# Spaying appointment tomorrow...



## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Well I put it off for as long as I could and tomorrow I will have my precious little Pebbles spayed. :sweatdrop: I'm a nervous wreck.

I had my other dog Sandy spayed when she was very little but I didn't know as much as I do now. There is so much contradictory information on whether to spay or not to spay regarding the future health of the dog. 

Also Pebbles doesn't know anything about pain. She lives a happy go lucky life filled with soft things and toys and snuggles, tasty treats and all the pampering she can handle (oftentimes she demands it). She's so sweet and charming. I remember Sandy when we brought her back from the Vet after her operation. She was totally freaked out. She was whiny and frightened, I had to hold her all the time, she wouldn't let me put her down and it took a few days for her to get back to normal. I hate to think of Pebbles being traumatized from an invasive procedure she won't understand. She's never slept away from home before. 

Ok! I know I sound neurotic, people spay their dogs everyday but I feel guilty. I gave her a bath last night and she was so cute running around with that Farrah Fawcett hair :wub: 

I decided to ask the Vet if he can do a tubal ligation instead of the full hysterectomy. I guess I will also have to check with the breeder since we signed a spay agreement with her and I want to honor my contract. 

Why give a dog a complete hysterectomy if the dog can be sterilized without taking out the whole uterus? The dog will still go through its cycles but it cannot get pregnant. 

Anyway my appointment is 10am and it looks more likely that a full hysterectomy is in store. Most Vet's I understand don't know how to perform tubals. 

Anyway I hope everyone had a Merry Christmas and a Wonderful New Year!


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

You don't say how old she is but current thinking is that a bit older (closer to a year) without going through a first heat is better. 

You mention a tubal rather than a spay; a couple of thoughts on that. First, if your baby is in heat (even if her tubes are tied) every male dog in your neighborhood will sense that and be bugging you and her. That means when you let her out to potty or take her for walks, she will be very popular in the canine population and not in a nice way. 

Second and probably most important, leaving the uterus puts your baby at risk for pyometra, which is a very serious infection of the uterus and can be fatal. It requires an emergency spay, and is relatively common in unspayed dogs.

The symptoms you described in your first dog post-spay may actually be from the pain medication - the ones prescribed today are powerful and can be "mood altering". As you know from your first pup, dogs recover nicely and don't remember being in pain; mine was trying to bounce around the next day even though she was supposed to be staying quiet.

I'm glad you're taking steps to prevent an unwanted litter - please consider the full spay rather than the tubal, however. It will be far better for your baby in the long run.


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## Furbabies mom (Jul 25, 2011)

Welcome to SM! We know the anxiety that comes with having your fluff getting spayed. The biggest problem that I had with mine were trying to keep them quiet after. I'm sure that Pebbles will do fine, and be back to herself in no time.


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

we all know the worry you are going through right now but Pebbles will be fine. It will probably be harder on you than it is on her. You said she has never slept away from home before....did your vet say she would have to spend the night because a lot of times they go home the same day. You are doing the right thing. Good luck and come back here for moral support when she is having the surgery. It will help you get through the wait.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

pippersmom said:


> we all know the worry you are going through right now but Pebbles will be fine. It will probably be harder on you than it is on her. You said she has never slept away from home before....did your vet say she would have to spend the night because a lot of times they go home the same day. You are doing the right thing. Good luck and come back here for moral support when she is having the surgery. It will help you get through the wait.


Well with Sandy she stayed two nights. I think they kept her to make sure she stayed quiet and that there was no infection so I'm presuming they will do the same with Pebbles. Thanks for the support, I barely slept and will have to get ready now to take her in.


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## Pooh's mommy (Aug 31, 2014)

I am sorry that you are so stressed over Pebbles' appt to be spayed. I totally understand. It is so hard to cope with the fact that we cannot talk to them and prepare them for what is ahead. I'm sure that Pebbles will do fine. You did not say how old she is. I put off having my Pooh spayed because she was the runt of the litter and was so small. I finally made the appt. when she was 14 months old and she came into her first heat when it was time for her surgery. The vet charged more for the surgery because she was in heat. She told me that it would take a couple days for her hormones to get back to normal after being spayed while in heat and that she would be vulnerable to male dogs that would still want to breed her. I would go with the full spay . I also had 2 teeth removed that Pooh did not lose and were causing crowding. I hope that you baby does great and is home soon. Big Hugs!


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

maggieh said:


> You don't say how old she is but current thinking is that a bit older (closer to a year) without going through a first heat is better.
> 
> You mention a tubal rather than a spay; a couple of thoughts on that. First, if your baby is in heat (even if her tubes are tied) every male dog in your neighborhood will sense that and be bugging you and her. That means when you let her out to potty or take her for walks, she will be very popular in the canine population and not in a nice way.
> 
> ...


