last night, both set him off. Along with what Marj said, he won't get a nasal vac on same day as being intubated again. Even if it's got nothing to do with what's happening a week later. 
xxx


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Grace'sMom said:


> I would get Sammie checked....
> 
> He may have a cold, or a cold from the nasal vaccine. Esp. since he's never had it before.... It wouldn't surprise me.
> 
> ...


Thanks for all the info on bathing. :thumbsup: You know, you reminded me the Vet did say it can happen on first one only, and not with the boosters, so I will ask. I too prefer nasal but not sure now for him, just iron woman Penny. That girl is tough I guess. I am pretty sure it is a dry irritated nasal / nose from the vaccine not a real chest/head cold (I hope) bec he eats, wants to play but I dont want to toss a ball yet (his FAV) so he doesnt understand.  he is so sweet!! I hate he has this but it's not serious like other problems on SM now.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Ladysmom said:


> Did Sammie get the bordatella when he got his dental?
> 
> I personally never do a couple of procedures at the same time, especially not if anesthesia is involved. Sammie's body/immune system had to work hard to get the anesthesia out of his system so it may have made him more susceptible to side effects from the intranasal vaccine.
> 
> Just watch him as your vet said and bring him in if he doesn't improve.





SammieMom said:


> Could be right. We talked about this and he said the nasal is not like a rabies vac, any after cold from the nasal he would get with or without a dental. You know he knows how I feel about any vac.
> I actually forgot he needed it to go into hosp so I had to decide that day. Vet said its harmless we give them all time for hosp visits. If he gets a little sick it will just pass and he won't get the REAL sickness out there he sees all time coming in (groomers, ect).
> But I know I will get it before next time.


I hate when they tell you to get bordatella the same day because it is required since it takes a couple weeks for immunity. Getting it the same day as visiting the vet, groomer etc. offers no protection at all.

I haven't been doing bordatella with Bailey. He is young and super healthy with a great immune system. Fortunately my vet understands my "quirks" about spreading things out, not over vaccinating, etc. because of Lady.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Ladysmom said:


> I hate when they tell you to get bordatella the same day because it is required since it takes a couple weeks for immunity. Getting it the same day as visiting the vet, groomer etc. offers no protection at all.
> 
> I haven't been doing bordatella with Bailey. He is young and super healthy with a great immune system. Fortunately my vet understands my "quirks" about spreading things out, not over vaccinating, etc. because of Lady.


Neither did we get bordetella till spay and dental. My Vet is same with me, never makes me get them, just advises to get them. One benefit here is if you give a bordetella the distemper vac gets deferred (cant rem how many yrs). I understand he has his hosp rules. I made the decision to get it on same day. But like others he might have gotten sick with just a nasal, but I should have gotten it before a dental.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> Pat's Ava had this Kandis, a year or 2 ago---I remember it clearly.
> We can only get the nasal here so if I travel to the US it is what I give before going w/the pups---otherwise I just leave it. It seems to me I read there is an oral vaccine now for this that also lasts longer. I will see if I can find the site & post it. In the mean time have a look at this site for good information:
> Should Your Dog Get Bordetella, the Kennel Cough Vaccine? | Truth4Dogs


Dear Sandi-thanks for your posts. My Vet didn't mention an oral. I will read them this weekend. Been busy day for me. I know it's late there. So Kitzel did fine with his nasal? That's good. I do now remember little Ava having it. I feel they prob all recover pretty quick its just kinda scary. 
Will be nice if the oral was avail to avoid nasal irritations.
xxxx


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Furbabies mom said:


> All of my dogs have had the nasal vaccine and did fine with it except Dewey... He hasn't been to the groomers yet so I didn't get it for him yet. Now I'm concerned. I was going to get it for him next week and make an appt. at the groomers to clean up his belly and trim his nails. Now I don't know what to do?? Shot, nasal, or none??


