# Feeding Raw



## fran (Dec 22, 2011)

I was wondering if anyone here feeds raw? Ellie has a very touchy tummy. I have an extremely over weight Cavachon. If anyone could give me advice on this. I have tried all kinds of food to help Saddie lose weight. She has hip displacia (?). She has trouble walking due to the weight. Ellie has trouble with runny poop with canned food.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

I'm fairly new to feeding raw. My 3 have been on raw now for a little over 3 months. I'm not sure it's what you're thinking for weight loss. Portion size was tricky for us and I had to play around quite a bit until I found the right size for all 3 of them. Raw tends to build muscle mass while reducing fat so it would be a great choice for your mixed breed girl with hip dysplasia. Also it is a great anti-inflammatory diet (when sticking with meats considered to be 'cold' in traditional Chinese herbal medicine) with no white potatoes which tend to aggravate arthritis and joint problems. Also since it is fewer ingredients that are not processed and used in their natural state, it tends to help those with sensitive tummies. Not necessarily something you can quickly and easily switch to though, especially for those suffering from IBS, IBD or colitis. I'm not sure what the genetic health concerns are for Cavaliers and Bichons but for your Maltese, you will want to run a full blood panel on before starting to make sure her liver is functioning normally. Then I would recommend running a simple liver panel on her approx. 3 months after she's been fully on the raw. 

Go slow in transitioning and you may even find adding canned pumpkin or sweet potato helpful in those first few months. One thing I've found (and both of my holisitic vets have confirmed this), when transitioning a dog that either has or has had any serious health issues (no matter how long ago), you may have a more pronounced and longer 'detox' period. Primal has a really nice 'Education' section that may be helpful to you.

Primal Pet Foods: Wholesome Raw Food for Dogs and Cats


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

I just started feeding Bailey Primal raw a week ago. He is prone to colitis/ IBS which my vet suspects may be caused by food intolerances. He's also had a lot of trouble with allergies / itching since he turned two. 

I have done BalanceIT homecooked and limited ingredient diets, but he still chews and scratches. I've done grain free for almost a year, but didn't realize that the potato in both those is still starch and may be the problem. I switched to raw to cut out the potato, but I am mixing it with Canine Caviar. Raw is very expensive and I calculated it would run about $140 a month to feed Bailey just Primal! I bought a 3 lb. bag of pheasant nuggets which was $34.11 with tax! Bailey is a larger Malt so that would only last him a little over a week! 

As Crystal said, I 'm not sure raw will help with weight loss. That is all about portion control just like it is for us. If she is overweight on what you currently feed her, you need to cut back on her portion size. I found green beans really helped keep Lady at a healthy weight. They are high in fiber and make them feel full. I overfed Lady when I first adopted her and she quickly became two pounds overweight. It doesn't sound like a lot, but on a little Maltese it is obese. She developed diabetes as a result and had to get insulin shots twice a day for the rest of her life.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Ladysmom said:


> I just started feeding Bailey Primal raw a week ago. He is prone to colitis/ IBS which my vet suspects may be caused by food intolerances. He's also had a lot of trouble with allergies / itching since he turned two.
> 
> I have done BalanceIT homecooked and limited ingredient diets, but he still chews and scratches. I've done grain free for almost a year, but didn't realize that the potato in both those is still starch and may be the problem. I switched to raw to cut out the potato, but I am mixing it with Canine Caviar. Raw is very expensive and I calculated it would run about $140 a month to feed Bailey just Primal! I bought a 3 lb. bag of pheasant nuggets which was $34.11 with tax! Bailey is a larger Malt so that would only last him a little over a week!
> 
> As Crystal said, I 'm not sure raw will help with weight loss. That is all about portion control just like it is for us. If she is overweight on what you currently feed her, you need to cut back on her portion size. I found green beans really helped keep Lady at a healthy weight. They are high in fiber and make them feel full. I overfed Lady when I first adopted her and she quickly became two pounds overweight. It doesn't sound like a lot, but on a little Maltese it is obese. She developed diabetes as a result and had to get insulin shots twice a day for the rest of her life.


Wowza Marj....your Bailey is eating almost as much as my 3 put together. Zoe's bigger but she's also a senior. I'm feeding her 4 oz. a day. Jett is getting 3 oz. a day. Callie is getting between 2-3 oz a day. Normally it's just 2 but every so often I need to give her a little more to keep her weight up.

