# Got a trainer



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

Bella is 7 months and she's getting out of control. I talked to a trainer today (vet recommended) and she's coming on Monday to re potty train and see how she's behaving with me. Lately, to get my attention, she'll bite/pinch my leg. I tell her "no" but she doesn't listen. She poops every where and pees now where ever she feels.

She's charging me $95 for one day and then if I want to continue it will be another $500. I don't have $500 right now but I'll save for it if it means chilling this doggie out


----------



## LexiAndNikkisMom (Apr 13, 2004)

> _Originally posted by mylittlebella_@Jan 10 2005, 04:56 PM
> *Lately, to get my attention, she'll bite/pinch my leg.  I tell her "no" but she doesn't listen.  <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=28845*


[/QUOTE]

Let me know what she says about that. Lexi does that too. She doesn't really bite, it is more of running her teeth across my arms and legs. I still say "OUCH!" and "NO!", doesn't work all the time. If she keeps doing it she gets a 5-10 minutes time out.


----------



## Toby's Mom (May 7, 2004)




----------



## Sylphide and Shrek's Mom (Dec 4, 2004)

I don't know whether you need to pay $500 to get her trained. Have you tried obedience and agility classes? They cost less than $100 for 6-8 weeks---I found a club with a wonderful trainer who trains and owns small breeds...

Sylphide was a maniac at that age. She's can still be really hyper and bossy, but is very obedient now. I took her to agility classes, which she LOVED, and they really helped focus her energy and make her more obedient. We'll continue with agility in the Spring.


----------



## dr.jaimie (Mar 23, 2004)

does this trainer have a gaurantee? we have a local trainer here that will train the dog for a price then if after that the dog isnt trained..he will come back and work with the animal again...he commits to ur animal for life.


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

If when she bites at your leg you say "ouch" or "no" then she has gotten your attention, which is what she wants. Just ignore her and I bet she will stop. Catcher used to grab the bottom of my nightgown or bite at my house shoes and I just kept walking and ignored him and he quit doing it.... just a thought....


----------



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

Lexi's mom...Bella does the same thing. It's not biting but running her teeth. 

She's not being aggresive at all its just to get my attention. She did just get spayed but she was doing this before. She was trained and she knows to go on the wee wee pads but it's like she does it on purpose to get my attention. For example, today I came home for lunch and I was in the kitchen making a sandwich. When I went to the dining table, and there was Bella waiting for me right next to her pee. As soon as she saw me she ran under the table. It's like a game to her. She knows she's in trouble but she likes being in trouble for the attention.

I hope this lady can tell me what I'm doing wrong so this little girl can start listening. Ill keep you posted and let you know what she says.


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Before you spend the $500, interview this trainer carefully. With Maltese, the best methods are positive, motivational ones. You can actually train a dog without punishment can get wonderful results. That doesn't mean you permit them to get away with anything, just that you ask them for an alternative instead of saying no. If she is using a clicker, that is fantastic. $95 for an in home consult is reasonable. I'd want to know exactly what the $500 includes. 

After your consult with her, depending on what she says, I would find an obedience class with positive methods. That trainer should be able to help you outside of class for a nominal fee and the class itself is usually 6-8 weeks for around $100. The class is actually really important as you will learn a lot about how to interact with your dog by watching the others. 

Congratulations for seeking help now! Little dogs are terribly manipulative and it lands them in rescue because many owners are not as committed to getting professional help like you are! Reaching out shows what a wonderful owner you are!


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> _Originally posted by mylittlebella_@Jan 10 2005, 07:25 PM
> *For example, today I came home for lunch and I was in the kitchen making a sandwich.  When I went to the dining table, and there was Bella waiting for me right next to her pee.  As soon as she saw me she ran under the table.  It's like a game to her.  She knows she's in trouble but she likes being in trouble for the attention.*


That is probably why the "experts" always say to ignore them if they have "gone" where they aren't supposed to and you don't actually see them do it. They say to not do anything at that point and to not let the dog see you clean it up. Why not try that for a while... when she does something to get your attention, do the opposite and ignore her... believe me... ignoring her will get HER attention and she'll quit the bad behavior. It works for me.....


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

Better yet, leash her to you so she can't do it in the first place!


----------



## kodie (Aug 24, 2004)

> _Originally posted by JMM_@Jan 10 2005, 07:41 PM
> *Congratulations for seeking help now! Little dogs are terribly manipulative and it lands them in rescue because many owners are not as committed to getting professional help like you are! Reaching out shows what a wonderful owner you are!
> <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=28874*


[/QUOTE]
ummm... I hope i'm not being a BLIND mommy... haha.. how are maltese manipulative?? I wanna be aware of what Kodie is probably doing to me without me noticing it!!