Deborah-If you give him one, (only reason I did was for dental, but don't mean I'm right) don't go by Sammie. Dewey might do fine. I think would be horrible situation if all dogs and cats stopped getting vaccinated. So I get what I feel is necessary and forego ones I can. I don't think you should forego the nasal first. My Vet says it has less side effects than the shot. If he does get any of the irritation type issues, I don't think you need to worry. Just don't get nasal next time. Penny did 100% fine like all of yours. 
My Vet gives his dogs nasal instead of shot as soon as it was available. He has small dogs too. I really only get it if the hosp says to. 
xxxx


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## Furbabies mom (Jul 25, 2011)

I agree Kandis. I've said before I had a dog with kennel cough, it sounds horrible and the dog can't rest for coughing. My vet did recommend the nasal. I'll probably take Dewey next week than wait a while and set up a grooming appointment .


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

One of the articles I posted (Jean Dodd) actually states there are less side effects w/nasal. When that article was written the oral was not yet available, so would love to hear if anyone here has tried it?


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Furbabies mom said:


> I agree Kandis. I've said before I had a dog with kennel cough, it sounds horrible and the dog can't rest for coughing. My vet did recommend the nasal. I'll probably take Dewey next week than wait a while and set up a grooming appointment .


Great idea Deborah. It takes about 2 wks. usually for the immunities to kick in. Tonight I broke down & got a flu shot as we will be traveling lots in the next few months & this yrs. shot is better than in other years according to the studies---but it will take about 2 wks before it is actually helpful.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

bratsuzao said:


> I would bring him in on Saturday if he isn't any better tomorrow.


Thanks!!! :wub:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Furbabies mom said:


> I agree Kandis. I've said before I had a dog with kennel cough, it sounds horrible and the dog can't rest for coughing. My vet did recommend the nasal. I'll probably take Dewey next week than wait a while and set up a grooming appointment .


Debora-i know what you mean. Thank goodness, what Sammie has is NOTHING like the KC my puppy had yrs ago. That was awful. I think vac regimen is what's best for each pets circumstances, reations, health, travel. It's bad when you see a vet force many at once or uneeded vacs on dogs like a Vet that gave my friends maltpoo lepto vac and she found out another vet opinion was its not really needed here for inside dogl like hers. You have to research I guess and pray for best. I hate vac time but respect what they do.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

TLR said:


> Poor Sammie. I will not give bordetella. Ben had a similar reaction when he went through his puppy shots so never again. That's why if he is ever groomed professionally they will have to come to the house and use my table. I have talked to a couple people that have a grooming business and they will do that for me. My vet always pushes vaccines on me and he is due now so I am ready for the fight. She thinks that titer testing isn't based on solid studies so her recommendation is to do the puppy series and then booster at one year and be done with it (except rabies which is state required). I'm going to have the titer done and see what it shows as I am comfortable with the data out there.
> Hope Sammie continues to improve.


Thanks Tracey, Sammie won't get it either again :angry: nasal. Did Ben get a nasal or shot form? My Vet is not a titer fan either. But he said I don't need to give mine Lepto vac. 
xxxx


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

revakb2 said:


> Bogie was sick with cold like symptoms for over a week with the nasal bordetella vaccine. I no longer give it him.


Thanks Reva. I will give the shot now. If I had to give them because of boarding in close quarters or travel I guess I would just take a weeks cold over real kennel cough. 
xxxx


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

aprilb said:


> Awe..poor Sammie..I hope he feels better...has he gotten the bordatella before? This vaccine is not necessary unless Sammie goes to the groomer. I'm with Tracey on this..if I couldn't do my own grooming, I would have someone come to the house...keep us posted..hope you get some good sleep. My vets push vaccines, too...I have one vet who wants me to give lepto..I mean c'mon!:HistericalSmiley::angry: Vaccines are their bread n' butter. All I vaccinate for now is rabies..except for my Lily..no more shots for her ever...due to anaphylactic reaction and a compromised immune system...keep us posted, dear Kandis.:wub:


