# Two Different Puppies????? Help Please...



## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

Okay, I need your help. We're in the middle of purchasing a new puppy from Sonshine Acres in Nebraska and we already gave the breeder a deposit. The little boy is scheduled to arrive June 12th. Can you all please take a look at the two pics below and tell me if they look like the same puppy? I'm baffled at the difference and wonder if a puppy can change it's 'look' in 2 weeks time. I would appreciate any opinions!!! Thanks in advance!! :ThankYou:


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## paris'mom (Jul 14, 2004)

Sonshine Acres is a glorified puppy mill. They are on the USDA list. I know this because before I got my first Maltese 4 years ago, I considered those people and I remember I walked away after doing my researches and thanking the lord for letting me know this before I bought a puppy from them.

They don't look alike but there is no way of really telling at this point...


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## coco (Sep 20, 2006)

They don't look alike to me, but who knows? I'd get my money back and go with a breeder from the AMA list, if I were you. Good luck.


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## Tina (Aug 6, 2006)

The ear set is different from puppy 1 picture and puppy 2 picture. Yes, the puppy can change quite a bit within a short time. 
Do you live in Nebraska? 

Tina


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

earset, muzzle and eyes are completely different. i do not believe they are the same pup. 

secondly, i would reconsider your purchase. find a reputable breeder, you'll be much happier in the long run. =]


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## gatiger40 (Jun 7, 2007)

In my very unprofessional opinion those are NOT the same dog.


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## LJSquishy (Feb 27, 2008)

*I don't know if that's the same puppy or not, but it's very possible that it changed it's face shape that much in 2 weeks time...that puppy really doesn't look 11 weeks old to me, though. London looked much more developed at that age, not to mention that she had much longer hair by then, too. Before we purchased London, we ALMOST bought one of their puppies! They were in our top 3 places during early research. I didn't know they were on the puppymill list; I'm glad I decided to go with the breeder I did.  *


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## cloey70 (Jan 6, 2008)

Get your money back, and run, run far away, and find a reputable breeder. If you need help in finding a good breeder, I am sure anyone here can suggest a few. If you can't get your deposit back, then I would still not go through with getting the puppy. You will probably go through lots of health issues being that he or she is from a puppymill.


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## cloey70 (Jan 6, 2008)

Yea, I just emailed them. Their email form asks me how I heard about them, and clicked on other, and then typed USDA is how I heard about you, and I hope you all get shut down.


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## domino_angel (Apr 17, 2008)

Those are not the same pup, no way, no how. Sorry, JMHO. I wouldn't buy from that particular breeder, I had looked there very briefly in my search. It's possible that the pics got confused, maybe they mixed up the pics? It could be an innocent mistake... When I picked a pup, I was able to tell the difference in the different pups in the litter the entire time. They all changed, but not that much. 

In any case I would keep looking.


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## lovesophie (Jan 28, 2008)

Hm, the two pups look different to me, but I'm no professional.

I don't mean to impose, but why are you buying from this particular breeder? Others have mentioned that his/her kennel is a puppy mill. I took a peek at the website, and the prices he/she asks for are comparable to what reputable breeders ask for. I believe many reputable breeders ask for $1500 for a pet quality male, which is less than what the puppy of your interest costs. If I were you, I'd try to get my deposit back. If he/she refuses to refund the deposit, in all honesty, I'd bite the bullet and move on to a more reputable breeder. 

Please reconsider buying from this puppy mill. 

Good luck.


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## Carla (Aug 30, 2005)

> Hm, the two pups look different to me, but I'm no professional.
> 
> I don't mean to impose, but why are you buying from this particular breeder? Others have mentioned that his/her kennel is a puppy mill. I took a peek at the website, and the prices he/she asks for are comparable to what reputable breeders ask for. I believe many reputable breeders ask for $1500 for a pet quality male, which is less than what the puppy of your interest costs. If I were you, I'd try to get my deposit back. If he/she refuses to refund the deposit, in all honesty, I'd bite the bullet and move on to a more reputable breeder.
> 
> ...


I agree. Please don't buy any puppy from them. That is how these people stay in business and it perpetuates the problem.

Carla & Shotzi


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## Cary (Jun 11, 2006)

Look different to me.


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## sassy's mommy (Aug 29, 2005)

I think they look different............the ear set is different and puppy #1 has lemon on his ears and #2 doesn't. The coat also looks different, #1 has a thicker coat.


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## Harley & Dakotas Mum (Jun 11, 2005)

> Okay, I need your help. We're in the middle of purchasing a new puppy from Sonshine Acres in Nebraska and we already gave the breeder a deposit. The little boy is scheduled to arrive June 12th. Can you all please take a look at the two pics below and tell me if they look like the same puppy? I'm baffled at the difference and wonder if a puppy can change it's 'look' in 2 weeks time. I would appreciate any opinions!!! Thanks in advance!! :ThankYou: [/B]


The puppies do look different to me, but puppies do grow & change, and I'm certainly not an expert!!

I guess what made me respond here is because you asked for help/advice. It made me feel like you are having doubts. I may be completely off the mark here, and please excuse me if I am. I would just say that if you are having second thoughts about this, then trust your instincts, and walk away from this 'purchase', I know it's easy for me to say, and much harder to actually do, but, as I said, take all the advice on board, and then trust your initial instincts. Good luck with your decision.


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## charmypoo (Sep 11, 2004)

They look different to me. Please find another breeder! I know someone who purchased from them and they were not satisfied at all.


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## binniebee (Sep 27, 2007)

Yes, they look very different. I don't think the muzzle grows without proportion to the whole head, and the second puppy's muzzle seemed much longer, as well as the ears and eyes not being the same. I am certainly no professional, but I'd say they are not the same puppy, and as everyone else has said: Get your money back and go somewhere else!

I'm so sorry for you to have gone through this. How heartbreaking. But do NOT pay for a quality dog to a puppy mill. 

*hugs*
Cyndi


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

Here is a thread that discusses them.


http://spoiledmaltese.com/forum/index.php?...amp;hl=Sonshine


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## Gennel (Mar 24, 2006)

The puppy pics do look different to me also. But puppies do change in a few weeks. Also the angle of the picture can be one of the reasons why it looks like a different dog. The first pup pic is taken directly in front and the second pic shows the puppies face more tilted like showing more of a profile and thats one reason the muzzle can look short on the first pic and longer on the second pic. That's just my opinion. Buying a puppy without seeing them always worried me so I never did it for that reason,plus not being able to personally meet the breeder,see invironment where the dogs live etc...




Gen


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

Is your new pup being sold to you as AKC registered? I seem to recall that either or both of Pam and Ken Miller, owners of Sonshine Acres, were suspended from the AKC for a period of time because of false registration issues. You might want to check with the AKC to see if they have been reinstated.