Wow thank you! I really appreciate you taking the time to explain that to me. I'm about to get ready to take her in. Pebbles has been through one heat cycle and she will be two in August. I was told that its best to allow for a dog to go through a heat cycle or two because it allows for them to develop hormonally. Pebbles doesn't go out to potty, she still uses the wee wee pad. Sandy goes on long walks but Pebbles only goes on short ones and is never outside unsupervised so I was less worried about her being accosted by males than I was about her future health. Peb's doesn't know how to climb stairs either up or down the little dear heart. I never had any intentions of letting either of our dear ones get pregnant so it was always a matter of how to best keep her safe while keeping her healthy. 

I'm sick with worry because of information like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enPCZA1WFKY 

And articles like this Health Implications in Early Spay and Neuter in Dogs | AKC Canine Health Foundation 

and this https://www.avma.org/News/JAVMANews/Pages/130401s.aspx 

Original study here PLOS ONE: Neutering Dogs: Effects on Joint Disorders and Cancers in Golden Retrievers

Its scary stuff! 

And I sooo probably shouldn't even have looked at those articles again since I'm about to take her in and its all just leading to palpitations and more stress. Its like this heavy burden not knowing whether I'm doing something that might hurt her later in life. I did sign a contract with her breeder (Divine Maltese) that I would have her fixed and Angela wouldn't suggest anything bad for her dogs but I do wish that Vets would come to some kind of consensus on the subject so people know what they're doing and why. I doubt our doctor will agree to a tubal since I heard they are rare in the US so I don't know but I'm a nervous wreck and feel sad. 


:smpullhair: I'm making myself crazy. Time to get in the shower.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Pooh's mommy said:


> I am sorry that you are so stressed over Pebbles' appt to be spayed. I totally understand. It is so hard to cope with the fact that we cannot talk to them and prepare them for what is ahead. I'm sure that Pebbles will do fine. You did not say how old she is. I put off having my Pooh spayed because she was the runt of the litter and was so small. I finally made the appt. when she was 14 months old and she came into her first heat when it was time for her surgery. The vet charged more for the surgery because she was in heat. She told me that it would take a couple days for her hormones to get back to normal after being spayed while in heat and that she would be vulnerable to male dogs that would still want to breed her. I would go with the full spay . I also had 2 teeth removed that Pooh did not lose and were causing crowding. I hope that you baby does great and is home soon. Big Hugs!


Thank you! 

Peb's will be two in August. I really hope she's not in heat, she's only had one heat cycle. I did look and she's not swollen down there or anything. I waited because of whats mentioned in the post above, the idea that waiting allows for a dog's hormones to mature. I'm not a dog expert and the internet can cause more harm than good with all the information. I just became concerned that this may be the wrong decision, especially after listening to the video with Dr. Becker (she's practically pleading with us not to do it). I have to get in the shower before I change my mind.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

*update*

Running out the door. Spent time calling Vet's all over town and there isn't one Vet who knows how to perform a tubal so the choice is made for me.


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

I can completely understand your concern for your fluff. I also waited until after katies first heat before I scheduled her spay. As it turned out, she didn't even know that anything had changed, literally. I picked her up and she was all ready to play! I had more concerns with keeping her less active than worrying about whether she was in pain. I did give her one dose of the pain meds but I don't think she even needed it. 
I really think that it was because this time her incision was sealed with surgical glue rather than stitches or worse, staples. Penny had staples when she was spayed and although she healed up fine, it looked just horrible and sore. Katies incision did not even get red. It was such a dramatic change from penny's spay. 

If I ever have to take another fluff to be spay I would definitely make sure that the vet used surgical glue. I think that made all the difference.

Wishing your little fluff a speedy recovery


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## Trisha (Aug 8, 2014)

I had Maggie spayed around 7 months. No problems at all. She was ready to play when she got home. The only problem was trying to keep her from jumping or running. Their instructions was to let her stay calm and quiet for a few days! Ha...no such luck! But I did have to have her to wear the E-collar as she was trying to lick her stitches. That only lasted for a few daqys. Other than that, I can also say I can't see the scar or where the stitches were. Her little belly looks perfect and no sign of a surgery scar.

Good luck and I hope your baby does just fine. Sometimes we worry for nothing, but it's understandable when it comes to our babies, human or otherwise!


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## lydiatug (Feb 21, 2012)

Best of luck! We all get nervous even at dentals, so we totally understand how you feel!!! My vet never does the external stitches either and they usually don't bother it much


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Well she's there. They asked me not to visit her tomorrow because it might upset her, so I won't see her until Saturday.:smcry:


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

Sandybaby said:


> Well she's there. They asked me not to visit her tomorrow because it might upset her, so I won't see her until Saturday.:smcry:



What's the reason for them to keep her, do you know? Elena got spayed at age 3 (she's a retired show dog) and I picked her up same day. Next day she was already up to no good, had to place her in the stroller to contain her. Don't worry, it will all be fine. Think positive, that helps too.