Hi April- I know it's no fun and he is still doing it. I can't tell till tonight if he is improved. He does it more in bed. Sammie goes to the groomer, but I never gave it to him. I can't believe he would give it to him just for the money. He is so caring about my dogs. He said he had to have one to go to the hospital. I read a piece of Sandi's literature and seems it is to protect the Vet. I will ask him about it. He is very open with me. Our groomer is very small/private and I just didn't take him for one till dental. But Vet to me I should get one for groomers long ago. I wanted to try the nasal first. we just get the rabies too, I guess that's pretty standard. no lepto. Did your Vet say you need lepto vacs because it's reported in area where you walk your dogs? I don't know alot about it, except it's bad stuff. 
xxxx


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

Ava got really sick for close to two weeks after the nasal Bordatella vaccine. She needed it when I signed her up for an obedience class....and don't you know we ended up dropping out anyway. She was too scared of the big dogs!!! :smilie_tischkante:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Update:
Sammie is no better tonight :angry: He has a little more energy tonight though and is happy, running around wanting me to throw the ball, eating-barking at the cars-all the good stuff, BUT all the while (unless he is lying still) he is _s_niffing/snorting/sneezing both normal and reverse (but no coughing :thumbsup: so that is good) 
I think he has a messed up nasal passage from the stuff they shot up his nose and not a cold. I guess the vet can tell if he has a real cold that need meds. But I have to confess to you all, I am afraid the Vet will want to give him Benedryl and I am afraid of that stuff too :w00t: So I am wondering if we should wait it out..what's a Mom to do but worry! I'll decide tomorrow. 

thanks for all your posts, they were a great help.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

The A Team said:


> Ava got really sick for close to two weeks after the nasal Bordatella vaccine. She needed it when I signed her up for an obedience class....and don't you know we ended up dropping out anyway. She was too scared of the big dogs!!! :smilie_tischkante:
> 
> View attachment 107570


Pat, I do remember, Sandi reminded me in this thread. What are you doing to Ava in the photo? Did she go back to the Vet for meds. some do, some don't. Good to know it could be 2 weeks. his started about 4 days after the shot. but didn't get bad till 2 days ago.


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## TLR (Nov 13, 2011)

Poor Sammie. I hope this turns around for him quickly. I know how worried you must be. Prayers for Sammie.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

thanks Tracey, your sweet. How long did Ben's last, do you remember even.....LOL


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Tracey, If I even look at him he starts up, I feel bad but I am trying to keep him calm so not to flare up. Cannot bath him either.


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

Sammie, how long is he like that? Mine was like that for 4 days and 3 nights then he just stop sneezing on the 4th night. I'm sorry your baby is going through this and I hope it stop soon. 


Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App


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## Yogi's Mom (Jan 6, 2013)

*He Looks So Sad:mellow: My Gosh He is tiny-How Much Does He Weigh and How Old Is He, And Can I Have Him-HaHa. Yogi Said,YaYa A Brother!!*


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## Yogi's Mom (Jan 6, 2013)

Oh My God SOSo Sorry Its Ava Shes A Girl!!!!
Beautiful Girl!!!!!!!!!!!


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## TLR (Nov 13, 2011)

SammieMom said:


> thanks Tracey, your sweet. How long did Ben's last, do you remember even.....LOL


He was sick and coughing for about a week. It's not something I want to go through again so I have decided minimal vaccinations and titer testing.


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## Maisie and Me (Mar 12, 2009)

My two little poodles (7 lbs) had the nasel vaccine 2 1/2 wks prior to putting them in a high class, new boarding kennel here as we were going to my son's wedding in Ct. They were there for 3 days and came home with kennel cough. Had to go to the vet and they were put on medication.:angry:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Dominic said:


> Sammie, how long is he like that? Mine was like that for 4 days and 3 nights then he just stop sneezing on the 4th night. I'm sorry your baby is going through this and I hope it stop soon.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App


Thank you! He got shot on wednesday, then I think he has been doing about 4 days now. some it last longer though.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Yogi's Mom said:


> Oh My God SOSo Sorry Its Ava Shes A Girl!!!!
> Beautiful Girl!!!!!!!!!!!


no problem.......:HistericalSmiley:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

TLR said:


> He was sick and coughing for about a week. It's not something I want to go through again so I have decided minimal vaccinations and titer testing.