I don't know what Bailey's food sensitivities or intolerance's are, but for his issues it would be best to keep him on what is considered a cold food according to Traditional Chinese Herbal Medicine. You could do the duck, turkey/sardine or rabbit. Beef is considered neutral but I know too many Maltese that don't do well on beef. I think it's maybe too rich for them. You could also look into Stella and Chewy's since their rabbit is so much lower in price than Primal's. Their Surf N Turf isn't nearly as fishy smelling as Primal's Turkey/Sardine.

Oh btw...it's a better buy to get the big bag with the 8 oz. patties. I know the nuggets are easier but it's really not a big deal to have 1-3 of the 8 oz patties on a plate in the fridge to defrost. The top one defrosts first and the bottom ones stay more frozen longer. Zoe get's 1/4 patty per meal so she herself would eat a whole patty in 2 days time.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

My vet recommended a novel protein and those are the most expensive, unfortunately. I am staying away from the beef and chicken because they are so common plus they have yams and I am trying to cut out the starch.

Bailey weighs over 11 lbs so I rounded it up to 12. He is solid muscle, too, not fat, so he needs the maintenance portion. When I used the Primal feeding calculator I had it show me the average and it calculated slightly over two nuggets a meal. I was shocked to see that with the pheasant formula he needs three nuggets a day!

My local boutique is pretty pricey, too. I found the pheasant formula online for considerably less, but since it's frozen I have to buy it locally. Pheasant isn't even the most expensive of the four formulas I have to rotate through! I can't imagine what she charges for the venison!

How do the patties work for a small dog? I thought about ordering those, but Bailey wouldn't eat a whole patty a day. I thought for food safety reasons, Primal said it should only stay defrosted for 6-12 hours before feeding.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Ladysmom said:


> My vet recommended a novel protein and those are the most expensive, unfortunately. I am staying away from the beef and chicken because they are so common plus they have yams and I am trying to cut out the starch.
> 
> Bailey weighs over 11 lbs so I rounded it up to 12. He is solid muscle, too, not fat, so he needs the maintenance portion. When I used the Primal feeding calculator I had it show me the average and it calculated slightly over two nuggets a meal. I was shocked to see that with the pheasant formula he needs three nuggets a day!
> 
> ...


I've talked to the Primal rep at length so that I could be trained to help my customers better. It can stay in the fridge unfrozen for 2 days. So I usually put 1 - 8 oz patty in the fridge at night so it's thawed by morning. Bailey would eat half of it that day and the other half the next day. Sometimes the patties stick together so I will often have 2-3 of them stacked on top of each other in the fridge to defrost. But having them on top of each other slows the thawing process on the bottom ones so they don't actually defrost all the way for several days.

There is truly very little mark up on food and when small stores can't buy in large bulk quantities that so many of these on line places can, it seems that someone may be charging more than they should. But if I had to depend on food sales alone, I wouldn't make it since the mark up is so low.

Try the duck or rabbit next. Both of those are novel proteins and considered cold. Same as the Turkey/Sardine. But it does smell like sardines. Just warning you. lol If your local boutique carries Stella and Chewy's, try their rabbit. It's less expensive.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> I've talked to the Primal rep at length so that I could be trained to help my customers better. It can stay in the fridge unfrozen for 2 days. So I usually put 1 - 8 oz patty in the fridge at night so it's thawed by morning. Bailey would eat half of it that day and the other half the next day. Sometimes the patties stick together so I will often have 2-3 of them stacked on top of each other in the fridge to defrost. But having them on top of each other slows the thawing process on the bottom ones so they don't actually defrost all the way for several days.
> 
> There is truly very little mark up on food and when small stores can't buy in large bulk quantities that so many of these on line places can, it seems that someone may be charging more than they should. But if I had to depend on food sales alone, I wouldn't make it since the mark up is so low.
> 
> Try the duck or rabbit next. Both of those are novel proteins and considered cold. Same as the Turkey/Sardine. But it does smell like sardines. Just warning you. lol If your local boutique carries Stella and Chewy's, try their rabbit. It's less expensive.


Thanks, Crystal! The 5 lb. bag of patties was "only" $12 more than the 3 lb.nuggets.