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

Sandybaby said:


> Well she's there. They asked me not to visit her tomorrow because it might upset her, so I won't see her until Saturday.:smcry:


oh gosh I'm sorry you won't see her until Saturday. She will probably get lots of loving and attention there from the staff. After all, who can resist these adorable little fluff babies. Try to keep yourself busy and maybe the time will go faster. I know exactly how hard it is. Last year Pipper had surgery to remove bladder stones and he was there for 2 days and I didn't know what to do with myself. The support from everyone here helped me so much.


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

I have never heard of them keeping them over night  what is their reason for that?


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

littlefluffbabies said:


> I have never heard of them keeping them over night  what is their reason for that?


They didn't give a reason, they just said she'll receive her operation today and is free to go home on Saturday and that they highly suggest I don't come to visit her because it will "upset the dog". They didn't ban me but they did say they wouldn't recommend it. 

Should I go anyway?

Meanwhile little Sandy is upset without Pebbles. She's been depressed ever since we returned home (she came with us to the Vet). She's refusing treats and is just moping around and choosing to stay in Pebble's den. Its funny in a way because she's usually jealous of Pebbles, always vying for attention etc. and now she's all put out because Pebbles isn't home. Sandy was our first baby so she was used to everything being for her and then she had to get used to sharing with Pebbles. They're good sisters but like all good sisters they have their grievances but now she's missing her baby sister. Its only my mother who thinks we're both crazy for being so upset (lol).

@Pipersmom

Thanks so much. I really do appreciate the support. I haven't been on this site for months and the moment his came back I was here in a heartbeat. Pebbles is precious to me. She's just GORGEOUS! Sweet and funny. She's just joy in a package.


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## Ann Mother (Dec 18, 2013)

We'll never heard of staying over😳. Hope this is not extra cost. I would go in & bring her her blankie & favorite toy. Also one of her pee pads. It will lessen the anxiety. They must be giving her strong pain meds & IV fluids. I that case she would be too sedated to care whether she is @ home.


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## Snuggle's Mom (Jan 3, 2008)

When we had our two Dogs spayed, they came home later on in the day. Not sure either why they are keeping Pebbles for two days??


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Ann Mother said:


> We'll never heard of staying over😳. Hope this is not extra cost. I would go in & bring her her blankie & favorite toy. Also one of her pee pads. It will lessen the anxiety. They must be giving her strong pain meds & IV fluids. I that case she would be too sedated to care whether she is @ home.


I brought in her favorite stuffed toy and a blanket. They would only would allow for the toy and not the blanket but I don't know why. Now I'm worried about why they have to keep her. The Vet did call me and say everything went well. I had assumed that they kept her for an extra day because she would need to rest and such. Now I think I will definitely go and visit her tomorrow and ask if she really needs to be left for a whole extra day.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Snuggle's Mom said:


> When we had our two Dogs spayed, they came home later on in the day. Not sure either why they are keeping Pebbles for two days??


Really? They did the same with Sandy so I thought this was 'normal' for this kind of surgery. Okay. I"m going to insist I see her tomorrow and then find out why she needs to stay. I miss her so much. 

I didn't think I would be this neurotic over this. But I am. Just call me one of those crazy dog mama's I don't care. Both I and Sandy (her puppy sister) are sick over it all.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

Normally dogs come home the same night after a spay or neuter. Tyler stayed overnight because he had a complicated neuter due to undescended testicles but I was able to pick him up first thing the next morning. I can't imagine why they would want to keep her until Saturday. Is anyone there overnight with the pets? Some practices have a vet tech overnight some don't. If not I would try to insist on bringing her home. She'll just be groggy and can sleep at home.


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## maddysmom (Mar 8, 2012)

I just spay Suki last month and she came home later that day. The practice where Lacie goes to the internist keeps them for one night.
I can't imagine why Pebbles wouldn't be ready to come home by tomorrow.
Hugs to you both.


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

I would also insist on bringing her home tomorrow. Staying overnight is one thing but 2 nights?? That seems completely ridiculous! Not to mention unnecessary and stressful for your little pup. She would recover much more comfortably at home. Waiting is awful.  ((Hugs)) for you.


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

I would think if there is a reason they should've tell you and then would be up to you to make the decision of leaving her overnight, or two nights which seems too much. I know I wouldn't leave them unless they have a very serious reason. I had two boys neutered and a girl spayed, they all came home same day at 4-5PM


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## wkomorow (Aug 26, 2011)

That does seem a bit odd. Obviously a spay is more intrusive than a neuter, but Luck came home that evening. I can not imagine why they would want to keep her two days. Hope she is home with you soon.