Ok, maybe it will end Monday, that is what Vet is hoping. He said last night that bordetella is totally different from our standard vaccines Tracey as far as reactions as colds/cough. these are just a big nuisance, like a human flu shot can do, it's the others that I fear most. At least we can opt out of bordetella unless Ben needs to go to hospital. You better talk to her now or she will give him one (maybe).
my vet did say that the dog flu can be really bad on these little guys.  wonder how common it is? I will ask. poor guy another ? :HistericalSmiley:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Maisie and Me said:


> My two little poodles (7 lbs) had the nasel vaccine 2 1/2 wks prior to putting them in a high class, new boarding kennel here as we were going to my son's wedding in Ct. They were there for 3 days and came home with kennel cough. Had to go to the vet and they were put on medication.:angry:


Wow, just never know do we. How long did the KC last? We had a puppy with KC for 3 months. My vet did say some do get some KC from the vaccine, but more from the shot than nasal, and if it did happen would not be bad like the puppy I had.


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## hoaloha (Jan 27, 2012)

Poor Sammie  I hope he is feeling better tonight. Obi hasn't gotten the intranasal since he's been with me but I do remember one of his vets letting me know the risk I am taking by not giving it. I told his vet that I do all the grooming now so I'm willing to take that risk. Then, he left me alone! Hopefully, Sammie will get over this very soon! ::hugs::


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## vinhle68 (Mar 19, 2012)

Hi Kandis,

I am very sorry to hear about Sammie's experiences. I hope he gets well soon and can go back to his normal self and cuddles with his great Mommy!


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Maisie and Me said:


> My two little poodles (7 lbs) had the nasel vaccine 2 1/2 wks prior to putting them in a high class, new boarding kennel here as we were going to my son's wedding in Ct. They were there for 3 days and came home with kennel cough. Had to go to the vet and they were put on medication.:angry:


I do think there are different strains of KC as there are of influenza & some of the KC vaccines (whether nasal, injection, or oral) cover more of one strain than w/the other (as in flu shots for humans)---so I could see this happening. 
Another thing to consider is that for one or another reason a shot might not be effective (maybe not stored properly beforehand or ??). That is where a titer will show if the dog has some resistance.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Kandis, you said in one of your postings here that he recently also go the rabies vaccine---how recent was that in terms of when he got this nasal spray? My thinking here is that the rabies ahot may have lowered his resistance thereby setting him up for more of a reaction for the KC. Just a thought. If it were more than a month I would not be so concerned about this possibility.


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## TLR (Nov 13, 2011)

Kandis, here's a link that sums up my current thoughts on bordetella. I have her book "scared poopless" as well.
Should Your Dog Get Bordetella, the Kennel Cough Vaccine? | Truth4Dogs


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Tracy, this is one of the two articles that I posted on page l of this thread so it looks like we read alike!:thumbsup:


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## TLR (Nov 13, 2011)

edelweiss said:


> Tracy, this is one of the two articles that I posted on page l of this thread so it looks like we read alike!:thumbsup:


I guess I missed that. It's a good article and seems like a logical approach.


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## aprilb (Jul 9, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> April, did you get a statement about not taking Rabies shot from your vet in regard to Lily---is your state one that allows this?


 Unfortunately, my state does not have the waiver..but my vet does have other patients who do not get the vaccine..


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## aprilb (Jul 9, 2010)

SammieMom said:


> Hi April- I know it's no fun and he is still doing it. I can't tell till tonight if he is improved. He does it more in bed. Sammie goes to the groomer, but I never gave it to him. I can't believe he would give it to him just for the money. He is so caring about my dogs. He said he had to have one to go to the hospital. I read a piece of Sandi's literature and seems it is to protect the Vet. I will ask him about it. He is very open with me. Our groomer is very small/private and I just didn't take him for one till dental. But Vet to me I should get one for groomers long ago. I wanted to try the nasal first. we just get the rabies too, I guess that's pretty standard. no lepto. Did your Vet say you need lepto vacs because it's reported in area where you walk your dogs? I don't know alot about it, except it's bad stuff.
> xxxx


One of my nice, caring vets once required bordatella at their clinic before any surgical or dental procedure..they don't anymore. The vet who wanted to give my girls lepto is well-aware that they are indoor lap dogs, and no, lepto is not a problem where we live. But this vet is building a new clinic and happens to be the owner...he has a big staff and lots of expenses...there is nothing wrong with wanting to make money, but I am glad that SM has educated me regarding Maltese health..and taught me about vaccines, which ones should be given, and when...feel better little Sammie...