----------



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

> _Originally posted by JMM_@Jan 10 2005, 08:41 PM
> *Before you spend the $500, interview this trainer carefully. With Maltese, the best methods are positive, motivational ones. You can actually train a dog without punishment can get wonderful results. That doesn't mean you permit them to get away with anything, just that you ask them for an alternative instead of saying no. If she is using a clicker, that is fantastic. $95 for an in home consult is reasonable. I'd want to know exactly what the $500 includes.
> 
> After your consult with her, depending on what she says, I would find an obedience class with positive methods. That trainer should be able to help you outside of class for a nominal fee and the class itself is usually 6-8 weeks for around $100. The class is actually really important as you will learn a lot about how to interact with your dog by watching the others.
> ...


[/QUOTE]

Thanks for your comments...I really appreciate the information you gave me. I am going to try her for the one day training. She said she will re train Bella to potty and me how to keep training her. She will also address the issue of her pinching me to get my attention. She was highly recommended by my vet so I'm going to try the $95 first. I will look into the classes since I don't have $500.

I would never get rid of Bella but I can see how some people just loose control of their dog and don't get help and end up at the shelter. I love her too much and if I have to find the $500 I will but I will definitely try to find a cheaper class. Again, I appreciate all of you guys' comments.









BTW...I already ignore her but that's not working either...I'm telling you, she's totally out of control. :new_Eyecrazy:


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

> _Originally posted by Kodie_@Jan 11 2005, 09:03 AM
> *ummm... I hope i'm not being a BLIND mommy... haha.. how are maltese manipulative??  I wanna be aware of what Kodie is probably doing to me without me noticing it!!
> 
> 
> ...


[/QUOTE]


Does your dog dictate to you when he gets on and off furniture? Does he dictate when you pick him up and pet him (demand it)? Does he listen when you ask him to do something, including stopping a behavior you don't like? Toy breeds are notorious for having their owners wrapped around their paws. I love my dogs, but we have rules in this house and all dogs, regardless of size, have to follow them. Many people with toy dogs let them get away with so many things that they would never let a 50 lb dog do. My Maltese must be as well behaved as the 90 lb petite Great Dane. This means obedience classes right from puppyhood, the same training and rules apply that I would use on a large dog, etc. 

Yes, I let my little ones jump on me, but I also let the Border Collies do it...we all have some things we don't mind. All of the dogs, however, get off when I ask.


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

> _Originally posted by mylittlebella_@Jan 11 2005, 09:25 AM
> *Thanks for your comments...I really appreciate the information you gave me.  I am going to try her for the one day training.  She said she will re train Bella to potty and me how to keep training her.  She will also address the issue of her pinching me to get my attention.  She was highly recommended by my vet so I'm going to try the $95 first.  I will look into the classes since I don't have $500.
> 
> I would never get rid of Bella but I can see how some people just loose control of their dog and don't get help and end up at the shelter.  I love her too much and if I have to find the $500 I will but I will definitely try to find a cheaper class.  Again, I appreciate all of you guys' comments.
> ...


[/QUOTE]

$500 is a lot of money, I don't blame you. I think the private consult and class is a nice compromise. 

For now, until you see the trainer, when she is out of control like that just calmly place her in her crate (she can even have a treat for kenneling up). You getting frustrated won't help. Once you have the basics of attention exercises and a few commands down, it will be much easier. When Mikey was young, there were often times when I just had to put him up for 10 minutes and step away from the situation. I'd get frustrated and we would get nowhere. I would just say "Uh oh let's kennel up" in a happy voice. It wasn't a punishment, but I needed time to calm down and so did he.


----------



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

That's a good advice too, to put her in her play pen and not do it in a mad voice. I'll keep trying things until something works.


----------



## Brinkley & Neyland's Mom (Jun 14, 2004)

> _Originally posted by mylittlebella_@Jan 10 2005, 05:56 PM
> *Bella is 7 months and she's getting out of control.  I talked to a trainer today (vet recommended) and she's coming on Monday to re potty train and see how she's behaving with me.  Lately, to get my attention, she'll bite/pinch my leg.  I tell her "no" but she doesn't listen.  She poops every where and pees now where ever she feels.
> 
> She's charging me $95 for one day and then if I want to continue it will be another $500.  I don't have $500 right now but I'll save for it if it means chilling this doggie out
> ...