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## 1malt4me (Oct 6, 2006)

I don't think that is the same puppy, and I don't think you should buy fromthem if they are lying to you this early. If they do it now what are they going to do later. RUN! :w00t:


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## MaryH (Mar 7, 2006)

> Is your new pup being sold to you as AKC registered? I seem to recall that either or both of Pam and Ken Miller, owners of Sonshine Acres, were suspended from the AKC for a period of time because of false registration issues. You might want to check with the AKC to see if they have been reinstated.[/B]



Here's the info on the AKC disciplinary action:

http://spoiledmaltese.com/forum/index.php?...amp;hl=sonshine


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Sonshine Acres is one of largest puppymills in the midwest. Puppymill puppies are raised in cages in barns like chickens, not home raised like Maltese puppies should be. Puppies from this type of situation are hard to socialize, can be fearful from lack of enough human contact and can be very difficult to housebreak, not to mention be prone to all sorts of genetic health issues. I would get out of this deal even if you forfeit a deposit. The type of health problems you may be facing could run into the thousands.

This is the USDA so-called "puppymill" list. They are listed under Miller in Nebraska.

http://prisonersofgreed.org/ListA2006.pdf


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## Cosy (Feb 9, 2006)

I think it is the same pup but as someone else pointed out the pics
are at different angles. Both pics the ears are high set but in the
second he seems to be alert causing them to stand out. Please find
another breeder. This doesn't appear to be a well bred pup.


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

i looked at the pictures closer, i retract my last statement. i agree about the angles. 
i have noticed, on the pups right side (our left), there is a slight light spot in the bridge of the nose just before it turns black. it appears to be identical in both of the photos.

however, i still wouldn't purchase from that particular breeder.

good luck in your search. :thumbsup:


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

:bysmilie: Im so confused :blink:


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

> :bysmilie: Im so confused :blink:[/B]


lol. i still love you. :grouphug:


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

> > index.php?act=findpost&pid=586372
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 :wub: thanks Carrie...I wuv u too :biggrin: But im still confused :bysmilie:
oh god I meant luv not wuv


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## llf060787 (Nov 19, 2007)

I don't support puppymills or byb's but once you've looked at the picture how can you possibly change your mind? I know I never could regardless of the circumstances. Its one puppy that would not only have a good home but one that you'll know for sure won't be turned into a breeder. I know everyone here will disagree with me. Sorry.


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

> I don't support puppymills or byb's but once you've looked at the picture how can you possibly change your mind? I know I never could regardless of the circumstances. Its one puppy that would not only have a good home but one that you'll know for sure won't be turned into a breeder. I know everyone here will disagree with me. Sorry.[/B]


i'm sorry, then how is that not supporting puppymills or BYBs? 

i went through several breeders and several puppies before i settled on mini. i not only wanted to make sure i got a cute puppy with a great personality that fit in with my family, but a healthy one from a reputable breeder. and look what that got me. you can see her in my siggy. she's fantastic and beautiful. i couldn't be happier.

to the OP, my suggestion is to move on to a breeder you can trust and a puppy you know in your heart is right for you.


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

Wow... sigh... well, here I go. First, I want to thank each and every response, positive or negative. You guys have given me what I asked for... your great opinions, experiences and advice and I appreciate it all. All responses have made me think, think... and then think again over this and I've made a decision.

First, if you all don't know me as 'CottonsMom', I was on here last April/March when my poor Cotton was diagnosed with collapsed tracchea and dying after 10 wonderful years with her. She eventually died in my arms on March 15th. At any rate, we're now seeking a new baby as you all know by my initial posting about the puppy pics.

Doing research online is some tough business, that's for sure! I've been to Divine Maltese, Always Maltese, Crisman Maltese, Cogins Maltese and so many other's - including - Sonshine. For some reason, I was only able to find a puppy in our price range at Sonshine - the others were in the $1800-$2500 range. It was hard to know 'who' was reputable and who wasn't... so I started communications with Sonshine and found a beautiful little baby boy, that we fell in love with.

When I got the pic of the puppy at 11 weeks, I immediately knew it wasn't the same puppy that I had chosen and contacted the breeder. The response I received was almost immediate and she (Pam) informed me that I was correct, that 'Missy's' pups were in with 'Lady's' pups and she had 'sent' me the wrong pic. She then sent me brand new pics of the correct puppy and I immediately could tell it was the one I chose. (I'll post one below for you.) She was apologetic and extremely sorry for the mix up in emails. (I know what's going through your minds... as it also 'did' go through mine too).

After reading all of your postings, I took every one of them into consideration and believe me, they did help me in my decision. I've decided to bring "Mikey" home to us. Knowing that it's supporting a puppy mill is really disheartening to me, but we've fallen in love with this baby and over the past weeks we've had his picture up on the fridge, telling family members, etc. and I can't seem to get over the thought of him possibly suffering if we "don't" bring him home.

We understand the health risks, the possible socialization issues and other problems that could arise down the line. We also understand that each one of those puppies needs a good, loving home with a family that will spoil them do death and give them the sort of life they deserve. I can't think about $$ in comparison to what we can give him. We're just hoping that he is one of the lucky ones and comes to us healthy - we can hopefully take care of the 'happy' part . If he does have health issues down the road, I'm glad we'll be the one's to be able to care for him and not left to suffer without proper care if that's his fate.

Like one of the posters here said... I can't turn my back now, he's supposed to be with us and we'll do whatever we can to make his life the best it can be. Thanks for letting us know they're a puppy mill... I wish I had come on here a month ago and never had the opportunity to see his little face. Please don't be 'angry' with us for indirectly supporting this mill by bringing Mikey home... it wouldn't have happened under any other circumstances. 

I guess on the positive side of all this, Sonshine has given us many personal references, a one year health/genetic disease guarantee and a promise that the little boy in the new pics is coming home to us. I told her I have NO DOUBT she will send us the "correct" puppy in the picture and that all will be fine if that's what happens. I was honest with her, so we're hoping the honesty is returned. 

Here's one of the 4 beautiful 'new' pics of little Mikey. If I'm not 'laughed' off this site because of this, I would love to join you all in the forums once he's here, if that's alright with you all.

Please keep your fingers crossed for us... and thanks again to all.


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## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

I just want to say that I hope you will continue to be part of SM where you can get answers to possible issues that will come up.


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## Harley & Dakotas Mum (Jun 11, 2005)

He sure is cute!

You've made a tough decision here - I know no one wants to support puppy mills, but its a vicious circle in my mind - if no one buys the puppies, what happens to them? 

Good luck with your little Mikey.