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## Matilda's mommy (Jun 1, 2005)

First off your Pebbles is beautiful :wub: I remember when Matilda was spay, I couldn't focus on anything all day, when I got the call she was ready to be picked up I couldn't get there fast enough
I'll remember your little princess Pebbles in my prayers tonight, and you too.
I do hope she can come home tomorrow for your sake. Little Sandy will keep you busy. Please update us ok
Hugs to you:wub:


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## Pooh's mommy (Aug 31, 2014)

Checkin In on Pebbles...Hope her spay went well. Did you get to see her? Did she get to come home yet? Hope all is well. Please let us know when you can.


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## Kathleen (Aug 4, 2011)

Sending lots of love for little Pebbles. :wub:
I hope that all went well and she will be coming home soon.


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

How is Pebbles doing. Is she coming home today?


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

Checking in...


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## lydiatug (Feb 21, 2012)

How's your girl doing? Hope all is well


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

I called them today and they said she was fine and discouraged me from visiting (they said they were closing early anyway). They told me that the reason Peb's has to stay is for "medical observation", they keep her to make sure there are no complications or what-have-you. They said they wouldn't take any responsibility if I take her home early since they suggest otherwise. 


The house is completely quiet without her. Sandy refused food yesterday she misses Pebbles so much. I miss her too. I didn't realize how much energy she brings to the house, how much she lightens the mood. I'm worried that she may not be the same when she comes home, that maybe she'll feel distrustful or be depressed.


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## Malt Shoppe (Jul 20, 2011)

I've been fighting the urge, but I have to ask. Is anyone at the vet's all nite to check on these animals as they stay to recover? If not, I wouldn't leave my pet under any circumstances. Who will help an animal in trouble after surgery if no one is there?

I always ask that. When I changed vets, I discussed this with the new vet and made certain he understood that my pet goes home with me to be cared for if no one is there all night.

There was one time that it was expressed Truffles had to be cared for; so I took her to the emergency vet for her overnight care and then back to the vet in the morning.

Sometimes I wonder if they are ordered to stay so the hospitalization charge can be added - you know, they will ! I'd rather pay the emergency vet, they ARE there all night!


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## maddysmom (Mar 8, 2012)

Malt Shoppe said:


> I've been fighting the urge, but I have to ask. Is anyone at the vet's all nite to check on these animals as they stay to recover? If not, I wouldn't leave my pet under any circumstances. Who will help an animal in trouble after surgery if no one is there?
> 
> I always ask that. When I changed vets, I discussed this with the new vet and made certain he understood that my pet goes home with me to be cared for if no one is there all night.
> 
> ...


Quote:
Sometimes I wonder if they are ordered to stay so the hospitalization charge can be added - you know, they will ! I'd rather pay the emergency vet, they ARE there all night!

This is so true. They like to up charge because they know we are at thier mercy.
No reason to keep a fluff their for two nights unless there was a complication during surgery, IMHO.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Malt Shoppe said:


> I've been fighting the urge, but I have to ask. Is anyone at the vet's all nite to check on these animals as they stay to recover? If not, I wouldn't leave my pet under any circumstances. Who will help an animal in trouble after surgery if no one is there?
> 
> I always ask that. When I changed vets, I discussed this with the new vet and made certain he understood that my pet goes home with me to be cared for if no one is there all night.
> 
> ...


You know what I assumed there would be someone there. I mean I just thought it would be like in a regular people hospital with a night nurse etc. How could you operate on an animal and then not have someone there to monitor them?


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## Malt Shoppe (Jul 20, 2011)

I think in most cases, you'd be surprised to find there isn't anyone there all nite. In some clinics, dogs are in cages and in total darkness; lights are off. I know this for a fact because my gr'daughter worked at a vet's office, cleaning up after the dogs, watering, walking, etc and she told me.
When you go in tomorrow to pick up sweet Pebbles, ask if anyone is there during the nite.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Malt Shoppe said:


> I think in most cases, you'd be surprised to find there isn't anyone there all nite. In some clinics, dogs are in cages and in total darkness; lights are off. I know this for a fact because my gr'daughter worked at a vet's office, cleaning up after the dogs, watering, walking, etc and she told me.
> When you go in tomorrow to pick up sweet Pebbles, ask if anyone is there during the nite.


I will. I just hope they tell me the truth. No wonder Sandy was such a neurotic mess when she came home from a stay at the vet! I just can't wait for this night to be over with so I can go and get her. I feel so bad like I let her down.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

I wrote this here yesterday about checking if someone was on duty. The reason I went with my vet was because it was one of the few practices that has someone there with them 24/7.


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## edelweiss (Apr 23, 2010)

Hopefully by now your baby is home & doing well!