I have been so worried about the 12 hour max for defrosting I have been waiting until right before bed to take the nugget for breakfast out. I figured it was just a matter of time before I forgot and Bailey had no breakfast!

The duck formula has yams so I was going to stay away from that one. The four potato free ones are rabbit, pheasant, venison and turkey/sardines.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Ladysmom said:


> Thanks, Crystal! The 5 lb. bag of patties was "only" $12 more than the 3 lb.nuggets.
> 
> I have been so worried about the 12 hour max for defrosting I have been waiting until right before bed to take the nugget for breakfast out. I figured it was just a matter of time before I forgot and Bailey had no breakfast!
> 
> The duck formula has yams so I was going to stay away from that one. The four potato free ones are rabbit, pheasant, venison and turkey/sardines.


If you ever forget, you can do a really pretty quick defrost by putting one in a zip lock sandwich bag and letting it set in warm water in the sink. May still be a bit frozen on the inside but defrosted enough you can easily cut it up into whatever size pieces you need. :thumbsup:

You may want to check out Stella & Chewy's then. They don't use sweet potatoes. Organic squash & pumpkin seeds, but no sweet potato. I also am looking at OC Raw for their Goat and Turkey formulas. Also 'cold' foods. No sweet potato in those either.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> If you ever forget, you can do a really pretty quick defrost by putting one in a zip lock sandwich bag and letting it set in warm water in the sink. May still be a bit frozen on the inside but defrosted enough you can easily cut it up into whatever size pieces you need. :thumbsup:
> 
> You may want to check out Stella & Chewy's then. They don't use sweet potatoes. Organic squash & pumpkin seeds, but no sweet potato. I also am looking at OC Raw for their Goat and Turkey formulas. Also 'cold' foods. No sweet potato in those either.


Thanks for the help!

What is "OC"? I am not familiar with it. The shop owner said she could order anything I wanted.


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## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

If your mix has not had a complete thyroid panel done recently, you need to talk to your vet about doing this. Both breeds are VERY prone to thyroid dysfunction.


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> If you ever forget, you can do a really pretty quick defrost by putting one in a zip lock sandwich bag and letting it set in warm water in the sink. May still be a bit frozen on the inside but defrosted enough you can easily cut it up into whatever size pieces you need. :thumbsup:
> 
> You may want to check out Stella & Chewy's then. *They don't use sweet potatoes. Organic squash & pumpkin seeds, but no sweet potato.* I also am looking at OC Raw for their Goat and Turkey formulas. Also 'cold' foods. No sweet potato in those either.


Hmmm, after i read this i went back and read the ingredients again...i stopped feeding Stella and Chewy's because i could have sworn it had sweet potatoes...i guess it's time to get my eyes checked again! :embarrassed: Sorry for the misinformation Marj when you were asking me about frozen raw.



Ladysmom said:


> Thanks for the help!
> 
> What is "OC"? I am not familiar with it. The shop owner said she could order anything I wanted.


Marj here's a link to OC frozen raw Welcome to OC RAW DOG! With the frozen raw i go by how their weight is. When i was feeding Stella and Chewy's everyone but Riley got 1 nugget/pattie each meal, with Riley i had to give 1 1/2 per meal and he weighs 6 lbs, but he was losing too much weight...the same with Primal i have to usually feed him more than what feeding guide suggests.


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

mysugarbears said:


> Hmmm, after i read this i went back and read the ingredients again...i stopped feeding Stella and Chewy's because i could have sworn it had sweet potatoes...i guess it's time to get my eyes checked again! :embarrassed: Sorry for the misinformation Marj when you were asking me about frozen raw.
> 
> 
> 
> Marj here's a link to OC frozen raw Welcome to OC RAW DOG! With the frozen raw i go by how their weight is. When i was feeding Stella and Chewy's everyone but Riley got 1 nugget/pattie each meal, with Riley i had to give 1 1/2 per meal and he weighs 6 lbs, but he was losing too much weight...the same with Primal i have to usually feed him more than what feeding guide suggests.


Thanks again, Debbie. You have been so helpful to me with this transition to raw!