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## revakb2 (Sep 8, 2006)

Good Luck and much happiness with your new puppy.


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## Nissa Fiona (Nov 4, 2007)

He's beautiful and a very lucky little boy to have a wonderful home like yours to grow up in. I can't wait to see pictures as he grows and hear stories about him! :grouphug:


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## kathym (Aug 5, 2006)

I TRULY BELIEVE THAT WHAT EVER HAPPENS IN LIFE IT WAS MEANT TO BE .SO WITH THAT I WISH YOU THE BEST WITH YOUR BEAUTIFUL PUPPY.


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> I just want to say that I hope you will continue to be part of SM where you can get answers to possible issues that will come up.[/B]


Thank you, I really would like to.


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## jen_hedz (Mar 5, 2008)

Mikey is adorable and I wish you the best of luck and many happy years with him!!


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> Mikey is adorable and I wish you the best of luck and many happy years with him!![/B]


Thank you. We hope that's how it all works out.  He is a beauty.


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> I TRULY BELIEVE THAT WHAT EVER HAPPENS IN LIFE IT WAS MEANT TO BE .SO WITH THAT I WISH YOU THE BEST WITH YOUR BEAUTIFUL PUPPY.[/B]


Thank you for that! I agree 100%


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> He's beautiful and a very lucky little boy to have a wonderful home like yours to grow up in. I can't wait to see pictures as he grows and hear stories about him! :grouphug:[/B]


Thank you so much. I hope to have lots!


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> Good Luck and much happiness with your new puppy.[/B]


Thanks so much.


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## Maltipaws (Sep 29, 2005)

These are not the same pups, sorry. If I were to buy one it would be the first one. I thought I read he is from a puppy mill. If so I would keep on looking else where, they may switch the pup again when you go to pick him up..........


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> He sure is cute!
> 
> You've made a tough decision here - I know no one wants to support puppy mills, but its a vicious circle in my mind - if no one buys the puppies, what happens to them?
> 
> Good luck with your little Mikey.[/B]


Thanks. You're right, it was tough to take such a chance. No one should _ever_ have to worry about what happens to them....


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## puppymom (Jun 13, 2005)

Your puppy is BEAUTIFUL. I wish you much happoiness and lots of warm wet kisses :wub:


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## olliemommy (Apr 21, 2008)

First of all, no one is perfect and if you can give that adorable baby a loving and caring home, go for it. It's not his fault and he still needs a home, but that is just my opinion. Best Wishes!!


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> First of all, no one is perfect and if you can give that adorable baby a loving and caring home, go for it. It's not his fault and he still needs a home, but that is just my opinion. Best Wishes!![/B]


Thanks for that!! It really helps..


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## Boobookit (Dec 3, 2005)

*I agree that along with everyone on here, that I detest puppy mills and BYB to the max. But I, like you, could not walk away from such a beautiful little boy because of my heart. I would always wonder what happened to him, where he was, was he happy or was he suffering.
...The list goes on and on.

That was one tough decision that you made because I know it was hard for you with his beautiful face staring at you from your refrigerator door!! I wish that all the dog lovers of the world would ban together and storm the puppy mills in one day and scare the heck out of them and destroy them in one clean sweep........One can dream can't one?? That would be my ideal day!!

Good luck with your new boy and hopefully he will grow into a loving, well socialized and healthy little man!

Marie & the Boys
*


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## llf060787 (Nov 19, 2007)

I'm glad you've decided to take Mikey. It would have been a different matter entirely if you had never seen his picture and it definately would have been easier to walk away. Once you see their picture they capture you're heart. Mikey is one lucky littler fellow and I'm sure he'll bring you lots of joy.

Good Luck.


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

> *I agree that along with everyone on here, that I detest puppy mills and BYB to the max. But I, like you, could not walk away from such a beautiful little boy because of my heart. I would always wonder what happened to him, where he was, was he happy or was he suffering.
> ...The list goes on and on.
> 
> That was one tough decision that you made because I know it was hard for you with his beautiful face staring at you from your refrigerator door!! I wish that all the dog lovers of the world would ban together and storm the puppy mills in one day and scare the heck out of them and destroy them in one clean sweep........One can dream can't one?? That would be my ideal day!!
> ...


Thanks Marie - it helps to know there's others out there who understand. I absolutely hate puppy mill's.. I think it's quite "sick" treating any animal like pure livestock for $. I love the Maltese breed and when I think of those cute little fluff's being mistreated, it's just awful.

We're hoping that Mikey will be able to adjust to his new home and be a happy little boy. All we want is for him to be healthy, the rest we can give him unlimited amounts of.. but his health is so important to us. We'll see what the vet says at his new puppy check next week... we're keeping our fingers crossed.


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:


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## CottonsMom (Mar 15, 2007)

QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 10 2008, 06:41 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=589011


> Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:[/B]


Thanks! We've got Mikey! And he is the most beautiful little guy and such a sweet little personality! He was a bit "cautious" his first night home, but really showed his real self the following day! He is sweet and lovable and the vet check was PERFECT, tight patella's, clear stool sample - all is good and we are SOOO HAPPY we decided to bring him home. I cannot get over how silky his hair is, my last maltese did not have this type of hair... it's amazing.

He absolutely loooooves the yard and "hops" around on the grass like a little bunny, it's so funny. He's eating great and using the piddle pad like it was 2nd nature to him - even though the breeder "Sonshine Acres", said he wasn't potty trained - he's had only 1 accident on our front door welcome rug, but that's it. He holds it all night long.. I could go on and on, but I won't, lol.

I just wanted to say that we "almost" didn't get this little guy... I'm so thankful we did. I will post pics soon, we'll see how he does up the camp on the Pontoon boat with all the Loons!! 

Thanks to ALLLL who supported us with this, and actually, to those who didn't - all opinions helped in our decision. Mikey is our little treasure!!


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## ClaBec Maltese (Feb 19, 2007)

QUOTE (CottonsMom @ Jun 15 2008, 09:52 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591372


> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 10 2008, 06:41 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=589011





> Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:[/B]


Thanks! We've got Mikey! And he is the most beautiful little guy and such a sweet little personality! He was a bit "cautious" his first night home, but really showed his real self the following day! He is sweet and lovable and the vet check was PERFECT, tight patella's, clear stool sample - all is good and we are SOOO HAPPY we decided to bring him home. I cannot get over how silky his hair is, my last maltese did not have this type of hair... it's amazing.

He absolutely loooooves the yard and "hops" around on the grass like a little bunny, it's so funny. He's eating great and using the piddle pad like it was 2nd nature to him - even though the breeder "Sonshine Acres", said he wasn't potty trained - he's had only 1 accident on our front door welcome rug, but that's it. He holds it all night long.. I could go on and on, but I won't, lol.