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

hoaloha said:


> Poor Sammie  I hope he is feeling better tonight. Obi hasn't gotten the intranasal since he's been with me but I do remember one of his vets letting me know the risk I am taking by not giving it. I told his vet that I do all the grooming now so I'm willing to take that risk. Then, he left me alone! Hopefully, Sammie will get over this very soon! ::hugs::


Thanks Marisa. He is little less sneezing this am. But he is quiet so?? Your vet sounds like mine, I waited 3 yr for Sammie to get bordetella. My vet was rec to me as a good surgeon that keeps up with latest equip & research and great with little dogs. Boy what a diff from my 2 prev Vets. I think some graduate and hang up a shingle. Hard to explain here, you get my point. 

Did your Vet say if Obi needed a bordetella for dental, ect? Might want to check. I knew but waited till day of dental. I would do it 2 weeks prior (if) a next time of course Sammie needs the shot form.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Hi Everyone,
I decided to take Sammie to the Vet this am for a look see. My Vet is not on duty...:angry:. This is the other Vet that I talked to on phone Thursday that said (could give him some benadriyl maybe, but I didn't give it to him as I don't even have any on hand and I know many use it, but it scares me to be honest) and call back on Monday, SO he might just say just wait it out. 

I'd rather not chance an ER visit on the w/end if he should get worse. He is fine, except when he moves around or runs. Very weird.  I asked if this visit is free since it's from the surgery/shot day, but girl on front desk don't know, now, why am I NOT surprised :HistericalSmiley: It's 42.00 for a visit. Urrrrgggg...Maybe Vet will defer it.

Thanks for all your posts this am. I read them all. :wub:


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

SammieMom said:


> Hi Everyone,
> I decided to take Sammie to the Vet this am for a look see. My Vet is not on duty...:angry:. This is the other Vet that I talked to on phone Thursday that said (could give him some benadriyl maybe, but I didn't give it to him as I don't even have any on hand and I know many use it, but it scares me to be honest) and call back on Monday, SO he might just say just wait it out.
> 
> I'd rather not chance an ER visit on the w/end if he should get worse. He is fine, except when he moves around or runs. Very weird.  I asked if this visit is free since it's from the surgery/shot day, but girl on front desk don't know, now, why am I NOT surprised :HistericalSmiley: It's 42.00 for a visit. Urrrrgggg...Maybe Vet will defer it.
> ...


I'm glad you are taking Sammie in. Better to be safe than sorry.

I remember back in the day when rechecks two weeks after an appointment were free.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Been here waiting 20 min and not one sneeze. You never know he was sick. WT? Maybe fear of the Vet cured him...:HistericalSmiley: ooops. He just started up!!


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

SammieMom said:


> Pat, I do remember, Sandi reminded me in this thread. What are you doing to Ava in the photo? Did she go back to the Vet for meds. some do, some don't. Good to know it could be 2 weeks. his started about 4 days after the shot. but didn't get bad till 2 days ago.


 
Well she kept sniffling and was having a hard time breathing, so I put a humidifier on....that's what I do when I get a cold....


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

aprilb said:


> Unfortunately, my state does not have the waiver..but my vet does have other patients who do not get the vaccine..



Lily did fine with the thimerasol free rabies vaccine last time, didn't she?

Fortunately, my vet has decided to only use the TF free rabies vaccine since I brought it to her attention. She called the company and researched it and decided it was "just good medicine" to use it exclusively.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

We are back. There was no charge. :chili: Vet said never will be for a post op issue. Said he has a post nasal drip. Should be gone in few days, I hope. It can take on something like a kennel cough due to being a live vac, but it's not going to develop into KC. Just drips and irritates :yucky: but I tell ya just listening to him at home it's hard to tell if he might needed antibiotic. He did give me a syringe and said if were him he would give a little Benadryl because he _is_ uncomfortable. But he understands how I might be hesitant giving him a med for the first time on a weekend. 