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

Honestly, I would question any vet who insisted on a two night stay for a spay. And you're right, you're r baby is alone overnight in a strange place and likely on drugs that mess with her mind.

I'm not sure where you live - are you outside the U.S. where an overnight is customary? I brought my baby home same day. In fact, my vet said they are better at home that night where someone who knows them can be looking for signs of distress.


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## Malt Shoppe (Jul 20, 2011)

Maggie, I feel the same way. I can better care for my little dog 100% of time with her at home. I can't leave my dog at an unattended building no matter what unless they have a cage big enough for me to be with her! My vet understands my feelings and never even asks about it. I made that clear when I started going there.

My motto "my dog, my money"

Sandybaby, Pebbles will be fine when she's back home, it won't leave any lingering change in her, I'm sure. I just hope YOU make it thru the nite! :thumbsup:


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

maggieh said:


> Honestly, I would question any vet who insisted on a two night stay for a spay. And you're right, you're r baby is alone overnight in a strange place and likely on drugs that mess with her mind.
> 
> I'm not sure where you live - are you outside the U.S. where an overnight is customary? I brought my baby home same day. In fact, my vet said they are better at home that night where someone who knows them can be looking for signs of distress.


OMG no! I'm right here in the suburbs of NY. Right on the cusp of Long Island. We're on a Peninsula where there are only two Vets in close proximity and the one we chose is the most popular. We have a holistic Vet named Dr. Selma, he's a wonderful, wonderful man and I trust him wholeheartedly but he doesn't do surgery.

I'm going to pick her up right now. My mother doesn't think she was alone all night because she said there is a tech who stays with them but I am going to ask today. If she was left alone all night then I will have to prepare so some problems. Pebbles has never been alone for a night EVER. She has a strong personality but I don't think she would handle it well, she's never had to endure anything upsetting before.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Malt Shoppe said:


> Maggie, I feel the same way. I can better care for my little dog 100% of time with her at home. I can't leave my dog at an unattended building no matter what unless they have a cage big enough for me to be with her! My vet understands my feelings and never even asks about it. I made that clear when I started going there.
> 
> My motto "my dog, my money"
> 
> Sandybaby, Pebbles will be fine when she's back home, it won't leave any lingering change in her, I'm sure. I just hope YOU make it thru the nite! :thumbsup:


Oh well I only barely made it through the night. We're on our way to pick her up now and my face looks like a puffy mess.


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## Ann Mother (Dec 18, 2013)

You poor lady hope everything works out. Keep us posted.


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

So happy to hear that pebbles will soon be home. I have been thinking about her since you dropped her off.. ((hugs)) for you both


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## sherry (Jan 4, 2013)

I'm so glad you're bringing Pebbles home! Bless her little heart, she should have been home yesterday.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Pebbles is finally home. Her hair is a mess and she's much more quiet than usual but she's home.

For all those who wanted to know if she was supervised at night I asked and it turns out that they are not. They have a tech that comes and goes and "they have cameras". I asked for a copy of all of her medical papers they had on file and I left. I'm going to look for a new Vet.

Someone there also attempted to groom her, they cut a little of the hair around her face which was stupid because now she looks like a Shih Tzu but that I know will grow back.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

A picture of Peb's with her 'cone of shame'. Thank you guys so much for all the advice and support you gave me during this time. You guys are the best!


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

Sandybaby said:


> A picture of Peb's with her 'cone of shame'. Thank you guys so much for all the advice and support you gave me during this time. You guys are the best!


Awww Pebbles you are so cute and I bet you are so happy to be home. I *KNOW* Mommy is happy!
My vet doesn't have anyone stay with the patients overnight either so last winter when Pipper had bladder surgery I took him to a University vet hospital where he would be monitored in ICU continuously. It was well worth the extra cost to give me reassurance he was being looked after. I thought I would die when he was gone.


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

I'm so glad she's home! If she has trouble with her cone, search here for info about onsies. A lot of us have used infant onsies backwards so the tail is out to keep them from the stitches?


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## Malt Shoppe (Jul 20, 2011)

I'm so glad this is behind you, got your sweet Pebbles back home.
Maggie's suggestion reminded me when I needed something like a onsie which I didn't know about, a friend donated a long sleeve T-shirt, we cut the sleeve off and I cut holes appropriately; legs/tail and it worked great. Your Pebbles sounds small enough to do that.

Maybe you could check with Snowbody (Sue) to see where her vet is located, if accessible for you; she seemed really happy with that clinic.


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

I can't help but be a little angry with that vet for insisting that your little pebbles spend 2 nights there unsupervised!! What good does a camera do if she needs someone to attend to her immediately?! I'm so glad that little pebbles is home with you where she is loved......and that you are looking for a new vet.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

littlefluffbabies said:


> I can't help but be a little angry with that vet for insisting that your little pebbles spend 2 nights there unsupervised!! What good does a camera do if she needs someone to attend to her immediately?! I'm so glad that little pebbles is home with you where she is loved......and that you are looking for a new vet.