I just wanted to say that we "almost" didn't get this little guy... I'm so thankful we did. I will post pics soon, we'll see how he does up the camp on the Pontoon boat with all the Loons!! 

Thanks to ALLLL who supported us with this, and actually, to those who didn't - all opinions helped in our decision. Mikey is our little treasure!!
[/B][/QUOTE]
Congratulations on your new baby. I am happy to hear that he is just want you wanted. The coats are quite amazing huh?? 

Have fun and enjoy your baby. You just gave him something that he will always treasure. *YOUR LOVE!! * :grouphug:


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## njdrake (Apr 23, 2007)

Congratulations! 
I'm so glad things are working out for you with this little guy. It's just amazing at how fast and how much we can love these little dogs. Please post stories and pictures.


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## kathym (Aug 5, 2006)

QUOTE (CottonsMom @ Jun 15 2008, 10:52 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591372


> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 10 2008, 06:41 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=589011





> Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:[/B]


Thanks! We've got Mikey! And he is the most beautiful little guy and such a sweet little personality! He was a bit "cautious" his first night home, but really showed his real self the following day! He is sweet and lovable and the vet check was PERFECT, tight patella's, clear stool sample - all is good and we are SOOO HAPPY we decided to bring him home. I cannot get over how silky his hair is, my last maltese did not have this type of hair... it's amazing.

He absolutely loooooves the yard and "hops" around on the grass like a little bunny, it's so funny. He's eating great and using the piddle pad like it was 2nd nature to him - even though the breeder "Sonshine Acres", said he wasn't potty trained - he's had only 1 accident on our front door welcome rug, but that's it. He holds it all night long.. I could go on and on, but I won't, lol.

I just wanted to say that we "almost" didn't get this little guy... I'm so thankful we did. I will post pics soon, we'll see how he does up the camp on the Pontoon boat with all the Loons!! 

Thanks to ALLLL who supported us with this, and actually, to those who didn't - all opinions helped in our decision. Mikey is our little treasure!!
[/B][/QUOTE]

HAPPY TO HEAR EVERYTHING WORKED OUT WITH MIKEY.WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE PICS


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## bonniesmom (Jun 2, 2008)

QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 15 2008, 02:59 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591439


> QUOTE (kathym @ Jun 15 2008, 12:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591386





> QUOTE (CottonsMom @ Jun 15 2008, 10:52 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591372





> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 10 2008, 06:41 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=589011





> Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:[/B]


Thanks! We've got Mikey! And he is the most beautiful little guy and such a sweet little personality! He was a bit "cautious" his first night home, but really showed his real self the following day! He is sweet and lovable and the vet check was PERFECT, tight patella's, clear stool sample - all is good and we are SOOO HAPPY we decided to bring him home. I cannot get over how silky his hair is, my last maltese did not have this type of hair... it's amazing.

He absolutely loooooves the yard and "hops" around on the grass like a little bunny, it's so funny. He's eating great and using the piddle pad like it was 2nd nature to him - even though the breeder "Sonshine Acres", said he wasn't potty trained - he's had only 1 accident on our front door welcome rug, but that's it. He holds it all night long.. I could go on and on, but I won't, lol.

I just wanted to say that we "almost" didn't get this little guy... I'm so thankful we did. I will post pics soon, we'll see how he does up the camp on the Pontoon boat with all the Loons!! 

Thanks to ALLLL who supported us with this, and actually, to those who didn't - all opinions helped in our decision. Mikey is our little treasure!!

He is adorable and I'm glad he's healthy and happy. Just one little caveat - if he hasn't had a bile acid test, maybe you
should consider doing one, just in case. I agree that the puppy mill pups deserve good homes - it's not their fault where
they come from! Also, I think EVERYONE should consider health insurance for their babies, whether they are from a puppy
mill or one of the top breeders. I hope you have many wonderful years with Mikey - he's such a little doll! :wub: 
[/B][/QUOTE]

HAPPY TO HEAR EVERYTHING WORKED OUT WITH MIKEY.WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE PICS
[/B][/QUOTE]
[/B][/QUOTE]


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## bonniesmom (Jun 2, 2008)

QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 15 2008, 03:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591440


> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 15 2008, 02:59 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591439





> QUOTE (kathym @ Jun 15 2008, 12:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591386





> QUOTE (CottonsMom @ Jun 15 2008, 10:52 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591372





> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 10 2008, 06:41 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=589011





> Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:[/B]


Thanks! We've got Mikey! And he is the most beautiful little guy and such a sweet little personality! He was a bit "cautious" his first night home, but really showed his real self the following day! He is sweet and lovable and the vet check was PERFECT, tight patella's, clear stool sample - all is good and we are SOOO HAPPY we decided to bring him home. I cannot get over how silky his hair is, my last maltese did not have this type of hair... it's amazing.

He absolutely loooooves the yard and "hops" around on the grass like a little bunny, it's so funny. He's eating great and using the piddle pad like it was 2nd nature to him - even though the breeder "Sonshine Acres", said he wasn't potty trained - he's had only 1 accident on our front door welcome rug, but that's it. He holds it all night long.. I could go on and on, but I won't, lol.

I just wanted to say that we "almost" didn't get this little guy... I'm so thankful we did. I will post pics soon, we'll see how he does up the camp on the Pontoon boat with all the Loons!! 

Thanks to ALLLL who supported us with this, and actually, to those who didn't - all opinions helped in our decision. Mikey is our little treasure!!

He is adorable and I'm glad he's healthy and happy. Just one little caveat - if he hasn't had a bile acid test, maybe you
should consider doing one, just in case. I agree that the puppy mill pups deserve good homes - it's not their fault where
they come from! Also, I think EVERYONE should consider health insurance for their babies, whether they are from a puppy
mill or one of the top breeders. I hope you have many wonderful years with Mikey - he's such a little doll! :wub: 
[/B][/QUOTE]

Don't know how this post, ending in "he's such a little doll :wub:" got separated from my siggy below - as I've said before, I'm technologically challenged - sorry about that! :bysmilie: 


HAPPY TO HEAR EVERYTHING WORKED OUT WITH MIKEY.WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE PICS
[/B][/QUOTE]
[/B][/QUOTE]
[/B][/QUOTE]


----------



## frankie (Mar 6, 2008)

congrats.i am so very happy for you.he so beautiful. :wub:


----------



## preciouspups (Apr 13, 2008)

Mikey is lucky to have found your family! Wishing you many years of good health and happiness with him.


----------



## ShilohsMom (Jun 25, 2007)

I have personally been to this puppymill and its pathetic- yes I live in Nebraska. They were suspended by AKC before for keeping bad records too.