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## Bailey&Me (Mar 8, 2010)

I also feed mine frozen raw most of the time, but rotate through some dehydrated raw as well. For Bailey, I have been giving him Primal for a couple of years and he loves it and does really well on it. With Emma, I've mostly had her on dehydrated raw (Addiction) but started mixing in a bit of Primal frozen raw a month or two ago and she was loving it. I recently got a bag of Stella and Chewy's Duck Duck Goose frozen raw and Emma hasn't been liking it as much (Bailey will eat anything!) so I will be going back to Primal soon. I got the big patties of S&C and honestly I'd rather pay more and get the nuggets - but that's just because I get easily grossed out by raw meat and having to cut up the patties makes me gag. I'd rather just dump out the nuggets in their bowls and be done with it! haha! I am waiting and watching to see how Emma does on the raw - she is a tiny little thing so I think I will probably end up mixing her raw up with some veggies to bring down the protein a bit.


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## Bailey&Me (Mar 8, 2010)

Ladysmom said:


> I just started feeding Bailey Primal raw a week ago. He is prone to colitis/ IBS which my vet suspects may be caused by food intolerances. He's also had a lot of trouble with allergies / itching since he turned two.
> 
> I have done BalanceIT homecooked and limited ingredient diets, but he still chews and scratches. I've done grain free for almost a year, but didn't realize that the potato in both those is still starch and may be the problem. *I switched to raw to cut out the potato, but I am mixing it with Canine Caviar. *Raw is very expensive and I calculated it would run about $140 a month to feed Bailey just Primal! I bought a 3 lb. bag of pheasant nuggets which was $34.11 with tax! Bailey is a larger Malt so that would only last him a little over a week!
> 
> As Crystal said, I 'm not sure raw will help with weight loss. That is all about portion control just like it is for us. If she is overweight on what you currently feed her, you need to cut back on her portion size. I found green beans really helped keep Lady at a healthy weight. They are high in fiber and make them feel full. I overfed Lady when I first adopted her and she quickly became two pounds overweight. It doesn't sound like a lot, but on a little Maltese it is obese. She developed diabetes as a result and had to get insulin shots twice a day for the rest of her life.


Hey Marj, I may be wrong...but I could have sworn that I read somewhere that you shouldn't mix raw with kibble because they are processed differently by the dog's digestive system and can cause issues if fed together. Maybe you mean that you feed one meal of kibble and then another meal of raw...which I think is still fine, as long as you're not literally mixing the two up. Maybe Crystal or Debbie have more info on this?


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Bailey&Me said:


> Hey Marj, I may be wrong...but I could have sworn that I read somewhere that you shouldn't mix raw with kibble because they are processed differently by the dog's digestive system and can cause issues if fed together. Maybe you mean that you feed one meal of kibble and then another meal of raw...which I think is still fine, as long as you're not literally mixing the two up. Maybe Crystal or Debbie have more info on this?


Should be totally ok for dogs that have a healthy digestive system. I've got quite a few customers with large breed dogs that the only way they can swing the benefits of raw financially is by mixing it together with the kibble. But I do recommend doing only raw for at least a minimum of 3 months for those suffering from IBS, IBD or colitis. I don't recommend kibble at all but only soft foods for dogs suffering with those types of digestive issues.


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

My boys eat raw food. They are on either Stella & Chewys freeze dried or SmallBatches frozen patties that I mix it in with Dr. Harvey's veg to bowl, pumpkins or sweet potatoes. I have tried other brands but these are the ones they love it and works great for them, plus they like all the flavors. 

Dominic is eating raw since he was 3 months old and Benjamin since he was 5. Both have great hair and are full of energy! I do introduce them to other foods like FreshPet though (they love the turkey rolls) just for a change. 

Edit to add - thawing food in warm water is not recommended as bacteria grows once the food reaches 40 degrees. You better off using the defrost option on your microwave (I don't as I avoid using microwave at all but I would if I had no option). 

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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Dominic said:


> My boys eat raw food. They are on either Stella & Chewys freeze dried or SmallBatches frozen patties that I mix it in with Dr. Harvey's veg to bowl, pumpkins or sweet potatoes. I have tried other brands but these are the ones they love it and works great for them, plus they like all the flavors.
> 
> Dominic is eating raw since he was 3 months old and Benjamin since he was 5. Both have great hair and are full of energy! I do introduce them to other foods like FreshPet though (they love the turkey rolls) just for a change.
> 
> ...