I know I feel gutted about it because I simply assumed they would have someone there. She's so so quiet that I can't help but worry about her still, maybe its just the meds but she's normally so 'expressive' (lol). I just wish she would give me one grunt, bark or high pitched yawn. 

The Vet also did something else that bothered me. Pebbles had all of her shots and then she had a titer test by our holistic Vet who's very good but doesn't do surgery. This doctor decided to override us and give her those shots anyway. I'm more upset that he tagged that on to her surgery instead of talking to me about it first. Today when I explained to him that we have a contractual agreement with the breeder in which we all agree not to over-vaccinate the dog, that I am not anti-vaccines but do not wish to give her unnecessary vaccinations he claimed that neither she nor I were Vets. Can you imagine? He was so rude I just had to get out of there, I was stressed out enough as it was already and I just wanted to get Peb's back home. I feel like I failed as an advocate. 

@Maltshoppe

Yeah I was looking through her clothes but I don't have a onsie, so I'll take one of my own tshirts and follow your advice. She hates the cone as you can well imagine. I will check with Snowbody but if the Vet isn't accessible then I will check with our holistic Vet to see if he can recommend someone.


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## Bailey&Me (Mar 8, 2010)

Sandybaby said:


> I know I feel gutted about it because I simply assumed they would have someone there. She's so so quiet that I can't help but worry about her still, maybe its just the meds but she's normally so 'expressive' (lol). I just wish she would give me one grunt, bark or high pitched yawn.
> 
> The Vet also did something else that bothered me. Pebbles had all of her shots and then she had a titer test by our holistic Vet who's very good but doesn't do surgery. This doctor decided to override us and give her those shots anyway. I'm more upset that he tagged that on to her surgery instead of talking to me about it first. Today when I explained to him that we have a contractual agreement with the breeder in which we all agree not to over-vaccinate the dog, that I am not anti-vaccines but do not wish to give her unnecessary vaccinations he claimed that neither she nor I were Vets. Can you imagine? He was so rude I just had to get out of there, I was stressed out enough as it was already and I just wanted to get Peb's back home. I feel like I failed as an advocate.
> 
> ...



Oh I am so sorry this happened to you. I would be livid with this vet. Insisting that she must be kept there overnight WITHOUT supervision is bad enough but to give her shots on top of that without your permission!!?? I didn't even know they were "allowed" to do that. I'd even be very annoyed that they cut her hair without your permission. Why was it necessary to cut the hair on her face!? The last straw was the rude response saying that neither you or the breeder are vets. True but she is YOUR dog and ultimately it is your right to make all decisions regarding her care. Oh boy I am getting so mad thinking about it...I definitely agree that a new vet is in order! 

With that said, I would not worry too much about Pebbles acting a little differently at this point. She just got home...give her a little time and she will be back to normal! Emma took four days after her spay and by the end of the fourth day she was bouncing around like nothing ever happened. Don't worry, Pebbles will be just fine! And yes, a baby onsie helped us too! I ended up not using a cone at all.


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## wkomorow (Aug 26, 2011)

pebbles will be quiet for a while. Medication can really take it out of them. Don't be surprised if she has a tummy issue also for a couple of days. Luck had diarrhea when he was on pain meds.


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

They gave shots without permission? I would be tempted to file a complaint with your states department of professional regulation. Vets are not supposed to do anything without your permission.


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## Bailey&Me (Mar 8, 2010)

maggieh said:


> They gave shots without permission? I would be tempted to file a complaint with your states department of professional regulation. Vets are not supposed to do anything without your permission.



Agreed!!! I would definitely be filing a complaint! This is absolutely unacceptable. Which shots did they give her?


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

maggieh said:


> They gave shots without permission? I would be tempted to file a complaint with your states department of professional regulation. Vets are not supposed to do anything without your permission.



Absolutely agree with that. Everything about this experience is awful but giving shots without your consent is unacceptable.


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## littlefluffbabies (Apr 17, 2013)

maggieh said:


> They gave shots without permission? I would be tempted to file a complaint with your states department of professional regulation. Vets are not supposed to do anything without your permission.


I'm with everyone else on this!! I can't believe that any reputable vet would ever administer vaccines without consent, and what's worse give them when she is recovering from surgery?!?! I am angry and disgusted that your poor pebbles was put through this. Most vets won't even administer vaccines if a dog is under the weather. I would definitely call recovering from surgery as being under the weather.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Well from the invoice they gave her Rabies (2 yr canine) and DA2PP annual. When we first brought her in they had a record of ALL her shots including the titer report. What the vet claims is that he wasn't going to do the surgery without giving her the shots. He said that they do titer there as well but only after 3 years or something like that. He could have explained his reasons for wanting to give the shots either when I brought her in or later when he called to give the status report after her surgery but he didn't. It was obvious from my conversation with him that he wasn't on board with the titer no matter what he says. I also didn't like him saying we didn't have to return to Dr. Selma because they titer there; that's also where we would have gone for her next wellness check up when we would have to give her her shots. 