[/QUOTE]


 That is ALOT of money...the $500.00!!!! Good grief!!!! Let us know what that includes after you talk to her!!!!



> _Originally posted by SylphidesMom_@Jan 10 2005, 06:15 PM
> *I don't know whether you need to pay $500 to get her trained.  Have you tried obedience and agility classes?  They cost less than $100 for 6-8 weeks---I found a club with a wonderful trainer who trains and owns small breeds...
> 
> Sylphide was a maniac at that age.  She's can still be really hyper and bossy, but is very obedient now.  I took her to agility classes, which she LOVED, and they really helped focus her energy and make her more obedient.  We'll continue with agility in the Spring.
> <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=28853*


[/QUOTE]


How do you find agility classes/trainers? I would like to put Brink in some agility classes. That would be fun!!!!


----------



## nataliecmu (Aug 12, 2004)

> _Originally posted by mylittlebella_@Jan 10 2005, 07:25 PM
> *Lexi's mom...Bella does the same thing.  It's not biting but running her teeth.
> 
> She's not being aggresive at all its just to get my attention.  She did just get spayed but she was doing this before.  She was trained and she knows to go on the wee wee pads but it's like she does it on purpose to get my attention.  For example, today I came home for lunch and I was in the kitchen making a sandwich.  When I went to the dining table, and there was Bella waiting for me right next to her pee.  As soon as she saw me she ran under the table.  It's like a game to her.  She knows she's in trouble but she likes being in trouble for the attention.
> ...


[/QUOTE]


Bella sounds like me in HS. Of course, I wouldn't pee and sit next to it... I would smoke and wait for my mom to ask me if I was smoking... :new_Eyecrazy:


----------



## msmagnolia (Sep 8, 2004)

Good for you for getting some help NOW. We learned the hard way with a cocker spaniel that you have to have control. We treated her like a baby and she ruled our house. I was even kind of scared of her when she was snappy. I swore that when she died I would NEVER have another dog. It wasn't long before we were looking for our bichon but this time we did the research and made sure that we were the alpha at all times. I've never had one minutes trouble from her. We are doing the same with our puppies. Our methods are positive. We relied heavily on the Monks of New Skete. Please post after the trainer has been there. I'd really be interested to know what they have to say.


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> _Originally posted by msmagnolia_@Jan 11 2005, 02:07 PM
> *Good for you for getting some help NOW.  We learned the hard way with a cocker spaniel that you have to have control.  We treated her like a baby and she ruled our house.  I was even kind of scared of her when she was snappy.  I swore that when she died I would NEVER have another dog.  It wasn't long before we were looking for our bichon but this time we did the research and made sure that we were the alpha at all times.  I've never had one minutes trouble from her.  We are doing the same with our puppies.  Our methods are positive.  We relied heavily on the Monks of New Skete.  Please post after the trainer has been there.  I'd really be interested to know what they have to say.
> <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=29049*


[/QUOTE]

The same exact thing happened to me and Rosebud was snappy, too! My first Maltese was my first puppy and after the first day or two she turned in to Cujo and I didn't have a clue what to do! I was so discouraged that I almost gave her to a friend. It can be so overwhelming to have a puppy and not know how to deal with his/her issues.So, like in your case, she became the alpha... she was my beloved baby... but still alpha! I have learned so much since then... but gosh it's been 14 years.

I also used the Monks of New Skete books. _The Art of Raising a Puppy_ was not yet published, which is written by a former monk. I went back to the book recently and noticed that it talks about the alpha rollover and alpha shake but everything I've seen recently says not to do those techniques. I must admit, they didn't work for me at all. I didn't feel right doing them anyway and I swore I'd never use them on another dog. I was glad to see that they are out of favor now. Just as with raising children, etc., new techniques come in to vogue and others go out.


----------



## msmagnolia (Sep 8, 2004)

We never really had to do the rollover and the shake. We did use their suggestions for sleeping and keeping the dog right by us to help with house training. I don't think the rollover is really necessary for small dogs. I did notice on another board that someone who has a wolf rescue uses that method and is highly successful. Maybe it works better for big dogs.


----------



## Toby's Mom (May 7, 2004)




----------



## msmagnolia (Sep 8, 2004)

I can't find my copy of the book. We didn't use any physical punishment but I can't honestly remember if that was in there or not. What I recall that we did was a lot of bonding stuff with Jolie to make her part of our pack, but to insure that she knew that she was lower in the pack than the rest of us. I wish I could find the copy.