Actually, defrosting in the microwave is not recommended at all by any of the raw food companies. Microwaves cause the fat molecules to radically change, making fats less digestible, and ultimately they can become harmful to your pet's long-term health. What they recommend is defrosting just enough in a zip lock baggy in cool water for that meal only. Don't do it for any future meals. That takes approx. 30 minutes. I've forgotten twice now to have patties in the fridge to defrost and don't have 30 minutes to thaw food in the morning so I use warm (not hot) water to speed the thawing process up. It's not the best way since it can potentially cook the food and reduce the natural enzymes as well as deplete the nutritional values (the reason for going raw). Not something you want to do for every feeding, but ok on those rare occasions that you forget. :thumbsup:

Feeding, Transition and Safety for Raw Dog Food Diets

Oh...meant to add that I don't thaw them completely that way. Just so they're soft enough to be able to cut into correct sized portions. Then I finish thawing their portion of the that meal by continuing to break it up and and mash it around with a spoon.


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> Actually, defrosting in the microwave is not recommended at all by any of the raw food companies. Microwaves cause the fat molecules to radically change, making fats less digestible, and ultimately they can become harmful to your pet's long-term health. What they recommend is defrosting just enough in a zip lock baggy in cool water for that meal only. Don't do it for any future meals. That takes approx. 30 minutes. I've forgotten twice now to have patties in the fridge to defrost and don't have 30 minutes to thaw food in the morning so I use warm (not hot) water to speed the thawing process up. It's not the best way since it can potentially cook the food and reduce the natural enzymes as well as deplete the nutritional values (the reason for going raw). Not something you want to do for every feeding, but ok on those rare occasions that you forget. :thumbsup:
> 
> Feeding, Transition and Safety for Raw Dog Food Diets
> 
> Oh...meant to add that I don't thaw them completely that way. Just so they're soft enough to be able to cut into correct sized portions. Then I finish thawing their portion of the that meal by continuing to break it up and and mash it around with a spoon.


I disagree with you, Crystal. If you are feeding raw food do it right, thaw it in the refrigerator overnight to make sure you're not putting your dog at risk. I said I don't use microwave at all but it is safer than thawing food that will be fed raw in warm water. I did not say it was good. 

If you forget then wait 30 min to thaw it and don't forget it anymore, put an alarm on your calendar. 

You can read guidelines from FDA on it too. *I am sure with less words we can make a point across efficiently*. To wrap it up, you don't have to agree with me, but you know how many different people are reading this and the risk on feeding raw if done wrong .


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> Actually, defrosting in the microwave is not recommended at all by any of the raw food companies. Microwaves cause the fat molecules to radically change, making fats less digestible, and ultimately they can become harmful to your pet's long-term health. What they recommend is defrosting just enough in a zip lock baggy in cool water for that meal only. Don't do it for any future meals. That takes approx. 30 minutes. I've forgotten twice now to have patties in the fridge to defrost and don't have 30 minutes to thaw food in the morning so I use warm (not hot) water to speed the thawing process up. It's not the best way since it can potentially cook the food and reduce the natural enzymes as well as deplete the nutritional values (the reason for going raw). Not something you want to do for every feeding, but ok on those rare occasions that you forget. :thumbsup:
> 
> Feeding, Transition and Safety for Raw Dog Food Diets
> 
> Oh...meant to add that I don't thaw them completely that way. Just so they're soft enough to be able to cut into correct sized portions. Then I finish thawing their portion of the that meal by continuing to break it up and and mash it around with a spoon.


Great minds think alike! I was just about to post that link to the Primal website where it said never to microwave pet food and to use the ziplock bag method you suggested earlier.

I will just hope I never forget to defrost it in the refrigerator, but if I do I will follow Primal's guidelines.

Interestingly, when I homecooked with BalanceIT they had the same guidelines. You were never supposed to defrost it in the microwave if you made it up in large batches and froze it. Their recipes were cooked, but the microwave would alter the BalanceIT supplement.