I thought of complaining but I really didn't know to whom I would complain. I didn't know there was a department of regulation for vets. Frankly the whole thing had become an ordeal that by the time he got through with me I was too stressed to be proactive, I just wanted to get home. What I do understand is that he showed very little respect for me and I would never trust him with my dog ever again. 

Pebbles did give a jump and a cute series of bark this evening when a delivery man came to our door. She was so cute like her old self. Until that point I was wondering if they had cut out her tongue. She's sleepy of course and no she hasn't had a poop yet but she has passed urine. She drank a little and ate a little. I will find out on Monday about how to file a complaint. 

And as for heating pads. WHAT HEATING PADS? Why do they need to use a heating pad? Don't they have heat in these offices?


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

They gave her rabies and da2pp at the same time before the surgery? Is that correct? That's an absurd. I do hope you don't let this go. Give your sweet girl some extra love from us.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

Keeping an animal or a human warm after anesthesia is usually necessary. A good vet will use a water system where warm water flows around to keep them warm. They may also use blankets on top and around. One of our members vets used an electric heating pad that ended up burning her dear Maltese and causing the need for treatments afterwards. We urge most SM parents to check with their vets if they're going in for surgery that the water system be used.
In addition to reporting the vet, I would see if there's somewhere on the web where you can post reviews for the vet practice. People need to know.


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## Furbabies mom (Jul 25, 2011)

Boy oh boy, I would be really upset!! Shots given when not asked first, not one shot, but two!, shots given when having surgery which is serious enough, left unattended, and hair cut!! I sure would complain, and certainly be looking for another vet !! 

I'm glad that Pebbles is home now and beginning to act more like herself.


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## Kathleen (Aug 4, 2011)

I'm so glad she is home and okay. I bet that by tomorrow she will be back to her old self, happy and making you smile!

You have been through quite an ordeal. Maybe after you have a little time to recover you will consider reporting this vet to the state department of licensure.
Frankly, I am speechless that he would override your directions and give her shots without your knowledge or consent. How dare he? She is your dog.
To give shots when a dog is about to have surgery is awful.
If it were me, I would report him to the state and post lots of online reviews about him. Someone that arrogant who cares so little about a pet owners wishes needs to get in some trouble.
You could also consider contacting Jan Rasmusen, author of Scared Poopless, dods4dogs.com to see if she has any suggestions for you. I believe she is a member here.

Lots of love to little Pebbles. :wub: She sound a lot like my Daisy always happy and waggy, my sunshine girl. I had the same worries as you, that putting her through such an ordeal would change her. But it didn't. A couple of days later she was back to her old self, wagging up a storm as if it never happened.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

Yes Dominic they gave her those two shots. Kathleen you are right she is starting to show her old self but she's become guarded. Pebbles has always been a strong willed pup, much more so than Sandy but she's never shown signs of aggression. Well today we had to give her some after surgery medication called Metacam which is to be administered with a dropper. I have spent much time getting Pebbles used to having me approach her mouth, putting my finger in her mouth and using a tissue and toothpaste to clean her moth. She has learned to trust me. Today my mother tried to give her her meds and she growled at her. No matter, I decided to administer the meds myself. She covered her face, hid behind my mother's back, twisted and turned. It was difficult. Then finally when I tried to open her mouth she almost bit me. That was a first. Immediately afterwards she came and game me small little Pebble kisses to show me she didn't mean it. It really upset me, not because she almost bit me (she was defending her little self) but because it showed me she really had a hard time at the vet. I called the vets office and they called back. The first thing the doctor told me was that she was "a tough little thing". Indeed. He told me to use another vehicle like food (I injected the med into a pill pocket which she eventually ate) and then told me if she fights too much not to bother with the meds being that she's such a "tough cookie". It was all I needed to hear to know they manhandled her. Pebbles doesn't respond to that, she needs patience and a gentle hand.