Sue, wanted to let you know that you were right, exactly what he said is causing the symptoms {the nasal shot of bordatella is a real irritant to the nasal passages and probably* drips* into the throat as well}. 
xxxx


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

vinhle68 said:


> Hi Kandis,
> 
> I am very sorry to hear about Sammie's experiences. I hope he gets well soon and can go back to his normal self and cuddles with his great Mommy!


Thank you. Sending prayers along for your sweet Biscuit......:wub:
xxxx


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

TLR said:


> He was sick and coughing for about a week. It's not something I want to go through again so I have decided minimal vaccinations and titer testing.


Tracey, that is what he said 1 or 2 weeks. Thanks for all the info you have shared with me. :thumbsup: It really helped. I do better with a timeline ...I guess I should be glad he might be protected from all the stuff out there. who knows. :blink:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> I do think there are different strains of KC as there are of influenza & some of the KC vaccines (whether nasal, injection, or oral) cover more of one strain than w/the other (as in flu shots for humans)---so I could see this happening.
> Another thing to consider is that for one or another reason a shot might not be effective (maybe not stored properly beforehand or ??). That is where a titer will show if the dog has some resistance.


:goodpost: 

since mine are not around lot of strange dogs in a day care and have a small private groomer I won't get anything unless they make me......:HistericalSmiley:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> Kandis, you said in one of your postings here that he recently also go the rabies vaccine---how recent was that in terms of when he got this nasal spray? My thinking here is that the rabies ahot may have lowered his resistance thereby setting him up for more of a reaction for the KC. Just a thought. If it were more than a month I would not be so concerned about this possibility.


Sandi, no, he had his last Rabies in May so he is good till June 2014. :chili:But thanks for thinking of that. He has nasal drip/irritated nose and throat.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

TLR said:


> Kandis, here's a link that sums up my current thoughts on bordetella. I have her book "scared poopless" as well.
> Should Your Dog Get Bordetella, the Kennel Cough Vaccine? | Truth4Dogs


Thanks, I will look it over this w/end. I have actually read this before -been awhile ago, I don't remember what it says.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

aprilb said:


> One of my nice, caring vets once required bordatella at their clinic before any surgical or dental procedure..they don't anymore. The vet who wanted to give my girls lepto is well-aware that they are indoor lap dogs, and no, lepto is not a problem where we live. But this vet is building a new clinic and happens to be the owner...he has a big staff and lots of expenses...there is nothing wrong with wanting to make money, but I am glad that SM has educated me regarding Maltese health..and taught me about vaccines, which ones should be given, and when...feel better little Sammie...


April-Thanks, he is about same today. 
I am going to talk to dr. matt next time I go in. he wasn't in today. Maybe he will waive sammie's for me. That is awful pushing Lepto on you. Mine went down the whole list with me and said you don't need lepto for these dogs. He also said to give them HW alone and flea meds 2 weeks apart only IF I saw fleas. So I stopped the confortis then. I am glad I know more now from this site too. I can't imagine what I would be agreeing to :w00t::w00t:. I really hate when I hear a fluff got multiple vacs in one day and even other stuff too, it's like the vet is just cramming in ALL he can in one visit in case they don't come back. With our dogs when I was young, you just did what the vet said. but they did all live long lives. 

I know what you mean about them pushing stuff ($$) the old Vet I had was like that when they all of sudden added some new Dr.'s and offices and got all fancy. (same vets) I could tell right off as they were trying to give me Triflex (prob stocked up on it cheap and needed to sell it) and other stuff with no questions asked. They don't care I guess. 
Luckily I found my new Vet. He is settled in and been around over 10 yrs.

take care! 
xxxx


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

So glad it wasn't serious and that there was no charge!


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Ladysmom said:


> I'm glad you are taking Sammie in. Better to be safe than sorry.
> 
> I remember back in the day when rechecks two weeks after an appointment were free.