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## hoaloha (Jan 27, 2012)

Ladysmom said:


> Great minds think alike! I was just about to post that link to the Primal website where it said never to microwave pet food and to use the ziplock bag method you suggested earlier.
> 
> I will just hope I never forget to defrost it in the refrigerator, but if I do I will follow Primal's guidelines.
> 
> Interestingly, when I homecooked with BalanceIT they had the same guidelines. You were never supposed to defrost it in the microwave if you made it up in large batches and froze it. Their recipes were cooked, but the microwave would alter the BalanceIT supplement.


I can't give any input since I don't feed frozen raw anymore since Obi didn't like the texture and temperature. I did want to comment on BalanceIt homecooked though- I have been feeding this as a main staple and my dogs love it! I make a huge batch that I separate into single servings in ziplocks. I write on the bags- the date, caloric content, and how many scoops of BalanceIt needed. 

For best results, and as recommended by the company and vet that I talked to when I called them, the supplement should be added JUST before serving. So, I take the single portion, re-warm it for 15 seconds (because my dogs don't prefer cold temp food), then add the BalanceIt supplement and serve. I freeze the batches without the supplement in it.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

Dominic said:


> I disagree with you, Crystal. If you are feeding raw food do it right, thaw it in the refrigerator overnight to make sure you're not putting your dog at risk. I said I don't use microwave at all but it is safer than thawing food that will be fed raw in warm water. I did not say it was good.
> 
> If you forget then wait 30 min to thaw it and don't forget it anymore, put an alarm on your calendar.
> 
> You can read guidelines from FDA on it too. *I am sure with less words we can make a point across efficiently*. To wrap it up, you don't have to agree with me, but you know how many different people are reading this and the risk on feeding raw if done wrong .


Aw it's ok to have differing opinions. In fact I think it's good to have differing opinions and points of view so that it does make people question and then do the research themselves to come to their own informed decisions. In fact, your strong opinion is now prompting me to double check with both of my vets that encourage raw feeding. I did speak again to the Primal rep who is a vet tech. She told me that quick defrosting a single serving this way is correct and safe.

Not sure what you mean by the less words statement but am choosing to not take offense by it, or your statement about not forgetting again. I'm human and work too many hours plus caring for my mom. So forgetting twice in a little over 3 months is pretty good imo. :blush:


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## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

hoaloha said:


> I can't give any input since I don't feed frozen raw anymore since Obi didn't like the texture and temperature. I did want to comment on BalanceIt homecooked though- I have been feeding this as a main staple and my dogs love it! I make a huge batch that I separate into single servings in ziplocks. I write on the bags- the date, caloric content, and how many scoops of BalanceIt needed.
> 
> For best results, and as recommended by the company and vet that I talked to when I called them, the supplement should be added JUST before serving. So, I take the single portion, re-warm it for 15 seconds (because my dogs don't prefer cold temp food), then add the BalanceIt supplement and serve. I freeze the batches without the supplement in it.
> 
> ...


I love BalanceIT! Unfortunately Bailey has had some food allergy /intolerance issues since he turned two. He needs grain and potato free food with a novel protein now. BalanceIT recipes use either grains or potatoes plus they don't have any that call for pheasant or venison. LOL! Not sure where I'd find it even if they did!


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## Dominic (Nov 4, 2012)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> Aw it's ok to have differing opinions. In fact I think it's good to have differing opinions and points of view so that it does make people question and then do the research themselves to come to their own informed decisions. In fact, your strong opinion is now prompting me to double check with both of my vets that encourage raw feeding. I did speak again to the Primal rep who is a vet tech. She told me that quick defrosting a single serving this way is correct and safe.
> 
> Not sure what you mean by the less words statement but am choosing to not take offense by it, or your statement about not forgetting again. I'm human and work too many hours plus caring for my mom. So forgetting twice in a little over 3 months is pretty good imo. :blush:


I don't mean to offend you at all, I appreciate your knowledgment and I apologize if it came out in a wrong way. What I worry when we have long wordy information is the fact that someone can just do a quick fast reading, get partial information and go for it. 

What I mean on not forgetting it again goes for all of us, trust me I forgot it many times until I get on a routine (move it to the refrigerator right after eating dinner) or I give them S&C dehydrate instead.

I may add that I do no use microwave nor I do think it is a good option and I know it changes the food, that is why I don't use it but as for a one time thing it is safer than thawing in warm water. My vet also said the same, defrost it one at the time.

Dominic is eating this way it's been an year and I'll tell you, my dogs never got sick, no throwing up, no diarrhea and that itself makes me happy!