----------



## jen_hedz (Mar 5, 2008)

Congrats :chili: I'm so glad to hear that all is well and he is a wonderful little guy!! Can't wait to see pics!!


----------



## oiseaux (Feb 16, 2008)

QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 15 2008, 12:08 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591444


> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 15 2008, 03:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591440





> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 15 2008, 02:59 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591439





> QUOTE (kathym @ Jun 15 2008, 12:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591386





> QUOTE (CottonsMom @ Jun 15 2008, 10:52 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=591372





> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 10 2008, 06:41 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=589011





> Congratulations!! :walklikeanegyptian:[/B]


Thanks! We've got Mikey! And he is the most beautiful little guy and such a sweet little personality! He was a bit "cautious" his first night home, but really showed his real self the following day! He is sweet and lovable and the vet check was PERFECT, tight patella's, clear stool sample - all is good and we are SOOO HAPPY we decided to bring him home. I cannot get over how silky his hair is, my last maltese did not have this type of hair... it's amazing.

He absolutely loooooves the yard and "hops" around on the grass like a little bunny, it's so funny. He's eating great and using the piddle pad like it was 2nd nature to him - even though the breeder "Sonshine Acres", said he wasn't potty trained - he's had only 1 accident on our front door welcome rug, but that's it. He holds it all night long.. I could go on and on, but I won't, lol.

I just wanted to say that we "almost" didn't get this little guy... I'm so thankful we did. I will post pics soon, we'll see how he does up the camp on the Pontoon boat with all the Loons!! 

Thanks to ALLLL who supported us with this, and actually, to those who didn't - all opinions helped in our decision. Mikey is our little treasure!!

He is adorable and I'm glad he's healthy and happy. Just one little caveat - if he hasn't had a bile acid test, maybe you
should consider doing one, just in case. I agree that the puppy mill pups deserve good homes - it's not their fault where
they come from! Also, I think EVERYONE should consider health insurance for their babies, whether they are from a puppy
mill or one of the top breeders. I hope you have many wonderful years with Mikey - he's such a little doll! :wub: 
[/B][/QUOTE]

Don't know how this post, ending in "he's such a little doll :wub:" got separated from my siggy below - as I've said before, I'm technologically challenged - sorry about that! :bysmilie: 


HAPPY TO HEAR EVERYTHING WORKED OUT WITH MIKEY.WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE PICS
[/B][/QUOTE]
[/B][/QUOTE]
[/B][/QUOTE]
[/B][/QUOTE]
I'm so glad Mikey has his forever home with you despite wher he came from and hope you have many years together. He is a cutie in that picture. And I agree with bonniesmom that a bile acid test should be done early to make sure your baby is okay. Looking forward to more pics!


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it’s infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.

i'm sure i'll get blasted for my opinion, as the "deed is done" however it *wasn't* when she posted about it. something could have been done to prevent such a purchase, however our warnings fell upon deaf ears. sad. 

i wish mikey the best.


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 05:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594354


> i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it’s infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.[/B]


i dont think you will get blasted and I expect everyone to keep this thread civil, we all have our own thoughts and feelings when it comes to puppymills and I applaud you for being very passionate about it but please do NOT make it personal by calling any member of SM a disgrace for any reason, I am sorry but I will not tolerate it, make your opinion and thoughts known on puppymills all day long but again, personal comments like this is unacceptable


----------



## 3Maltmom (May 23, 2005)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 04:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594354


> i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it's infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.
> 
> i'm sure i'll get blasted for my opinion, as the "deed is done" however it *wasn't* when she posted about it. something could have been done to prevent such a purchase, however our warnings fell upon deaf ears. sad.
> 
> i wish mikey the best.[/B]


Carrie ~ I must agree with you. I haven't posted on this thread.

I saw enough information was given.

To knowingly support puppymills, in *any* way, saddens me.

I do wish the best for the poochie, but cannot offer congrats.

The only way to stop the mills, is to stop supporting them.

BYB's? Yep, quit "knowingly" supporting them, as well.

Breed your petstore pup. Once again no congrats from me.

I apologize for the harsh post. I'm just sick and tired of the wee
ones in need.


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## oiseaux (Feb 16, 2008)

QUOTE (Joe @ Jun 20 2008, 03:09 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594372


> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 05:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594354





> i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it’s infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.[/B]


i dont think you will get blasted and I expect everyone to keep this thread civil, we all have our own thoughts and feelings when it comes to puppymills and I applaud you for being very passionate about it but please do NOT make it personal by calling any member of SM a disgrace for any reason, I am sorry but I will not tolerate it, make your opinion and thoughts known on puppymills all day long but again, personal comments like this is unacceptable
[/B][/QUOTE]


thank you for your post, joe.


----------



## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

QUOTE (Joe @ Jun 20 2008, 06:09 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594372


> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 05:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594354





> i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it’s infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.[/B]


i dont think you will get blasted and I expect everyone to keep this thread civil, we all have our own thoughts and feelings when it comes to puppymills and I applaud you for being very passionate about it but please do NOT make it personal by calling any member of SM a disgrace for any reason, I am sorry but I will not tolerate it, make your opinion and thoughts known on puppymills all day long but again, personal comments like this is unacceptable
[/B][/QUOTE]
i never once called any member a disgrace, joe. i only said i felt supporters of puppymills are. =]


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## luvmyfurbaby (Feb 11, 2007)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 06:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594383


> QUOTE (Joe @ Jun 20 2008, 06:09 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594372





> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 05:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594354





> i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it's infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.[/B]


i dont think you will get blasted and I expect everyone to keep this thread civil, we all have our own thoughts and feelings when it comes to puppymills and I applaud you for being very passionate about it but please do NOT make it personal by calling any member of SM a disgrace for any reason, I am sorry but I will not tolerate it, make your opinion and thoughts known on puppymills all day long but again, personal comments like this is unacceptable
[/B][/QUOTE]
i never once called any member a disgrace, joe. i only said i felt supporters of puppymills are. =]
[/B][/QUOTE]

I'm glad you clarified that Carrie because the above statement can be misconstrued to mean the people who are wishing her well regardless of her choice (right or wrong) are disgraceful or a disgrace to SM. JMO


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

QUOTE (LuvMyFurbaby @ Jun 20 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594391


> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 06:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594383





> QUOTE (Joe @ Jun 20 2008, 06:09 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594372





> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 05:18 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594354