Me too. I rem going in and no charge for little things. if so was about $10.00. that when we had one Vet on the Island and everyone knew him. He is long gone now. He was a neat guy too. :wub:


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## Yogi's Mom (Jan 6, 2013)

*Rest Now!*

*So Glad all is Getting better for you,you have been thru alot.*
*So Glad to hear your little one is much better:chili: Reading your thread-has taught me so much info. Iam So Glad I Read it all.*
*This Site really comes to the aid of its menbers,Fantastic Place to be. Nickee&Yogi in PA******


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Yogi's Mom said:


> *So Glad all is Getting better for you,you have been thru alot.*
> *So Glad to hear your little one is much better:chili: Reading your thread-has taught me so much info. Iam So Glad I Read it all.*
> *This Site really comes to the aid of its menbers,Fantastic Place to be. Nickee&Yogi in PA******


Thanks for your well wishes....:wub: 
Yes you never know what small topic will lead to other great info and help others. I have learned a lot here. My Vet might say little too much..(not really, he likes I do research).......:HistericalSmiley:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

edelweiss said:


> Pay SPECIAL attention to the last paragraph!


Sandi, thanks for all the links. I could go nuts, it's really scary stuff. :smilie_tischkante: I will ask about the waiver for him if I need another one. Hopefully he won't need another one for a long time and if so it will be a shot. this really sucks. he can't move around at all w/out sneezing/gagging I guess. I don't know what to call it. :w00t:


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## Grace'sMom (Feb 22, 2012)

Have you been back to the vet, Kandis?

If he's still like this tomorrow you might want to take him.... He could need some support meds.

I know reactions happen but this one sounds worse than ordinary... if he got an actual cold from the nasal vaccine, he could need something to help. Need to make sure it's clearing and nothing getting stuck -- it's like with a human - a virus can cause a bacterial infection if nose gunk sits too long or drops to the lungs.


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

I just finished reading the whole thread...not sure how i missed it probably because i haven't been on much. :blink: I'm so sorry that Sammie and you are going through all of this but very happy to hear nothing serious and you weren't charged for the visit yesterday. 
I don't remember any of mine getting the bordetella vaccine shot or the nasal, well maybe Chloe when it was time for her vaccines after i got her but not 100% sure. :blush: My vet doesn't require bordetella vaccine for surgeries she just requires that they be updated on rabies and that's 2 weeks prior to surgery. For obedience class i didn't have to show proof of bordetella vaccine either, just had to show proof of rabies, distemper and parvo and the distemper and parvo i was able to show proof of titers and this was just recently. 
Hopefully Sammie will start to feel better soon, i know how he feels since i've been coughing and sneezing my fool head off because of the post nasal drip but at least i can take something for it. Is there something that Sammie could take besides benadryl to help dry it up? 
I know i have learned so much on here about vaccines, health, food and pet safety. I'm just so thankful for this site it's a wealth of information! :yes:
Hugs to you Kandis and give CM and Pen Pen kisses from Auntie Debbie. :hugging:


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## Maisie and Me (Mar 12, 2009)

Kandis, Beau and Cody's Kennel Cough lasted about 2 wks. The Vet said they prob got it at the boarding kennel and that likely they would have been worse without the vaccine. I personally am not sure. This place was state of the art facility and spotless and were fanatical about being sure all dogs were vaccinated but who knows. I was more concerned that Maisie would contract it as she was 4 mo old. She stayed with one of my friends. She never got it thank goodness.


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Maisie and Me said:


> Kandis, Beau and Cody's Kennel Cough lasted about 2 wks. The Vet said they prob got it at the boarding kennel and that likely they would have been worse without the vaccine. I personally am not sure. This place was state of the art facility and spotless and were fanatical about being sure all dogs were vaccinated but who knows. I was more concerned that Maisie would contract it as she was 4 mo old. She stayed with one of my friends. She never got it thank goodness.