----------



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

I have the appointment on Monday with the trainer so I'll post and let you know what she says and does.


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> _Originally posted by msmagnolia_@Jan 11 2005, 04:12 PM
> *I can't find my copy of the book.  We didn't use any physical punishment but I can't honestly remember if that was in there or not.  What I recall that we did was a lot of bonding stuff with Jolie to make her part of our pack, but to insure that she knew that she was lower in the pack than the rest of us.  I wish I could find the copy.
> <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=29094*


[/QUOTE]

I'll be glad to look up anything for you... just let me know. The alpha roll and alpha shake aren't physical punishment... I would never ever do that... the alpha roll is where you roll them on their back and look them in the eye and the alpha shake is where you pick them up under the front paws and bring them to eye level and look them in the eye... in both cases the dog is supposed to turn away from you first, showing that you are alpha. It never worked for me and something about it just didn't feel "right."


----------



## Maxismom (Mar 24, 2004)

you might want to try this its incredible !! I have been having problems with maxi biting me and acting up when i put on his leash and coat he was running back and forth like a crazy boy when i went to put on his leash he would jump up and down on the couch off the couch biting me so on so forth well let me say this 
i think my maxi is brilliant lol all it took was shaking a can of coins twice and ever since sunday all i have to say to him is im going to get the "COINS" he does what i want. when i went over my moms the other day i showed her when he started to run around like a luny bird she couldnt believe it so now when he starts to get out of hand i say " OK IM GETTING THE COINS" and he behaves its unbleievable
he knows where i have them and he will try and jump up to see if the can is there
im shocked because i was about to take him to this behavior specialist that grooms at my vet and so far so good
he has been wonderful that it shocked the Cr*p out of me shows me how smart he is and that he does this on purpose
anyway ill keep you posted


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

The alpha roll is not effective and the wolf researcher who originally published on it found that his initial observation was wrong. I have seen video of a trainer who does it to a Dobie. The dog submits the first few times and then bites him in the face. 

The alpha never has to use physical force to assert his or herself. Submissive dogs actually roll over on their own in the presense of the alpha. The physical stuff is what you see from the lower dogs who are trying to assert themselves in the middle of the pack when they are insecure about their position. 

The BEST ever book for a new puppy owner is Jean Donaldson's The Culture Clash. It has a nice, simple explanation of learning theory and explains lots of misconceptions about training dogs. She also has step by step for training basic behaviors. 

Relationship building changes like Nothing in Life is Free will give you better results and make life a lot more pleasant.


----------



## msmagnolia (Sep 8, 2004)

JMM, Thanks for the tip on the book. I shall look for it right away.


----------



## k/c mom (Oct 9, 2004)

> _Originally posted by JMM_@Jan 11 2005, 09:30 PM
> *The BEST ever book for a new puppy owner is Jean Donaldson's The Culture Clash. It has a nice, simple explanation of learning theory and explains lots of misconceptions about training dogs. She also has step by step for training basic behaviors.
> 
> Relationship building changes like Nothing in Life is Free will give you better results and make life a lot more pleasant.
> <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=29171*


[/QUOTE]

Jackie, thanks so much for the info on the book. I just now ordered it from Amazon! It'll arrive by Friday... in time to read while on my trip.... Yea!!


----------



## 2happymalts (May 19, 2004)

How did the training go?????


----------



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

> _Originally posted by 2happymalts_@Jan 18 2005, 05:47 PM
> *How did the training go?????
> <div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=30219*


[/QUOTE]


She was great. She gave me so many tips on the potty training as well as how to handle Bella when she gets out of control and barks at anything. She also mentioned that if I didn't have the $ for private lessons that she does a group obidence class at the "Dog Bar" (it's a little doggie boutique) and they charge $159 for 6 weeks (once a week class) so I signed up. She was really good so I figured Bella would get something out of the classes. 

I started doing all the things the trainer said to do and so far she's doing better. She's listening to me more than before. She told me not to repeat myself to her to just tell her something and stare at her until she does it and it works. So now I'm not yelling, sit Bella, sit Bella, I SAID SIT BELLA. I just tell her Bella sit and stare and she does it 90% of the times. When she doesn't do it and I'm sitting then I stand up and she'll do it. I'll keep you guys posted.


----------



## Ladysmom (Oct 19, 2004)

Good for Bella! And good for you for tackling her behaviorial issues early on rather than waiting until they turn into big problems.

Obedience is fun, too, isn't it? It's such a positive bonding experience for both of you. Most dogs really do want to please us and sometimes we just have to learn to help them learn acceptable behevior.