> i'm obviously in the minority here, i'm sorry, i can not offer congrats. knowingly supporting puppymills is disgusting. to be quite frank, it's infuriating. congratulating someone for perpetuating suffering just doesn't sit right with me. and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM, as SM stands for so much more.[/B]


i dont think you will get blasted and I expect everyone to keep this thread civil, we all have our own thoughts and feelings when it comes to puppymills and I applaud you for being very passionate about it but please do NOT make it personal by calling any member of SM a disgrace for any reason, I am sorry but I will not tolerate it, make your opinion and thoughts known on puppymills all day long but again, personal comments like this is unacceptable
[/B][/QUOTE]
i never once called any member a disgrace, joe. i only said i felt supporters of puppymills are. =]
[/B][/QUOTE]

I'm glad you clarified that Carrie because the above statement can be misconstrude to mean the people who are wishing her well regardless of her choice (right or wrong) are disgraceful or a disgrace to SM. JMO
[/B][/QUOTE]
_a quote from a very wise man:_
QUOTE


> "I'm sorry, but I'm just thinking of the right words to say.
> I know they don't sound the way I planned them to be."
> Joe
> SpoiledMaltese.com[/B]


=]


----------



## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 06:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594383


> i never once called any member a disgrace, joe. i only said i felt supporters of puppymills are. =][/B]


i appreciate that and wont argue the point but I took QUOTE


> and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM[/B]


 as a direct personal statement to those here who have "supported" this by offering congrats, maybe I read it wrong but I dont think any individual here is a disgrace for posting their thoughts, feelings or opinions, we all can disagree with each other till we are blue in the face and that is ok, but in my opinion what was said was too personal, thats all


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## bonniesmom (Jun 2, 2008)

Joe is right - we all need to be a little more understanding even when we disagree. And it is not the poor puppy's fault that
he comes from a puppy mill - he still deserves a loving home - and once you fall in love with a pup, how do you say no?
My Eloise was from a very high-end pet shop in NYC, and I know now that she came from a puppymill in Missouri. I was
waiting for a puppy from a breeder on Long Island and went into this store for some supplies. I saw Eloise and I absolutely
had to have her - I felt like we were meant for each other. She was the love of my life until the day I had to put her to sleep
due to chronic incurable liver disease. She deserved a good life and I'm glad I was able to give it to her! And by the way,
she had full AKC registration, which apparently doesn't necessarily mean anything. And by the way, not all "reputable"
breeders are so wonderful either. None of us wants to support the puppymill industry, and I wish they could all be shut down
once and for all, but in the meantime, these babies deserve good homes. I didn't know any of this when I got Eloise - if I
had, could I have left her there? I really don't know...


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 06:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594392


> _a quote from a very wise man:_
> QUOTE





> "I'm sorry, but I'm just thinking of the right words to say.
> I know they don't sound the way I planned them to be."
> Joe
> SpoiledMaltese.com[/B]


=]
[/B][/QUOTE]

:HistericalSmiley: we all can see and read things differently :thumbsup: i just didnt want this to turn personal, thanks for the clarification


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

QUOTE (Joe @ Jun 20 2008, 06:56 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594394


> [i appreciate that and wont argue the point but I took QUOTE





> and the "supporters" of this here are a disgrace to SM[/B]


 as a direct personal statement to those here who have "supported" this by offering congrats, maybe I read it wrong but I dont think any individual here is a disgrace for posting their thoughts, feelings or opinions, we all can disagree with each other till we are blue in the face and that is ok, but in my opinion what was said was too personal, thats all
[/B][/QUOTE]
apparently it didn't come across as i planned. this IS the internet, you can't always read into a person's intended train of thought. =]


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 20 2008, 07:05 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594398


> apparently it didn't come across as i planned. this IS the internet, you can't always read into a person's intended train of thought. =][/B]


i agree, thanks


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## Krystal (Feb 3, 2007)

QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 20 2008, 03:57 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594395


> Joe is right - we all need to be a little more understanding even when we disagree. And it is not the poor puppy's fault that
> he comes from a puppy mill - he still deserves a loving home - and once you fall in love with a pup, how do you say no?
> My Eloise was from a very high-end pet shop in NYC, and I know now that she came from a puppymill in Missouri. I was
> waiting for a puppy from a breeder on Long Island and went into this store for some supplies. I saw Eloise and I absolutely
> ...


That is why I do not step foot in a pet store that sells dogs! I feel by me purchasing supplies from them or even just being there I am in a small way supporting what they do! I think its wrong! jmo


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## 3Maltmom (May 23, 2005)

QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 20 2008, 05:57 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594395


> None of us wants to support the puppymill industry, and I wish they could all be shut down
> once and for all, but in the meantime, these babies deserve good homes. I didn't know any of this when I got Eloise - if I
> had, could I have left her there? I really don't know... [/B]



If you do not want to support the puppymills, then you don't SUPPORT them.

So, in the meantime, these babies deserve good homes. Well, the breeder bitches, of *many *years,
deserve a flippin' *life*. 

I really must apologize here. I don't get it. So many "older" Maltese suffer, thru out their lifetime.
But the "money maker" (poorly bred puppy) is an awwww?? 

Oh how cute. Well how cute is the bitch, who was bred to DEATH?

Once again, I am sorry. I am just so tired of this. 

I would NOT give one penny, not for ANY reason, in support of a* Puppymill*.


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## domino_angel (Apr 17, 2008)

QUOTE (3Maltmom @ Jun 21 2008, 01:45 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594567


> QUOTE (bonniesmom @ Jun 20 2008, 05:57 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594395





> None of us wants to support the puppymill industry, and I wish they could all be shut down
> once and for all, but in the meantime, these babies deserve good homes. I didn't know any of this when I got Eloise - if I
> had, could I have left her there? I really don't know... [/B]



If you do not want to support the puppymills, then you don't SUPPORT them.

So, in the meantime, these babies deserve good homes. Well, the breeder bitches, of *many *years,
deserve a flippin' *life*. 

I really must apologize here. I don't get it. So many "older" Maltese suffer, thru out their lifetime.
But the "money maker" (poorly bred puppy) is an awwww?? 

Oh how cute. Well how cute is the bitch, who was bred to DEATH?

Once again, I am sorry. I am just so tired of this. 

I would NOT give one penny, not for ANY reason, in support of a* Puppymill*.
[/B][/QUOTE]

I gotta agree. Unfortunately, It really doesn't matter what ONE person does, not until there is no market for "cheap" puppies, or the market is shut down by legislation. 
Myself, I don't worry about where the pups are going. I see what are obviously puppymill dogs in P-----d here, and I know that some ignorant person will come buy them, not knowing any better. I fell totally in love with a cute little Malt female that the store wanted to unload on me for a bargain price...I didn't bite. I came back to check a few days later, she had sold. No big deal, no worries. Those pups ALWAYS find homes. I imagine they are usually good ones. Most people spending money on a puppy probably have the best intentions. 