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## mysugarbears (Aug 13, 2007)

What has helped me to remember to put the next days food in the fridge is that i divide the bag of food into containers and each container contains enough for one day, when i feed their dinner or you could do it when feeding their breakfast, i pull a container out of the freezer and put in the fridge. I do much better now, before i would sometimes forget and had to use the backup food.


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## RileyDC (Apr 20, 2011)

I have been feeding Riley raw now since mid-November.

I have a glass container that I put 1-days worth in to thaw... while he is eating his dinner, I wash and dry the container and put the next days worth in it and put it in the fridge... He has been eating Stella & Chewy's for the past week. I just bought a bag, today, of the freeze-dried Stella & Chewy's for our upcoming travels


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## cush123 (Nov 26, 2013)

Crystal&Zoe said:


> I'm fairly new to feeding raw. My 3 have been on raw now for a little over 3 months. I'm not sure it's what you're thinking for weight loss. Portion size was tricky for us and I had to play around quite a bit until I found the right size for all 3 of them. Raw tends to build muscle mass while reducing fat so it would be a great choice for your mixed breed girl with hip dysplasia. Also it is a great anti-inflammatory diet (when sticking with meats considered to be 'cold' in traditional Chinese herbal medicine) with no white potatoes which tend to aggravate arthritis and joint problems. Also since it is fewer ingredients that are not processed and used in their natural state, it tends to help those with sensitive tummies. Not necessarily something you can quickly and easily switch to though, especially for those suffering from IBS, IBD or colitis. I'm not sure what the genetic health concerns are for Cavaliers and Bichons but for your Maltese, you will want to run a full blood panel on before starting to make sure her liver is functioning normally. Then I would recommend running a simple liver panel on her approx. 3 months after she's been fully on the raw.
> 
> Go slow in transitioning and you may even find adding canned pumpkin or sweet potato helpful in those first few months. One thing I've found (and both of my holisitic vets have confirmed this), when transitioning a dog that either has or has had any serious health issues (no matter how long ago), you may have a more pronounced and longer 'detox' period. Primal has a really nice 'Education' section that may be helpful to you.
> 
> Primal Pet Foods: Wholesome Raw Food for Dogs and Cats


You know I think that a raw diet is really the best for dogs, but a lot of people say it will give the dog worms. I disagree, but when I tried to feed Max and my Bichon a raw diet it made my Bichon vomit. Max, my Maltese will eat anything.....but is there any truth to the raw diet giving them worms? I don't feed them dog food I only do real meat that I cook lightly so that it is still pink, chicken, turkey and beef with fresh veg. And sometimes pumpkin or sweet potatoes and brown rice. The only dog food I liked was grandma Lucy or honest kitchen.


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## shellbeme (Mar 1, 2011)

Hopefully Crystal will speak up about raw diets as well, I believe she feeds her pups raw and she has a wealth of knowledge about it.

Here is my take on raw. Will it give your dog worms? I certainly hope not, you'd have to be feeding some pretty nasty stuff for that to happen. There are raw feeders out there who source their meats from local farmers and such. If you want to go that route, I would highly suggest meeting with a veterinary nutritionist or a holistic vet with a background in nutrition to make sure your dog is getting everything it needs.

I do not believe throwing random meats at a dog is 100% balanced.

If you're going to purchase your foods from a human grocery store-remember how many antibiotics are pumped in to those animals that we eat. Also if you are purchasing from a human grocery store, remember that much of the meat is more than likely positive for things like samonella. Human meats, are intended to be cooked, so they aren't tested for this.

Some people don't care, but my dogs face gets close to my face and the thought of samonella all over his beard and what not is not something I am fond of. I just don't think it's smart to use grocery meat for raw feeding.

I do think raw feeding is excellent. I don't do it because my husband it adamately against it, just because he thinks it's gross, and he doesn't take nutrition as seriously as I do.

I prefer pre made raw diets, like Primal, and Stella and Chewys. These are balanced diets-you thaw what you need and feed.