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## Snowbody (Jan 3, 2009)

Sandybaby said:


> Yes Dominic they gave her those two shots. Kathleen you are right she is starting to show her old self but she's become guarded. Pebbles has always been a strong willed pup, much more so than Sandy but she's never shown signs of aggression. Well today we had to give her some after surgery medication called Metacam which is to be administered with a dropper. I have spent much time getting Pebbles used to having me approach her mouth, putting my finger in her mouth and using a tissue and toothpaste to clean her moth. She has learned to trust me. Today my mother tried to give her her meds and she growled at her. No matter, I decided to administer the meds myself. She covered her face, hid behind my mother's back, twisted and turned. It was difficult. Then finally when I tried to open her mouth she almost bit me. That was a first. Immediately afterwards she came and game me small little Pebble kisses to show me she didn't mean it. It really upset me, not because she almost bit me (she was defending her little self) but because it showed me she really had a hard time at the vet. I called the vets office and they called back. The first thing the doctor told me was that she was "a tough little thing". Indeed. He told me to use another vehicle like food (I injected the med into a pill pocket which she eventually ate) and then told me if she fights too much not to bother with the meds being that she's such a "tough cookie". It was all I needed to hear to know they manhandled her. Pebbles doesn't respond to that, she needs patience and a gentle hand.


Oh gosh, Michelle. It gets worse.  I'm so sorry. She will come around. I know that your love will bring her around. It's such a shame and totally unnecessary -- all the things they did. Please when you get things under control, report them and scream it from the rafters. You don't want another pet and another family to go through what you have. My vet never gives two major shots at the same time...she spaces them out over weeks and I'm only charged for the shot, not another visit.


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

Wow just wow. I'm so sorry you're going thru this. When Dominic used to be hard to give medication I found out that wrapping him on a blanket like a little burrito helped a lot. Than instead of trying to open up his mouth I just pull the side of the mouth away and inject the medicine right there. Hope it helps.


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## Ann Mother (Dec 18, 2013)

How hard for you and your dog😁. Put a review on Yelp also. I always use pill pockets for meds also.


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## maggieh (Dec 16, 2007)

Your poor baby! Also remember that the pain meds they give them sometimes have side effects such as temporary personality changes. Once she's been off all meds for a few days and is back in your loving hands she will come around.

I would suggest finding a new vet. And make the first visit a meet and greet where she gets nothing but love and treats (healthy ones that you bring) from everyone in the vets office. That way the vets office becomes a good experience instead of the nightmare they just put her through,


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## lydiatug (Feb 21, 2012)

I'm so glad your baby is home from that horrible experience. I'm so sorry you and Pebbles had to go thru this ordeal 

PLEASE follow up on this vet, this is completely unacceptable!!! I would be putting everything out there I possibly could as well as reporting him. To have a dog's immune system in overdrive while it's already working overtime to heal is idiotic to say the least!!!

Metacam for small dogs should be administered directly to food anyway. They don't normally mind it, just be sure its a small enough amount of food that they get all the medicine."

http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Animal...edAnimalDrugProducts/DrugLabels/UCM050394.pdf

"For dogs less than 5 lbs (2.3 kg), Metacam Oral Suspension can be given using the dropper bottle: one drop for each pound of body weight for the 1.5 mg/mL concentration (two drops for each kilogram of body weight),* dropped directly onto the food.*


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## pippersmom (May 21, 2012)

I agree with Lydia about the Metacam. I was also told to give it with food because that makes it easier on the stomach or else it might cause nausea.


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## Sandybaby (Nov 6, 2013)

I will pursue this Vet because my dog, as well as those of others, deserves a lot better than the treatment we both received.

Pebbles is showing her old spunk. She still hasn't pooped but she's hungry and thirsty and wanting to play with Sandy in addition to showing me so much love. I couldn't imagine life without her wonderful energy and outstanding personality. Tomorrow I will start giving the Vet reviews and pursuing my complaint. For right now I'm just grateful she's her being bouncy and fun. 

@lydiatug

The Vet never once mentioned that we should giver her the meds with food when they gave me the drug, I only ended up giving her the drug in a pill pocket treat when she showed so much difficulty taking it with the dropper.


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## sherry (Jan 4, 2013)

Sandybaby said:


> I know I feel gutted about it because I simply assumed they would have someone there. She's so so quiet that I can't help but worry about her still, maybe its just the meds but she's normally so 'expressive' (lol). I just wish she would give me one grunt, bark or high pitched yawn.
> 
> The Vet also did something else that bothered me. Pebbles had all of her shots and then she had a titer test by our holistic Vet who's very good but doesn't do surgery. This doctor decided to override us and give her those shots anyway. I'm more upset that he tagged that on to her surgery instead of talking to me about it first. Today when I explained to him that we have a contractual agreement with the breeder in which we all agree not to over-vaccinate the dog, that I am not anti-vaccines but do not wish to give her unnecessary vaccinations he claimed that neither she nor I were Vets. Can you imagine? He was so rude I just had to get out of there, I was stressed out enough as it was already and I just wanted to get Peb's back home. I feel like I failed as an advocate.
> 
> ...


WOW! I am in shock that this vet gave shots without your consent! It was bad enough little Pebbles had to spend 2 nights there! You should totally complain to someone about this vet! So sorry this has happened to you and Pebbles!


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