So the point is... If a person is buying a puppymill baby because they want to give it a good home, then they are deluded and they are rationalizing making what they KNOW is a bad decision. There isn't anything wrong with that...just be straight and acknowledge that fact. If a person really wants to "rescue" a puppymill dog then rescue a real one, not just the "product" of a puppymill dog. 

(I apologize in advance for anyone who might be offended by this, also it is not directed at the OP, it is a general statement. In fact, the OP knows what they have done and acknowledges it. Love conquers all, yes?)


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.

If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO


----------



## kathym (Aug 5, 2006)

THAT IS SO TRUE .I KNEW ABOUT PET STORES BUT UNTIL I CAME HERE I NEVER HEARD OF BYB . WHEN I STARTED READING IT WAS A REAL EYE OPENER.
I CANT TELL YOU HOW MANY PEOPLE OUT THERE JUST DO NOT KNOW.LIKE BONNIE'S MOM SAID I'M SURE THE PLACE SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT IS ON THE UPPER EAST SIDE THEY SAY THERE PUPPYS ARE NOT FROM PUPPY MILLS AND CHARGE $$$$$ MY FRIEND EVEN TALKED TO A WOMAN IN CALIFORNIA WHO SAID SHE WAS THE BREEDER OF HER POODLE. THAT WAS AFTER I TOLD HER SHE BOUGHT A PUPPY MILL DOG .SHE WAS SATISFIED WITH THE ANSWER THE WOMAN GAVE HER.  HOPFULLY THE OPRAH SHOW HELPED PUT THE WORD OUT THERE .


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 06:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594585


> I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
> I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.
> 
> If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO[/B]


well, the meaning of ignorant is unaware/uninformed, so i would say the definition fits. it's the same as saying uneducated. if you don't know, you don't know.
however, it also can be used in it's derogatory form, which is _showing_ lack of education. which in essence is saying someone is stupid. =]

i was ignorant when i purchased massimo. i knew not to buy from petstores, but didn't know what constituted a reputable breeder.

i was educated on mills and BYBs when i purchased mini, so i went about getting her the correct way. =]


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

I huddle inside my small cage. 
I can barely stand, it's so small, but that is ok, 
because the wires of the floor cut into my bare feet when I do. 
My skin is raw, and cut, where I've had to lay so uncomfortably 
for hours on end, days without end, years that go on forever. 
My body offers no comfort, as it's thin, and bony. 

I have no bed on which to lay my body. 
No blanket to cover me when I'm cold. 
No furniture on which to sit. 
No private place to do my "business". 
No friends to call my own. 
I am in Solitary Confinement, 
with only myself for company. 

My fellow "prisoners" can't help me, 
for they too are in total misery. 
Their lives are no better than my own. 
I often hear their cries in the night. 
Cries of pain, cries of sadness, cries of loneliness. 

I am hungry, and sick, but my captors don't really care. 
I receive no medical attention, as I'm not considered 
important in the entire scheme of things. 

My children give me a few moments of joy, 
But they are taken too early, leaving my breasts filled with milk. 
I know a different kind of pain now. 
The pain of love lost. 
The pain of true misery. 

My stomach has stopped growling. 
It's way beyond that, as I sit here with the pain. 
Yesterday I Vomited blood, as my stomach began to turn on itself. 
Today I saw hair falling out by handfuls. 
What had been beautiful white hair is now gone. 
Part of me wonders if maybe it will be over soon. 

I sit day in and day out, staring into space. 
I have no family to remember to give me strength. 
I know of no God to worship in times of fear. 
I have no love to remember in times of pain. 
I have no hope. 

I have no hope, 
For I am a prisoner of Cruelty. 
A prisoner of Pain. 
A prisoner of Greed. 
A prisoner of War. 

For I am a prisoner of a Puppy Mill." 

Author Unknown


----------



## domino_angel (Apr 17, 2008)

QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 05:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594585


> I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
> I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.
> 
> If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO[/B]



Lesson of the day: Ignorant: 1. lacking in knowledge or training; unlearned: an ignorant man. 

That's what it means. They don't know.


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

QUOTE (domino_angel @ Jun 21 2008, 11:32 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594655


> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 05:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594585





> I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
> I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.
> 
> If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO[/B]



Lesson of the day: Ignorant: 1. lacking in knowledge or training; unlearned: an ignorant man. 

That's what it means. They don't know.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Oh thank you so much for the lesson of the day, appreciate it :goof:


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 21 2008, 07:53 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594601


> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 06:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594585





> I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
> I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.
> 
> If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO[/B]


well, the meaning of ignorant is unaware/uninformed, so i would say the definition fits. it's the same as saying uneducated. if you don't know, you don't know.
however, it also can be used in it's derogatory form, which is _showing_ lack of education. which in essence is saying someone is stupid. =]

i was ignorant when i purchased massimo. i knew not to buy from petstores, but didn't know what constituted a reputable breeder.

i was educated on mills and BYBs when i purchased mini, so i went about getting her the correct way. =]
[/B][/QUOTE]
thats what I meant Carrie in a derogatory way, but seems I learned my lesson for the day though :biggrin:


----------



## ClaBec Maltese (Feb 19, 2007)

QUOTE (LadysMom @ Jun 21 2008, 10:20 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594653


> I huddle inside my small cage.
> I can barely stand, it's so small, but that is ok,
> because the wires of the floor cut into my bare feet when I do.
> My skin is raw, and cut, where I've had to lay so uncomfortably
> ...


Thank you Marj. When I read that it brought me back to the first few months that I rescued Baby. 

She was in horrid shape. She could not walk without a limp for weeks because her feet hurt so bad. She would try to jump over the stripping in my floor. Not knowing that it is solid. And I still catch her doing it from time to time. 

She was almost blind with infection in her little eyes. 

She was thin as a rail. And once she found out that we keep food accessible 24/7 she would sit for hours on end over the food bowls getting full. Her teeth were in horrid condition. So she could not get much down at a time. And this was between the meals that I gave her separate from the others. The soft food. 

She would tremble like a leaf on a tree for the longest time when held. For the first month or so she would want to hide out in my room in the darkest corner. And still to this day almost 2 years later if I am holding her and make a sudden movement she will jerk. She was beat on I have no doubt. 

She was pregnant when I got her. During whelp she did fine as far as pushing him out. But did not want anything to do with the baby. So I hand raised him. I was not going to make her do anything she did not want to do. Especially raise a puppy. 

I still can not clean her little face like I should. But that is OK. I will not cause her any misery. NO MORE she has had enough of that. 

I could sit here and list the list on and on. But I will not. I was not going to join this thread now. I did offer congrats. But it was not meant the way it was taken by a few. It was the fact that the deed is done and there is no going back. So why not move forward and make the member feel welcome. And hopefully the baby will be healthy. And then by us making the member feel welcome they will stick around and read and read and read some more of the horror stories. And then they can become a advocate against the mills. That was my intention. As I am sure it was with most of the other members that offered congratulations. 