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## cush123 (Nov 26, 2013)

shellbeme said:


> Hopefully Crystal will speak up about raw diets as well, I believe she feeds her pups raw and she has a wealth of knowledge about it.
> 
> Here is my take on raw. Will it give your dog worms? I certainly hope not, you'd have to be feeding some pretty nasty stuff for that to happen. There are raw feeders out there who source their meats from local farmers and such. If you want to go that route, I would highly suggest meeting with a veterinary nutritionist or a holistic vet with a background in nutrition to make sure your dog is getting everything it needs.
> 
> ...


Ok thanks. Great information. And I will try those you mentioned. I was like your husband too and looking at it in human form and thinking wow! Raw meat that's gross, but for dogs I think it's best, just my opinion. I never thought about the grocery store meat with the antibiotics and salmonella, so true thanks. Max's Mom Kim.


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## CrystalAndZoe (Jul 11, 2006)

cush123 said:


> You know I think that a raw diet is really the best for dogs, but a lot of people say it will give the dog worms. I disagree, but when I tried to feed Max and my Bichon a raw diet it made my Bichon vomit. Max, my Maltese will eat anything.....but is there any truth to the raw diet giving them worms? I don't feed them dog food I only do real meat that I cook lightly so that it is still pink, chicken, turkey and beef with fresh veg. And sometimes pumpkin or sweet potatoes and brown rice. The only dog food I liked was grandma Lucy or honest kitchen.


I think Shelly did a great job of explaining things. You may want to take just a few minutes to read this article from Dr. Karen Becker, especially the section titled, 'Other Raw Diet Concerns Put to Rest'.

The Biggest Myths About Raw Food


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## MalteseJane (Nov 21, 2004)

shellbeme said:


> Hopefully Crystal will speak up about raw diets as well, I believe she feeds her pups raw and she has a wealth of knowledge about it.
> 
> Here is my take on raw. Will it give your dog worms? I certainly hope not, you'd have to be feeding some pretty nasty stuff for that to happen. There are raw feeders out there who source their meats from local farmers and such. If you want to go that route, I would highly suggest meeting with a veterinary nutritionist or a holistic vet with a background in nutrition to make sure your dog is getting everything it needs.
> 
> ...


Now you have completely lost me. Are you a vegetarian ? If you are, you can get salmonella from vegetables too you know. If not, where do you buy your meat from ? I mean the meat that YOU are eating. If "much of the meat you are buying from a human grocery store tests positive for salmonella" (your words not mine), good grief half of the country would be sick with salmonella. I like my steaks cooked "Rare" (my husband says I want my steak alive) and I NEVER got salmonella poisoning. Just getting salmonella on your hands from contaminated meat could make you sick. A friend of mine and her daughter got sick from contaminated eggs in a dessert. Those were not raw eggs. Ha, I guess you will never eat steak tartare :HistericalSmiley:, by the way I don't, even tho I want my steaks rare. What makes you think that your Primal, Stella & Chewys are safe ? There is as much risk of salmonella in them than in the meat sold at human grocery stores. And there has been more recall of dog food than human food. I not even want to get in the thawing discussion. Better not.:smilie_tischkante:


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## MalteseJane (Nov 21, 2004)

cush123 said:


> You know I think that a raw diet is really the best for dogs, but a lot of people say it will give the dog worms. I disagree, but when I tried to feed Max and my Bichon a raw diet it made my Bichon vomit. Max, my Maltese will eat anything.....but is there any truth to the raw diet giving them worms? I don't feed them dog food I only do real meat that I cook lightly so that it is still pink, chicken, turkey and beef with fresh veg. And sometimes pumpkin or sweet potatoes and brown rice. The only dog food I liked was grandma Lucy or honest kitchen.


They are not going to get worms. But like your Bichon, my Alex did not want anything raw, meat or vegetables. He did not vomit, but did not eat it. So like you I cooked his steaks just a little bit on the outside, living the inside almost raw. Now with chicken, pork, veal or any other meat besides beef, I will cook it well done, for us and for Charlie. Charlie does not want raw vegetables or fruit.


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## lydiatug (Feb 21, 2012)

Well, I've been researching and looking for help here too. I've been cooking for Bayleigh (the allergy mess), and am now looking into the raw diet. Not pre-packaged though due to her allergies to flax, fish oil, and many others. We don't have any holistic vets left in the area, mine left town last year  Its time for a true elimination diet and I'm concerned that she gets proper nutrition along the way.

Can anyone recommend reliable resources for further research?


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