Michelle,
thanks for your post. I think they prob got it from the shot myself. It is known to cause light case of KC in some dogs. Sammie is still sneezing and carrying on. He seems a little better though.  Comes and goes. I am thinking 2 weeks here too. I am mad at the moment just thinking of the other vaccines a lot today with Penny due soon for hers.......:HistericalSmiley:


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

mysugarbears said:


> I just finished reading the whole thread...not sure how i missed it probably because i haven't been on much. :blink: I'm so sorry that Sammie and you are going through all of this but very happy to hear nothing serious and you weren't charged for the visit yesterday.
> I don't remember any of mine getting the bordetella vaccine shot or the nasal, well maybe Chloe when it was time for her vaccines after i got her but not 100% sure. :blush: My vet doesn't require bordetella vaccine for surgeries she just requires that they be updated on rabies and that's 2 weeks prior to surgery. For obedience class i didn't have to show proof of bordetella vaccine either, just had to show proof of rabies, distemper and parvo and the distemper and parvo i was able to show proof of titers and this was just recently.
> Hopefully Sammie will start to feel better soon, i know how he feels since i've been coughing and sneezing my fool head off because of the post nasal drip but at least i can take something for it. Is there something that Sammie could take besides benadryl to help dry it up?
> I know i have learned so much on here about vaccines, health, food and pet safety. I'm just so thankful for this site it's a wealth of information! :yes:
> Hugs to you Kandis and give CM and Pen Pen kisses from Auntie Debbie. :hugging:


Hi Deb, thanks for thinking of us. Your so sweet. We are riding it out for now. :wub: I never got it before either till now.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

SammieMom said:


> Sandi, thanks for all the links. I could go nuts, it's really scary stuff. :smilie_tischkante: I will ask about the waiver for him if I need another one. Hopefully he won't need another one for a long time and if so it will be a shot. this really sucks. he can't move around at all w/out sneezing/gagging I guess. I don't know what to call it. :w00t:


Kandis, you don't need a waiver for bordatella. It's not required by law. Whether or not to get it is entirely up to you. 

Getting bordatella the day Sammie had his dental did nothing to protect him from kennel cough as it takes a two weeks for immunity. 

"If you decide to give the vaccine, make sure it is the intranasal form, that is, given as nose drops, not injected. And give the vaccine at least 2 weeks before contact with other dogs, for the sake of both your dog and other dogs." 

I bolded what sounds like exactly what happened to Sammie. 

Bordetella: Does Your Dog Really Need the Kennel Cough Vaccine? _Written by Jan on March 21, 2012 – 12:01 am_

Your veterinarian, kennel owner, trainer, day care provider or groomer says your dog should/must be vaccinated against kennel cough, but you’re trying not to over-vaccinate.

What should you do?

More and more, people with pets are finding another vet, kennel owner, day care provider or groomer — or keeping their pet at home! Vaccination is a serious medical procedure with significant risks. If that weren’t bad enough, the ”kennel cough” vaccine is _unlikely _to prevent kennel cough! It can even produce kennel-cough like symptoms. *The WSAVA Guidelines say, “Transient (3–10 days) coughing, sneezing, or nasal discharge may occur in a small percentage of vaccinates.” *It can also cause a serious anaphylactoid reaction. Look up anaphylactoid. You won’t like it.

Think of kennel cough as a canine cold, transmitted as human colds are transmitted — from an infected individual in close contact with an individual with compromised immunity. Like a cold, it is also considered a mild self-limiting disease. If humans can’t effectively be vaccinated against a cold, how can pets? A veterinarian friend uses an OTC remedy called B & T Cough and Bronchial Syrup to treat the cough. For small dogs she uses the children’s variety.


Vaccination | Truth4Dogs


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## SammieMom (Nov 13, 2010)

Marj-Thanks for all the info on bordetella :thumbsup: I thinks it same one posted in earlier post, but I will read it tonight. And your right that's what he has to tee!!

Sammie is finally turning the corner. Poor guy he just goes off when he is excited like if I play with penny or first come home. I have to be quiet and pick him up fast or he goes off so no playing a lot latey. :angry: but I'll know today when I get home how much better he is. Penny runs circles around him when he is in a sneeze fit, or she tries to comfort him by snuggling his head. :wub:


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## StevieB (Feb 2, 2012)

Steve got his bordetella vaccine today, but he got the shot. I was glad for that since I read what sweet Sammie is going through!


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