Thank you again for the poem. If you do not mind I would love to add it to my website where I have links to rescues.


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 11:39 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594658


> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 21 2008, 07:53 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594601





> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 06:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594585





> I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
> I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.
> 
> If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO[/B]


well, the meaning of ignorant is unaware/uninformed, so i would say the definition fits. it's the same as saying uneducated. if you don't know, you don't know.
however, it also can be used in it's derogatory form, which is _showing_ lack of education. which in essence is saying someone is stupid. =]

i was ignorant when i purchased massimo. i knew not to buy from petstores, but didn't know what constituted a reputable breeder.

i was educated on mills and BYBs when i purchased mini, so i went about getting her the correct way. =]
[/B][/QUOTE]
thats what I meant Carrie in a derogatory way, but seems I learned my lesson for the day though :biggrin:
[/B][/QUOTE]
you know i love you andrea. :grouphug: and i did know what you meant, i just wanted to put that out there...lol.


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## Nikki's Mom (Feb 13, 2008)

Some days when I read these posts and others about puppy mills, and puppy mill rescues I just want to rob a bank, hijack a tractor trailer and drive to all these puppy mills and rescue all the dogs and set them up on a nice farm where they'll be loved and taken care of.

Then I want to lock up all the owners in filthy cramped cages with just enough food to keep them alive for years and years and years with no medical care or help in any way. And if they become remorseful and learn their grave error, I'd let them out of their cages once a week to clean toilets in a bus station. 

Now that's justice, IMO.


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

QUOTE (Nikki's Mom @ Jun 21 2008, 04:45 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594774


> Some days when I read these posts and others about puppy mills, and puppy mill rescues I just want to rob a bank, hijack a tractor trailer and drive to all these puppy mills and rescue all the dogs and set them up on a nice farm where they'll be loved and taken care of.
> 
> Then I want to lock up all the owners in filthy cramped cages with just enough food to keep them alive for years and years and years with no medical care or help in any way. And if they become remorseful and learn their grave error, I'd let them out of their cages once a week to clean toilets in a bus station.
> 
> Now that's justice, IMO.[/B]



I am with you. I said if i ever won the lottery i would take all the dogs i could from the puppymills and shelters and buy a big house with a huge yard so they could know how it feels to be loved and free to walk.


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 21 2008, 05:15 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594767


> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 11:39 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594658





> QUOTE (Carrie @ Jun 21 2008, 07:53 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594601





> QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 06:28 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594585





> I really don't think people who buy from petstores are "Ignorant" I think most just don't know.
> I didn't , so when someone comes to SM and is blown away by all the info and says "I didn't know" I give them the benefit of the doubt , because I didn't know either.
> 
> If someone willingly goes to a petstore and buys one after all they know , well then yes I would say they are ignorant.JMO[/B]


well, the meaning of ignorant is unaware/uninformed, so i would say the definition fits. it's the same as saying uneducated. if you don't know, you don't know.
however, it also can be used in it's derogatory form, which is _showing_ lack of education. which in essence is saying someone is stupid. =]

i was ignorant when i purchased massimo. i knew not to buy from petstores, but didn't know what constituted a reputable breeder.

i was educated on mills and BYBs when i purchased mini, so i went about getting her the correct way. =]
[/B][/QUOTE]
thats what I meant Carrie in a derogatory way, but seems I learned my lesson for the day though :biggrin:
[/B][/QUOTE]
you know i love you andrea. :grouphug: and i did know what you meant, i just wanted to put that out there...lol.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Thanks Carrie for understanding. Sometimes I don't explain myself right, good to know you get me  
Love Ya too :wub:


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## domino_angel (Apr 17, 2008)

FYI, I didn't mean "ignorant" in a derogatory way. I always say what I mean. If you were offended by what I said that was not my intention.


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## The A Team (Dec 1, 2005)

QUOTE (LadysMom @ Jun 21 2008, 11:20 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594653


> I huddle inside my small cage.
> I can barely stand, it's so small, but that is ok,
> because the wires of the floor cut into my bare feet when I do.
> My skin is raw, and cut, where I've had to lay so uncomfortably
> ...




umm, this could have been written by my Tinker. The boy grew up in a small dirty cage, he has issues, he'll never be normal. It's just too sad, puppy mills should not be legal, they should all be shut down.


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## carrie (Aug 24, 2004)

QUOTE (2MaltMom @ Jun 21 2008, 07:49 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594812


> umm, this could have been written by my Tinker. The boy grew up in a small dirty cage, he has issues, he'll never be normal. It's just too sad, puppy mills should not be legal, they should all be shut down.[/B]


it is sad, and i commend you for rescuing him. what a wonderful home he has now.

but the only way to stop mills is to *not support them*.


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## kathym (Aug 5, 2006)

QUOTE (2MaltMom @ Jun 21 2008, 07:49 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594812


> QUOTE (LadysMom @ Jun 21 2008, 11:20 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594653





> I huddle inside my small cage.
> I can barely stand, it's so small, but that is ok,
> because the wires of the floor cut into my bare feet when I do.
> My skin is raw, and cut, where I've had to lay so uncomfortably
> ...




umm, this could have been written by my Tinker. The boy grew up in a small dirty cage, he has issues, he'll never be normal. It's just too sad, puppy mills should not be legal, they should all be shut down.
[/B][/QUOTE]
THAT POEM JUST TOOK MY HEART .HOW SAD THAT ANYONE COULD BE SO CRUEL TO HELPLESS ANIMALS :smcry:


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## Harley & Dakotas Mum (Jun 11, 2005)

Just say NO

Just Say No to Animals in Pet Shops


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## I found nemo (Feb 23, 2006)

QUOTE (Harley & Dakotas Mum @ Jun 21 2008, 08:15 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594822


> Just say NO
> 
> Just Say No to Animals in Pet Shops[/B]


I signed Jacks!! :thumbsup:


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## Krystal (Feb 3, 2007)

QUOTE (I Found Nemo @ Jun 21 2008, 05:31 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594831


> QUOTE (Harley & Dakotas Mum @ Jun 21 2008, 08:15 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=594822





> Just say NO
> 
> Just Say No to Animals in Pet Shops[/B]


I signed Jacks!! :thumbsup:
[/B][/QUOTE]

Me too! :thumbsup:


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## joe (Jan 5, 2003)

i think this thread has runs its course and went far beyond what the OP has asked, lets not judge those who's shoes we do not walk in, but educate where we can in a civil manner, there is great info in this thread and I hope we all take somethng from it

Closed


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