I'm glad you found a less expensive group class, too. Keep us posted on Bella's progress.


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

I'm glad you are so pleased with your experience! I hope things continue to improve!


----------



## msmagnolia (Sep 8, 2004)

Good for you! I think that I'll look into a trainer in my area, too. Please update us about your progress.


----------



## Sylphide and Shrek's Mom (Dec 4, 2004)

> _Originally posted by tlunn_@Jan 11 2005, 02:49 PM
> *How do you find agility classes/trainers? I would like to put Brink in some agility classes. That would be fun!!!!
> 
> 
> ...


[/QUOTE]

Sorry I didn't answer this earlier--I've been really busy at work.

I asked around - I have a few colleagues who are breeders and they know all the dog affiliated groups in the area. Although there is a dedicated canine recreational facility in the town I live in, I drive about 25 miles to attend the Kennel Club trainings in a nearby town. They have a really nice facility, are friendly and informal, and the classes are really fun. Plus, the trainer has small breed experience and is wonderful with Sylphide. Sylphide loves agility, and took to the obstacles like a duck to water. It was funny to see her all confident and tiny as a puppy, gleefully tacking the dog walk, A frame, and other obstacles that terrified the big dogs. The other tiny dog, a griffon mix, was very good, and she and he were "buddies". although Sylphide was also good friends with all the big dogs, including the huge German Shepherd who kept attacking the labradors. 

Agility does wonders for their confidence and social skills. But most of all, it's so much fun!


----------



## Brinkley & Neyland's Mom (Jun 14, 2004)

> _Originally posted by SylphidesMom+Jan 19 2005, 10:12 PM-->
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sorry I didn't answer this earlier--I've been really busy at work.

I asked around - I have a few colleagues who are breeders and they know all the dog affiliated groups in the area. Although there is a dedicated canine recreational facility in the town I live in, I drive about 25 miles to attend the Kennel Club trainings in a nearby town. They have a really nice facility, are friendly and informal, and the classes are really fun. Plus, the trainer has small breed experience and is wonderful with Sylphide. Sylphide loves agility, and took to the obstacles like a duck to water. It was funny to see her all confident and tiny as a puppy, gleefully tacking the dog walk, A frame, and other obstacles that terrified the big dogs. The other tiny dog, a griffon mix, was very good, and she and he were "buddies". although Sylphide was also good friends with all the big dogs, including the huge German Shepherd who kept attacking the labradors. 

Agility does wonders for their confidence and social skills. But most of all, it's so much fun!
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=30473
[/B][/QUOTE]

I am quite sure we probably don't have anything like that around my po-dunk area







. One of the downsides of living in the rural areas...I would probably have to look in the bigger cities like Nashville and Memphis that are 2+ hours away. -_- Thanks for the info though!


----------



## jmm (Nov 23, 2004)

> > > How do you find agility classes/trainers? I would like to put Brink in some agility classes. That would be fun!!!!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ...


----------



## Tavish (Feb 5, 2005)

Oh, reading about how little Bella progressed so quickly with her training is wonderful!







I was going to start a training class, but all of the other dogs were much bigger than Tavish, so we opted for in house private training. I researched many different styles of training, and felt that operant conditioning was the most suitable for Tavish, but it took a little while to find a trainer I felt was right. I started his training at about 4.5 months of age.
I definitely agree with JMM... she said, "The best methods are positive motivational ones."








These two books were very helpful: 
1) Don't Shoot the Dog; Karen Pryor
2) The Other End of the Leash; Patricia McConnell 
While Tavish is not incredibly food motivated, the training was a smashing success. Our "coach" taught me the necessary skills to train Tavish, and I use them everyday. She is also available to call any time we need help, and stopped in the other day to visit. (I think she fell in love with Tav and misses him







.) 
Good luck with the group training class... I wish we could have done that as Tavish doesn't really get to spend too much time with other dogs, and that would have been a wonderful opportunity for him to socialize more.


----------



## westiemaltese (Jan 23, 2005)

An excellent book that I recommend is The Dog Listener by Jan Fennell, it lets you understand your dog and how to teach it while always using positive things only. It is definately a worthwhile book and her methods work


----------



## mylittlebella (Aug 20, 2004)

Glad to hear Tavish is doing so well. Bella's class had big dogs and little dogs and actually the German Shepperd kinda likes Bella. It's too funny!

I couldn't afford the private classes as the trainer was asking $575 (Something like that) but these are working for me and I was able to afford them!


----------

